3136

The paranoia is setting in.

3137

Multiple Muslim countries have had women leaders. Pakistan elected a woman as Prime Minister (head of the democratic system and the person running the country in Pakistan parliamentary system) twice. The first woman speaker of National Assembly in Pakistan was also only a couple of year behind Pelosi. Bangladesh currently has a female Prime Minister… Turkey and Indonesia had in the past as well.

This doesn’t mean that in countries like Pakistan, it’s all roses and sunshine regarding women’s rights, similar to how Obama’s election didn’t end the race debate in US. However it does mean that there is no systemic and constitutional clause against women ascending such seats of powers in these Muslim majority countries.

Of course places like Saudi Arabia operate differently.

So, yes “that” comic is idiotic at best, and offensive at worst.

3138

You didn’t watch the video.

3139

Yes, I didn’t. Ok, I’ll watch it later and decide if I need to de-lurk and respond. :)

3140

Every single country where Islam holds a majority is a reactionary shithole that is a living hell for minorities.

The common factor isnt “governments”.

3141

Obviously I can’t speak for all leftists, but for me the issue isn’t that Islam is somehow some perfectly progressive religion. It’s not and there are numerous examples that illustrate this. (Personally I find (most) religions pretty awful, but I won’t go into it.)

The point is, being a Muslim doesn’t axiomatically make you a jihadist terrorist. I suspect that bigots who profess a fear of terrorism and say they just “want to keep Americans safe” really aren’t that afraid of it, either.

Edit: After watching “Dirty Wars” on Netflix the other night, I’m now convinced the “War on Terror” will never end.
And Bannon in charge of JSOC is beyond terrifying.

3142

I’m curious. I wonder how many people who are afraid of jihadist terrorists have actually ever met a Muslim or had any sort of personal relationship with one? I just spent several weeks in a Muslim-majority country and never once did I fear that someone would call me a chink or yell at me to return to my own country. I wish I could say the same in all the time that I’ve lived here in America.

3143

This is my reply to RoyalWe:

3144

How many Trump supporters are there in totality? How many Trump supporters would espouse what that one woman did? 1%? 5%? 10%? 25%? 90%? 100%? I’m sure there is some percentage (Hillary would say half), but to me this is NOT a funny comic. What purpose does it serve? Is it to get a good “har har” from the liberal community here? If it’s to point out ignorance, well that’s exactly what my comic did.

How many Muslims are there in totality? How many Muslims fit the description of being both homophobic and dismissive of women? 1%? 5%? 10%? 25%? 90%? 100%? How many liberals have also taken the same care not to call bullshit and be deferential to Muslims who have those beliefs? 1%? 5%? 10%? 25%? 90%? 100%? Please don’t tell me it’s zero because I know some personally who have taken this stance.

I submit there are more of the latter than there are of the former. You can say both are offensive, but the latter should be more offensive to you because they are religious tenents practiced by a segment of that society. It is purposeful and, as much as you would like to minimize its significance, it is real.

My Muslim friends are the ones who tell me that we must vet extremely because they don’t want “bad Muslims” ruining what “good Muslims” have cultivated over the past decades in America. They are business owners, are good people, and are doing quite well. My children play soccer with their children. They also have family who live in France and they say that they would not want to live there because the Muslim community does not want to assimilate into French society and they have to behave differently when they are there so as not to be shunned by others. Is it possible that they are just telling me this because they want to be known as “good Muslims” (pro-America)? I guess it’s possible, but I take them at their word.

3145

My reply to @Teiman is that reasonable Western conservatives would have explained their position more fully to express their welcoming of all religious beliefs except those which patently infringe upon others rights.

3146

https://www.change.org/p/donald-trump-the-united-states-is-a-christian-nation

Christians are being bashed, forbidden to pray and even fired from their jobs, just because of their Christian beliefs. Christian symbols are being removed, monuments smashed and crosses destroyed because Jesus-haters want them gone.
The media, Hollywood elitists, liberal politicians, left-wing professors and revisionist historians are determined to destroy the great Christian foundations of this country.

3147

Have you actually probed your Muslim friends on what’s required to enter the US? Do any of them feel it was too easy and they were not properly screened?

Edit - spelling, punctuation

3148

No. I will see them next weekend and will ask.

3149

I feel like the election of Trump proved the US wasn’t a Christian nation. I mean the guy embodies how many of the 7 deadly sins?

3150

All of them:

Lust
Gluttony
Greed
Sloth
Wrath
Envy
Pride

3151

@RoyalWe

I don’t talk about “good something” because thats a bad narrative. Who set the standards? is the standard lineal, or you could be a bad something for some stuff but better at other stuff?.

I think is a bad narrative, it help makes thing simpler than they are, so distort reality.

I don’t think talking about good french, or good programmers, or good muslims is a good idea.

Even a “bad french” is still 100% a french. Thats a bad way to think.

Totalitarians think this is the only way the world can exist, but is the mistake, a really bad use of the brain to understand the world.

3152

I never understood how people can call America a Christian nation when we hate the poor so much.

3153

Because they mean White Europeans and that is just code. At least as large of a percentage of Black Americans are Christian than White Americans and probably it is the larger group.

The people who talk about this being a Christian Nation would claim a White Atheist before a Black Protestant.

3154

I would offer that it’s more about the fact that they’re theocracies, rather than real democracies, that leads to the problem.

It’s the tyranical nature of the government which causes issues… because there are plenty of governments which are not islamic, which are still shitty places for the people who live under them.

3155

Here’s the thing about questions like that. Turn the clock back 50 years in this country and replace “Jordan” with “Northern States” and “Qatar” with “Southern States” and you’d probably have numbers pretty similar on all those questions.

You can’t expect the entire world to progress at the same rate as the most developed nations. Exposure to new ideas and new cultures brings with it eventual acceptance and assimilation of those ideas and cultures. Most majority Muslim countries in the world today have had little exposure to ideas and cultures outside their own until very recently, and even then it’s usually come in the form of Western influence in their government or through military action, not the best ways to convince a suspicious populace that your ideology is benign. Change like that has to come from within, and it is, albeit slowly. Countries like Iran and Jordan are far more accepting of women taking on roles of responsibility and leadership than they were even a decade ago. The Arab Spring may have failed as a revolution against the state, but the ideals that sparked it are still present.

Majority Muslim countries will become more progressive as time goes on, their younger generations will see to it. It’s an ironic parallel to our own issue here in America, where aging Boomers and their parents still exert enough political control that we have Trump in the Oval Office and a Christian State happening in North Carolina, but these are the dying gasps of a stubborn segment desperate to hang onto “the good old days” when 90% of the faces around you looked just like yours and you didn’t have to watch what you said out in public.