Presidential Race 2016

[Timex]

Is there where I get a to point out that just because you have a black friend doesn’t mean you you’re not racists or do you intend to go go through a list of every woman he’s ever encountered. He’s married too. He apparently knows who Taylor Swift is as well, maybe he’s a fan even.

But he doesn’t just have a friend who is a woman.

He appointed a woman to the supreme Court of Ohio.

That doesn’t really mesh well with some notion that he’s a sexist.

But honestly whatever. You do your thing.

[Timex]

Man, CNN keeps doing a thing where they go and ask people from all the states just prior to their primaries/caucuses, and no one freaking KNOWS who anyone is other than trump. They can’t recognize any of the candidates, or even know their names even after they are told. They can’t even recognize people like Biden when shown.

We deserve what we get folks, people are dumb as rocks.

Bring on the Trumpocalypse.

[Nesrie]

But he doesn’t just have a friend who is a woman.

He appointed a woman to the supreme Court of Ohio.

That doesn’t really mesh well with some notion that he’s a sexist.

But honestly whatever. You do your thing.

He made sexist remarks on multiple occasions. But if you actually read what I said, I don’t consider him a moderate because a variety of reasons including questions about his stance on women. Do you have anything that would suggest his man is actually a moderate or are you just stuck on thinking his sexist remarks auto made him a conservative instead of his stance on reforming Social Security, on defunding Planned Parenthood, his weird remarks to young women at his rallies as well as weird and definitely sexist remarks also at these rallies, dropping Medicaid funding on… you guessed it, some very important women-based kind of coverage like pregnancy, breast and cervical cancer, and cutting school budgets… what exactly is moderate about him He’s not moderate fiscally or socially.

[Timex]

My statements pointing out how your suggestion of his being a sexist is silly is focused just on that… Because the statement had nothing to do with his being a moderate or not. The only reason to bring it up at all is some weak attempt to paint him as some kind of secret sexist (who, again, seemingly ignores his secret sexism when hiring people or making appointments, but, neither here nor there)

In terms of his being a moderate, I would actually tend to describe Kasich as a pragmatic conservative.

He holds conservative positions, but does not cling to them dogmatically.

For instance, while he generally supports the notion of smaller government, he does not cling to this idea irrationally the way that someone like Ted Cruz does. He increased spending in Ohio, but increased revenues more, while simultaneously cutting taxes. The end result was a much better overall position from a budgetary perspective.

Likewise, while he isn’t a huge fan of the government expanding its role in healthcare, he justified the expansion of Medicaid in Ohio with an eminently practical reason… That it saved money to do so. Investing money to help the poor, homeless, and mentally ill actually ends up saving the state money, because it’s a case of pay me now or pay me later. Either help those folks up front, or pay the higher costs to deal with the aftermath down the road. In general, his consideration for the poor and acknowledging the role of government in helping them would perhaps be considered moderate in today’s political climate, although I would suggest that it’s simply reasonable, in a field where everyone else has gone to crazy extremes.

Ultimately, Kasich has a record of simply getting shit done and improving things. But I’d say he’s still definitely a conservative.

[Destarius]

At this point, anyone but Trump or Cruz.

[Nesrie]

My statements pointing out how your suggestion of his being a sexist is silly is focused just on that… Because the statement had nothing to do with his being a moderate or not. The only reason to bring it up at all is some weak attempt to paint him as some kind of secret sexist (who, again, seemingly ignores his secret sexism when hiring people or making appointments, but, neither here nor there)

In terms of his being a moderate, I would actually tend to describe Kasich as a pragmatic conservative.

He holds conservative positions, but does not cling to them dogmatically.

For instance, while he generally supports the notion of smaller government, he does not cling to this idea irrationally the way that someone like Ted Cruz does. He increased spending in Ohio, but increased revenues more, while simultaneously cutting taxes. The end result was a much better overall position from a budgetary perspective.

Likewise, while he isn’t a huge fan of the government expanding its role in healthcare, he justified the expansion of Medicaid in Ohio with an eminently practical reason… That it saved money to do so. Investing money to help the poor, homeless, and mentally ill actually ends up saving the state money, because it’s a case of pay me now or pay me later. Either help those folks up front, or pay the higher costs to deal with the aftermath down the road. In general, his consideration for the poor and acknowledging the role of government in helping them would perhaps be considered moderate in today’s political climate, although I would suggest that it’s simply reasonable, in a field where everyone else has gone to crazy extremes.

Ultimately, Kasich has a record of simply getting shit done and improving things. But I’d say he’s still definitely a conservative.

It’s not silly. Taking away funding from Planned Parenthood, shrinking Medicaid in a way that pulls funding from pregnant women, women with cancer, mocking young women at rallies while not doing the same with young men, making weird comments about women in kitchens… You certainly don’t have to agree with me, but those are all issues that I think suggest he doesn’t take women seriously. I link these stances into one bucket relating to women. You don’t have to agree with me, but just because you don’t agree with me does not make the idea “silly”.

His expansion of Medicaid was for ACA money,. While overall an expansion he cut women health. His record has him as a conservative, and just being to the left the other crazies in the GOP races does not make you are moderate.

So again, i don’t think he is a moderate, and I think he has a number of problems that make him unattractive as a candidate for anyone who is a moderate or more liberally inclined.

[Timex]

It’s fine for you to think that.

It’s unlikely that Kasich would attract liberals, as he is not far to the left. But he does in fact have quite a lot of support from moderates.

The reality is though, there are a number of issues that he is conservative on. But he tends to deal with them in a pragmatic way.

It’s kind of hard to truly have no position on issues at all, so there aren’t really any politicians who hold no positions which are either conservative or liberal.

But Kasich has shown a willingness to actually work with those who disagree with him, and forge a workable path forward.

Whether you want to try and label him a moderate doesn’t really matter. It’s just a word.

[Nesrie]

It’s fine for you to think that.

It’s unlikely that Kasich would attract liberals, as he is not far to the left. But he does in fact have quite a lot of support from moderates.

The reality is though, there are a number of issues that he is conservative on. But he tends to deal with them in a pragmatic way.

It’s kind of hard to truly have no position on issues at all, so there aren’t really any politicians who hold no positions which are either conservative or liberal.

But Kasich has shown a willingness to actually work with those who disagree with him, and forge a workable path forward.

Whether you want to try and label him a moderate doesn’t really matter. It’s just a word.

It does matter because that’s the label that some of the media is applying to him. It’s not something I just woke up with one day. I don’t require him to have no position, to but take a moderate label and have it ring true, it seems he would need to have some liberal stances which i don’t see. Expanding Medicaid in one area and cutting in another while receiving additional federal dollars for his state does not make him a moderate. Taking less hardcore conservative stances but still taking a conservative stance also does not make him a moderate… so I question the idea that some are posing that he’s a moderate… which was the reason I brought up my original statement. Which was a direct reply to this statement:

I know this guy is a conservative in moderate-clothing

[Timex]

Who do you believe is a moderate?

[Nesrie]

Who do you believe is a moderate?

In this election year, I am not sure there is one.

in the past, I mean no one is perfect but I thought McCain was pretty close. I haven’t followed in the past years, but previously you could actually look at his voting record and his statements see where he breaks with party lines. He didn’t just circle the wagons and rubber stamp everything his party said. And I am not talking about his view necessarily aligning with mine only that he will cross the line.

[Timex]

In this election year, I am not sure there is one.

in the past, I mean no one is perfect but I thought McCain was pretty close. I haven’t followed in the past years, but previously you could actually look at his voting record and his statements see where he breaks with party lines. He didn’t just circle the wagons and rubber stamp everything his party said. And I am not talking about his view necessarily aligning with mine only that he will cross the line.

So you realize that Kasich also fought with members of his own party, right?

In terms of McCain, he also opposes funding of planned parenthood. Going so far as to threaten shutting down the government if it were not defunded at the end of last year.

As you say, no one is perfect. I suspect that by the metric you are suggesting that Kasich is not a moderate, you may have a hard time actually finding anyone who would actually fit the bill.

[Nesrie]

So you realize that Kasich also fought with members of his own party, right?

In terms of McCain, he also opposes funding of planned parenthood. Going so far as to threaten shutting down the government if it were not defunded at the end of last year.

As you say, no one is perfect. I suspect that by the metric you are suggesting that Kasich is not a moderate, you may have a hard time actually finding anyone who would actually fit the bill.

Do you even read what I post? Did you see the part where I said I haven’t followed McCain and used the word “was”? If you’re not going to bother to read what I write, then I am not going to converse with you. You have a tendency to dive bomb in the middle of conversations, accuse people of things and just go silent when you’re done. The least you can do is read the part where I am indicating in the past… and just in case you weren’t sure, about 8 years in the past.

[Timex]

McCain has pretty much always been pro life, fighting against planned parenthood since… I dunno, forever.

I asked you who fit the bill for a moderate, to see who that might be. I would actually tend to agree that McCain is kind of a moderate, but he kind of fails the litmus test that you used on Kasich, due his consistent opposition to funding for planned parenthood.

This isn’t really a trick question, I was genuinely curious as to who you thought WAS a moderate, given that you didn’t think Kasich was.

[Nesrie]

McCain has pretty much always been pro life, fighting against planned parenthood since… I dunno, forever.

I asked you who fit the bill for a moderate, to see who that might be. I would actually tend to agree that McCain is kind of a moderate, but he kind of fails the litmus test that you used on Kasich, due his consistent opposition to funding for planned parenthood.

This isn’t really a trick question, I was genuinely curious as to who you thought WAS a moderate, given that you didn’t think Kasich was.

Yeah taking a stance on one liberal issue doesn’t make him not a moderate. taking a stance on planned parenthood was also not the reason I don’t think Kasic is a moderate either. What liberal stance do you think Kasich actually supports? Kasich is pro-life, anti marriage equality (mostly), doen’t support anti-discrimination laws, is anti choice for women, defunds public education, lowers funding for access to healthcare for women, is for a balanced budget seemingly regardless of the status of the overall economy, mostly for the death penalty, against legalizing the less harmful drugs, wants to push charter schools,supports fracking, somewhat dabbles in trying to regulat entertainment (doesn’t like today’s R/PG standards), wants to do heavier checks on refugees (not sure these people are showing up with paperwork at this point), very much a let the states do federal government out, opposes Obamacare… just because but otherwise sort of wants to support healthcare (no real plan), not a supporter of raising the minimum wage, wants to lower social security benefits (they’ll get over it), opposes the estate tax…

the only two things he might be floating on the border about are some stances on immigration, but i don’t think he supports a pathway to citizenship, he has mentioned corporate welfare and he might support taxes for the wealthy but at the same time drops them for small businesses.

Keep in mind, these are not my stances… these are just what i see as somewhat generic liberal stances. the guy is just not moderate.

[arrendek]

Would you boys kindly get back in the kitchen and keep the fighting to a minimum?

Edit: /s

[Tim_N]

You guys are using the wrong M-word for Mccain.

[ShivaX]

So apparently Trump got to pick his questions on Morning Joe. Journalism at it’s finest.

Leaked Audio Catches Mika and Joe Chatting With Trump During Break: ‘Nothing Too...

[MrGrumpy]

There aren’t really any moderate* Republicans left - those that are left are primarily in the north east (and maybe CA.) That Kasich is viewed by many as moderate exemplifies how far right the Republican party has moved. When the Republicans won the House in the 90’s, Kasich was then considered the right wing of the party. He can however be characterized as a rational Republican. Would that be enough for him to veto a large number of crazy bills passed by the House? Probably not.

*This also depends on how moderate is defined. From a political science perspective, Trump is a moderate: Far right on immigration, more liberal on health care and entitlements (SS, Medicaid.)

Edit to add:

So apparently Trump got to pick his questions on Morning Joe. Journalism at it’s finest.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/leaked-audio-catches-mika-and-joe-chatting-with-trump-during-break-nothing-too-hard-mika/

Holy crap.

[Dan_Theman]

There aren’t really any moderate* Republicans left - those that are left are primarily in the north east (and maybe CA.) That Kasich is viewed by many as moderate exemplifies how far right the Republican party has moved. When the Republicans won the House in the 90’s, Kasich was then considered the right wing of the party. He can however be characterized as a rational Republican. Would that be enough for him to veto a large number of crazy bills passed by the House? Probably not.

*This also depends on how moderate is defined. From a political science perspective, Trump is a moderate: Far right on immigration, more liberal on health care and entitlements (SS, Medicaid.)

Edit to add:

Holy crap.

Ethics in journalism … yeesh. I’m sure that a lot of those types of discussions take place on many shows, but that’s really disturbing to listen to how the sausage is being made, so to speak.

[Telefrog]

It happens all the time. I’m not saying it’s okay, but this sort of “backstage” host/guest negotiation for questions is pretty common with these kinds of talk shows.