I usually don’t frequent this place too much, but this incident is frightening. Are we not allowed to have a difference of opinion anymore with a politician?
Also, someone sent me the link or I would never have seen it. I don’t read The Progressive at all and didn’t know it existed before I saw this.
–Dave
Um, so what exactly is the problem here?
These “girls” apparently wanted to voice their opinions in “public”. Not only that, but they might have made someone uncomfortable if they were to voice these opinions.
Dude, give it up. We don’t live in some place where just anyone can walk up to their senator and have an adverse view to their ideals. This is America. We just don’t allow that kind of pinko-communist attitude here.
Love it or leave it… sheesh.
I’m not seeing the issue here. When a senator is working on in the capacity of their private profession (author) in a professional fashion (book signing) why should people be allowed to disrupt said profession? I’m not aware of any constituitional right to make a scene on the premises of a business. I am aware that our laws allow a business to have people removed when they make a scene.
This is how things have always worked in this country. Nothing to see here, move along.
“Your business is not wanted here. They don’t want you here anymore. If you don’t leave, you’re going to be arrested. If you can’t post bail, you’ll go to prison. Those of you who are under 18 will go to Ferris [the juvenile detention center]. And those of you over 18 will go either to Gander Hill Prison or the woman’s correctional facility. Any questions?”
Yeah, that’s bullshit. I haven’t met any cops who give a brief civics lesson when telling someone to leave a store. I have met a lot of activists who like to hilariously overexaggerate what happened to them.
My sarcasm aside, I do have to agree with the previous posters.
Santorum is obviously a delusional douchebag, but this is a private function on private property.
If these people went to jail for causing a scene it would be completely legal… given that they were told to leave the store by the management. Not the best looking PR move, but there is no wrong-doing here by the store.
At Barnes & Noble’s headquarters, Mary Ellen Keating, senior vice president for corporate communications and public affairs, gave this account.
“I spoke to the assistant manager, and what she told me was that the store management was not consulted on how the situation was managed,” she says. “A state policeman, without consulting management, removed these students from the store.”
At Barnes & Noble’s headquarters, Mary Ellen Keating, senior vice president for corporate communications and public affairs, gave this account.
“I spoke to the assistant manager, and what she told me was that the store management was not consulted on how the situation was managed,” she says. “A state policeman, without consulting management, removed these students from the store.”
[/quote]
Yup. Reading comprehension is good.
–Dave
At Barnes & Noble’s headquarters, Mary Ellen Keating, senior vice president for corporate communications and public affairs, gave this account.
“I spoke to the assistant manager, and what she told me was that the store management was not consulted on how the situation was managed,” she says. “A state policeman, without consulting management, removed these students from the store.”
[/quote]
Yup. Reading comprehension is good.
–Dave[/quote]
Can we see an actual, credible news source for this?
Because progressive.org is a bit of a left-leaning site.
And unlike most of these right-wing mouthbreathers who eat (edit: breathe) up anything that the talking points throw to them, I’d like to see the factual base of this one.
Private property or not, if there is not an effective outlet for debate in this country then non-effective outlets can and should be employed.
Schedule regular public debates and THEN you can have your “supportive” yes-man book signings.
When a senator is working on in the capacity of their private profession (author) in a professional fashion (book signing) why should people be allowed to disrupt said profession?
He’s perfectly within his rights to get them hauled off, the same as any other author, but he also has to take the PR hit as someone who can’t deal with criticism.
Why is it his right to get people hauled off? Certainly the store has a right to eject people from their property, but it doesn’t seem like the store was in the loop here. Did the store owners give him that authority as a condition of his appearance? Is that normal?
[quote=“Mike Jamieson”]
Why is it his right to get people hauled off? Certainly the store has a right to eject people from their property, but it doesn’t seem like the store was in the loop here. Did the store owners give him that authority as a condition of his appearance? Is that normal?[/quote]
I’ve never worked at a bookstore, but I did work at various fast food joints in high school and college. Those fast food places would often employ an off-duty cop (in full uniform) as a security guard for the rowdier post-midnight crowds on friday and saturday. Usually the security guard didn’t solicit any input from management or employees at all, he just took care of people who acted up.
I’m wondering if this isn’t the same situation, where a secrurity guard has implicit approval to deal with rowdies.
That delaware online link makes it sound pretty ridiculous to me. Someone said something about having him sign a book by a gay author, so what? They apparently hadn’t caused a disturbance, they were only overheard by a Santorum lackey who then decided to do something about it. The punishment that they got for that little comment certainly doesn’t fit the “crime.” In my opinion, if Santorum just wanted to sign a bunch of books and have everyone pump his ego, he shouldn’t have billed it as a “book signing and discussion.” To me, reading “discussion” means that he’s willing to talk to people from both sides of his views.
As for the PR hit, it means nothing for this guy. He’s extreme right, and the people who support him will applaud him for showin’ them pinko lefties who’s boss. Anyone who doesn’t already dislike him isn’t going to change their mind over this.
I guess I would have no concerns about the incident if the guard were hired by the store, and acted on his own initiative (presumably having implicit approval to do so). The owners have authority over their property and they delegate that to the guard.
That second link though, seems to state that the off-duty cop was part of Santorum’s team. The bookstore claims it was Santorum’s security that threw these people out. So how does Santorum or his guard get the authority to decide who can be there?
If the store says they weren’t in the loop, and seems to disavow responsibility, then it starts to seem as though the cop was exceeding his authority. That’s why I want to know if there’s some arrangment where the store gives the author that power at a booksigning. I’d like it to be very clear that the guard’s authority derives from the property rights of the merchant, not the “I’m important enough to have my own security team” rights of Santorum.
Another interesting twist is that in some states law enforcement powers don’t end when a cop gets off shift. This is why off duty cops are desirable as security guards, they really CAN arrest people. The story makes it sound as if this is the case in Delaware.
So now we have a third interesting legal possibility, that the guard’s authority to lean on these girls stems from being an officer of the law and seeing someone breaking a law.
What law were they breaking, though? They hadn’t done anything, and if the store didn’t ask them to leave, then the cop had no authority to do so. The police can’t just throw someone out of a private establishment if that person has done nothing wrong. The store manager could have asked them to leave, and asked the cop to escort them out if they refused, but that doesn’t seem to be the case here. It sounds like this cop stepped way over the line.
I do agree that the cop stepped way over the line, assuming the accounts in the article about what happened are true. I’m not defending the cop, he was obviously being a dick, just trying to point out there is no need to get into conspiracy-theory territory here. There was no sinister plot to persecute people with anti-Santorum opinions, just one cop who felt like playing cowboy.
Fair enough, though I guess there is the question of why the cop was there in the first place (because Santorum hired him, allegedly). I wasn’t aware that it was common to have a police presence at a book signing, even for a US senator.
Fair enough, though I guess there is the question of why the cop was there in the first place (because Santorum hired him, allegedly). I wasn’t aware that it was common to have a police presence at a book signing, even for a US senator.[/quote]
Rowling (sp? The Harry Potter author) was at a local book signing and there were a couple of cops working the store. Some nut came in and started shouting about evil devil worship or some such crap and they each took him by an elbow and briskly escorted him out of the store. To a nice round of applause. No request by management; I think they just assume their job is to maintain some semblence of order during the signings.