As with most of our comic book movie podcasts, we have two people who enjoyed themselves immensely and one naysayer.
A wonderful podcast opening.
In addition to what Tom said, I think a movie coming from Disney carries a positive manufactured outrage modifier. And DC movies had been so bad that nobody cared to bother with Wonder Woman.
Tom is probably right that some of the “controversy” and review-bombing for Captain Marvel is just the same nonsense Wonder Woman had but with the agitators being even better at stirring up outrage than in 2017.
But Brie Larson specifically put herself in the crosshairs of these jerks by being a pretty cool person. I think a lot of the manufactured outrage was directed at the way she handled press, as explained in this interview with marie claire:
Keah Brown: I was thrilled you requested me to interview you. I thought, ‘This is game-changing’. It’s the biggest opportunity I’ve had. Nobody usually wants to take a chance on a disabled journalist. I’d love to know what your particular reasons were.
Brie Larson: About a year ago, I started paying attention to what my press days looked like and the critics reviewing movies, and noticed it appeared to be overwhelmingly white male. So, I spoke to Dr. Stacy Smith at the USC Annenberg Inclusion Initiative, who put together a study to confirm that. Moving forward, I decided to make sure my press days were more inclusive. After speaking with you, the film critic Valerie Complex and a few other women of colour, it sounded like across the board they weren’t getting the same opportunities as others. When I talked to the facilities that weren’t providing it, they all had different excuses.
KB: And people don’t realise how vast the disabled community is. It isn’t just white men in wheelchairs. Some of us don’t use mobility aids, others use them part-time; some disabilities are visible, others are physical but invisible. I find it so hard to see people in this industry who look like me, so if I have any sort of visibility or notoriety, I can lift somebody else up.
BL: I want to go out of my way to connect the dots. It just took me using the power that I’ve been given now as Captain Marvel. [The role] comes with all these privileges and powers that make me feel uncomfortable because I don’t really need them.
The idiots online really latched on to this, and also went back to remarks Larson made about A Wrinkle In Time:
The Oscar award-winning actress advocated for more diversity during a speech given at Wednesday night’s Women in Film Crystal + Lucy Awards in Los Angeles by citing data from USC’s Annenberg Inclusion Initiative. According to the study, in 2017, only 2.5% of top critics were women of color, while 80% of film critics who reviewed the year’s top box-office movies were male. To highlight her point, Larson referenced A Wrinkle in Time ‘s critical reception.
“I don’t need a 40-year-old white dude to tell me what didn’t work about A Wrinkle in Time ,” Larson said. “It wasn’t made for him! I want to know what it meant to women of color, biracial women, to teen women of color.”
Larson elaborated on this point, saying that it wasn’t about excluding white men, but including those who have historically been marginalized.
“Am I saying I hate white dudes? No, I am not. What I am saying is if you make a movie that is a love letter to women of color, there is an insanely low chance a woman of color will have a chance to see your movie, and review your movie.”
(Article at Time)
So basically the fragile egos and people who feed off outrage online really latched onto these aspects of Brie Larson’s relationship with the film critics and the press and through both the intentional and accidental misrepresentation the internet is prone to, you end up with people convinced Brie Larson told them Captain Marvel wasn’t for white guys.
I think that all played a big part in the failed attempt to review-bomb and tank the box office.
Oh, I should’ve quoted this from the Time article too, just because I really like this quote from Larson:
“It really sucks that reviews matter – but reviews matter,” she said. “Good reviews out of festivals give small, independent films a fighting chance to be bought and seen. Good reviews help films gross money, good reviews slingshot films into awards contenders. A good review can change your life. It changed mine.”
Ah, that’s all news to me, since I don’t follow press junket stuff. But good for her! Now I like Captain Marvel even more. And now I’m curious about Wrinkle in Time. I assumed it was just YA fantasy silliness.
Also, props to Disney for letting her speak out like that. If they really wanted her to just lie low, they probably could have made sure it happened. Seems to me the success of things like Black Panther and Wonder Woman are sending a message that there’s a lot public goodwill – and commercial success – for inclusive storytelling.
-Tom
And Fast and Furious. The best superhero universe. Cmon, Tom.
Wrinkle in Time could still be YA fantasy silliness, I haven’t seen it either but I have my suspicions. That could be true and still not invalidate what she’s saying though.
But what changed since Ripley in Alien and the first two Terminators? Did I miss some pivotal male nerd all-hands meeting? There was no incel outcry over those at the time, or did they just not have social media to whine over back in the day?
In all honesty, I would’ve expected more backlash from other quarters that a hot invincible blonde isn’t sufficiently inclusive. As opposed to “Shooting hand-CG is dicks only.” What an embarrassing hill to die on.
They hadn’t been weaponized by Steve Bannon and monetized by YouTube yet.
EDIT:
I’m going to expand on what I said. YouTube is a major contributor to this. If you’re a content creator on YouTube, you need to make a video that speaks to whatever is trending at the moment to get into the recommendations algorithm.
I saw last night that Angry Joe did a Captain Marvel review, and it was #57 on the trending videos (on Sunday night, it was probably higher earlier). Jim Sterling touched on this when he did videos on Anthem. He didn’t give a shit about the game, but trashing it was raking in views and revenue because people were watching it.
This whole thing was a manufactured controversy in social media and streaming circles and it turned into a feeding frenzy of hot-takes and other bullshit. It’s over now, and we’ll move on to the next make-believe Internet crisis.
Sure hope the next one’s less boring. Sheesh.
November 8, 2016.
-Tom
That’s just a symptom of what changed, not the change in itself. After all, similar movements (including a certain Gate concerning Gamers) predate 2016 by a lot.
I’m with Kelly on the use of music - I thought the needle drops were borderline Suicide Squad level in how thuddingly obvious they were, and they have no grounding in the character, it’s just to signal THIS IS THE 90:S as loudly as possible.
I didn’t hate the movie though – if the cast was worse, I might’ve, but they elevate every moment they can, and it has some neat moments. It’s the kinda flat but fine franchise entry Marvel can seemingly put out in their sleep.
“Captain Marvel didn’t shoot enough CG and misogynist trolls have really let themselves go.” - Kelly Wand, 2019
Tom I kept hoping you would bring up Taika Waititi and his unique vision/voice for Thor Ragnarock.
Kelly, the Cylon comment almost made me do a spit take.
Wrinkle in Time is terrible, but the young actress named Storm Reid who plays the main character is phenomenal. I really hope she becomes a big star.
I just wanted to clarify something since it came up on the podcast, in my email I said that I thought that Captain Marvel didn’t shit the bed in the third act the way Wonder Woman did. I probably worded it awkwardly … sorry Dingus :).
I actually think that the final act was Captain Marvel’s strongest part because for me, pretty much the only memorable thing in the movie was how cool Brie Larsen looked in her suit all glowy and powerful and stuff.
I’m actually really surprised that Tom and Dingus liked Brie Larsen and Sam Jackson’s interaction, because I thought they had terrible chemistry. And I like both of them! So maybe I’m more with Kelly in that the lame dialog ruined those scenes for me. I thought most of the humour fell flat. And Jude Law was a terrible villain (though I did like the “I don’t have to prove myself to you” line).
You’re right. You put it properly. I just had a hard time parsing it because I don’t understand words. And didn’t write my notes carefully enough.
You didn’t word it awkwardly. That’s on me.
-xtien
“Where can I find communications equipment?”
All of Kelly’s criticism’s are completely on point yet… its amazing none the less.