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Ah, yeah. That could really go either way. For me, I would have given anything to have a game like Arkham as a kid, but there are plenty of less complex options with cool themes and you have to go with your gut.

How is Ghost Stories complexity wise?

Medium, and I would say that’s mainly because compared to many games it’s harder to win than you would expect. I think there are a lot of variants and house rules where you can break it down a bit and make it easier to win for more…fickle audiences but it definitely has an Arkham-like disregard for your character’s well-being.

I personally have a tough time with coop games that don’t include a traitor mechanic like Battlestar or a specific way to deal with sockpuppeting (where more dominant, knowledgeable players control others) like Space Alert’s chain of command/communication rules combo. But to judge from the popularity of Pandemic and others, that’s clearly not the rule for many people (and it’s entirely possible to house rule some of these things to taste). But if I had to choose one straight coop, it would be this one.

Cool. I found the concept appealing, so I’ll probably have to give it a try soon. With 3 kids old enough to play, I tend to disregard purely 1v1 games as I don’t want to leave the others out when I play. But if it plays quickly, it might be ideal.

Well, what’s nice is that the sides are typically asymmetrical to a subtle but interesting degree, so a lot of times I end up playing each side for a given setup before we put it away. I like the cavalry/cannon/infantry combo in Battle Cry better, but that’s wholly subjective since they are ultimately not that different.

I vaguely remember playing Space Hulk as a teenager and enjoying it. But, as above, the 1v1 aspect kind of puts me off. I think that’s one of the reasons I hoped Tannhauser would be good. It’s got theme and it I was hoping it would be OK with 3/4 players. But I’ve read the reviews and they are not encouraging.

Are there any other games similarly easy to learn to Space Hulk and with the same kind of tactical gameplay (I think the boys would love that kind of tense mission based encounter) which would play well for 3 / 4 players?

Well, that’s tricky because the cutting edge of this kind of thing is really in 1v1 where designers have done some great stuff. I think Claustrophobia is a tremendous game which adapts some great Euro touches to the asymmetrical combat (I like the use of dice a lot), it plays really fast, the scenarios are mostly part random, and it’s very easy to round robin. The upcoming expansion includes a further evolution of the simple rpg/leveling/campaign mode that the online (free) expansions introduced, which I think would be fun with a frequent play group. It teaches very quickly, packs up and sets up quickly, and is a steal given the production values. I wrote a comparison review to Space Hulk and Ravenloft at BGG, but suffice to say that Asmodee has earned a “preorder blank check” from me going forward for any title that even sounds interesting.

On the other end of the spectrum, there is Earth Reborn, which I think wins the prize for most interesting mechanics coupled with the most ludicrously unironic ironic theme ever. Basically, every scenario through the first few layers adds new mechanics (first level you aren’t even using ranged weapons), and eventually multiple players at the same time. It’s modeling some very sophisticated tactical stuff by the end of that with some really great mechanics (I like the orders system a great deal), but the flip side is that it’s a pain in the ass to set up and put away. My hunch would be to avoid that one unless you get to see it in action first, because it has huge “open once and never again” potential.

However, do not lose hope! If you are ok with straight adversarial play, let’s talk Chaos in the Old World. Rules description style review, fun review. Basically, it’s the best parts of Euro and Ameritrash games in one streamlined package, with a great deal of replayability as you change up the sides from game to game and they all have pretty different strategies (which you need to modify depending on who is each of the other characters, and indeed the game has a number of random elements in the setup that can change your choices considerably). The theme of ruining a world is incredibly appealing, it sets up quickly, and typically it’s a 3 turn game in that you can usually play like 3 practice turns before most people have enough to get started on a real game where they have an excellent chance of winning. I especially like the option to win by dial (eg by being the best at your particular godly affinity) or by straight victory points. It’s probably my favorite go-to game alongside Battlestar, which I would also seriously consider.

I guess both of those hinge on whether you are comfortable with the theme for your kids and they are going to have a bit of a learning curve for starting boardgamers, which not everyone might be cool with so they might just be something to have on the back burner for later on. But I’m consistently impressed with the sophisticated mechanics kids can grasp at an early age, and kind of bummed out that I spent my youth banging my head at Risk and Monopoly like an idjit. Other than that, for 4 players I really like both Space Alert and Dungeon Lords by Chvaatil, as they are really cool ideas with SA being a stronger design but also a notably harder game (great tutorial though), and they have much lighter (in tone) themes.

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So now that kickstarting seems to be the cutting edge for new boardgames rather than the old “wait for a publisher to take interest, wait for preorders to come in, etc” system, I’m curious what everyone is backing if anything. I’m pretty excited about
Eaten By Zombies, a combination coop/adversarial/competitive game that may have nailed the zombie dynamic in the way that Galactica nailed the Cylon feel. I’m also pumped about the remake of Glory to Rome, which I think will make the game a lot easier to sell to new players.

On the other hand, Eminent Domain has been plagued by delays to the point where I don’t really remember what got me into it in the first place, but hope springs eternal.

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You can also follow the suggestion offered in the manual for 2v2 play, where one of the team members takes the role of the general commander (governs decisions and movements in the central segment) and the other is the officer commanding the flanks. Card selection is done by consensus.

It does sound pasted-on, granted, but we’ve managed to have fun so far. My main problem with the game is the typically huge amount of luck involved, but for kids it’s a treat.

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I saw this video earlier, and even though I really, really want to like it, nothing about it hooked me. I’m super excited to hear your impressions about that one.

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Thanks for pointing out Eaten By Zombies. It went from “haven’t heard of that” to “bought” in about five seconds.

Eminent Domain is a great example of the best and worst of Kickstarter. Best in that it became massively overfunded, the developers are great about sending updates, and the money produced what looks to be a beautiful game. Worst in that several promises to backers were broken, and many backers showed in ugly fashion that they care far more about exclusivity than they do about supporting creative projects. It has kind of soured me on Kickstarter, but I’ll still use it and would greatly appreciate more discussion in this thread about stuff that becomes available.

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I didn’t know anyone who played the game when I bought it earlier this year; I just read through the rules and played a 1-player game by myself to try it out. After that I read through LK’s thread here and noticed some things I was doing wrong. You’re definitely going to do something wrong the first few games or so but you’ll still probably have a lot of fun doing it and that’s more important than getting it right. After that I found it a lot of fun to read the rules forum on BGG to see what other people had problems with and I got some help from guys here. I know that sounds dorky but once you get into the game you kinda want to read a lot about it :)

Arkham looks complicated but the reason there are so many bits and cards and stuff is that all of those bits and cards are actually less things that you have to keep in your head or track with pen and paper. How much health do you have? Count the number of heart tokens. How many gates are open? There’s discs on the board. I think it’s less complicated than you think it is. The flowcharts are nice but I didn’t have them the first dozen or so games I played and by then I didn’t need them.

I don’t know, dude. Arkham is a little bit of time to figure out but I felt figuring the game out was part of the fun.

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And speaking of Kickstarter, I just noticed the Alien Frontiers expansion is up there. Expected delivery: March 2012. Hmm…

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I wish I had seen this a day earlier. I have Ravenloft being delivered today to play with the kids over the long weekend. I have some concerns about how it will go over with the younger (7YO). Smallworld looks very cool and probably would have been a better choice.

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Depending on what your kids like, I expect Ravenloft to actually be more popular with the kid. Smallworld is actually a little weird/gamey in how it handles the whole “decline” thing. It makes for neat strategy, but it’s not as thematic/straightforward for kids.

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LK: Could you give me a bit more detail on Space Alert? I’ve almost bought it several times but have never talked to anyone who has actually played it. Specifically, how well does it scale to differing numbers of players? I also have this worry that it’ll play like multi-player solitaire since everyone is racing against a timer.

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I think it would be fun depending on the 7 year old, especially if you dress it up with a bit of Princess Bride-ing for the vast gaps in theme within the scenarios (ie the empty rooms leading to your objective). In no way am I claiming that this is a failure of a game in the sense that, for instance, Tales of the Arabian Nights is a failure. It just doesn’t have much tactical depth, but it has really cool miniatures and potential for someone with a little creativity.

But you could easily append a “sub quest” to each room for a little fun along the way, or house rule a basic campaign, or something along those lines. The basic game may even work out, since kids get enthusiastic and take you with them for the ride sometimes (I played someappallingboardgamesas a yute, but we still had fun as a family with them. Ravenloft is competent at the very least, and potentially good depending on your crowd).

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I hear ya and Dune is easily my all time favorite sci-fi book, but I think REX may be my only option to play this game again. It’s a shame that Dune wouldn’t give them the liscense. :(

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Thanks again for this and the other suggestions.

I found your comparison ( http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/584966/claustrophobia-review-a-viable-alternative-to-spac ). And I think I fancy testing out the more tactical aspect of gaming without spending the price for a used copy of Space Hulk (if I can even find one). So I’m now ordering Claustrophobia… With Smallworld, Illuminati, Ankh Morpork and Season of the Witch, I probably better stop reading this thread and BGG for a while before my wife makes me sleep on the couch… O_o

Earth Reborn looks like it could be great fun. But I’d rather play that with other dedicated gamers.

Chaos in the Old World is going on my wish list. The Downtime Town review was great (as always). The mechanics look really interesting.

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That’s a legitimate concern, but I don’t think it works out the way you’d expect. Basically you need 4 players, or 1 + x bots, or 2 + x bots, or so on (the expansion includes much better solo rules). With four, you have a captain, a communications officer, and two crewmen. The captain is responsible for coordinating efforts while laying out his own actions (face down). The comm guy relays the threats and crucial data as cards are drawn (enemies, dangers, etc). The crew members have to optimize their own responses, because typically micromanaging beyond “go there and do that” won’t happen because the captain has a lot on his plate.

Now, coordinated properly there are few threats you can’t properly address, and once everyone gets the chain of command thing down you have a very comfortable flow of general direction from the captain and specific planning for the crewmembers, and feedback and suggestions coming back at the captain as situations evolve.

But there’s always some slight miscalculation, some escalation, things start getting out of hand…and then the mission recording informs you have a comm blackout, and everyone has to try to respond to whatever’s screwed up on their own. Blackout’s over, frantic coordination starts again, Crewmember x screwed up, captain put down the wrong tiles, the comm guy is gibbering in the corner, and you’re pretty sure that you miscalculated the range on the attack to neutralize the enemy that’s about to eat your ship.

In short, everything’s going great!

I’m not sure if that gives you clearer picture, but I would stress that the biggest obstacle is that it’s a combat setting but optimization style responses (ie move down, push red, push green move up to set up for next turn, the push red is synchronized to when you anticipate x moving into range, and so on). This can be stressful in a bad way for people that generally dislike a bit of high speed programming (which is usually me, but not in this case), but I think it’s unlikely you would consider it a solitaire-like experience.

Unless, of course, you get the expansion and in addition to doing the campaign with XP you do it solo, which is actually a good bit of fun. Forever alone! etc.

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Speaking of Chaos in the Old World, I got to play this for the first time at GenCon and I REALLY enjoyed it. Fantasy Flight was running all of their demos with the replacement cards from Shadow of the Horned Rat expansion substituted in, so I really have no idea how much different it is with only the core cards. I’ll probably get both the game & expansion at the same time though. I have so many new games I’ve acquired lately I’m waiting until I’ve actually played them all before ordering more.

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I’ll let LK chime in as well, but I personally did not care for the game. It scales well, but all the games I play suffer from players familiar with the game trying to bark orders to the other players. If you have a group that won’t suffer from someone being the leader and you like game where you pre-program the moves and sit back and watch the chaos it’s a fun experience, but I was disappointed in it. I’m surprised it’s ranked as high as it is on BGG. For a similar experience of pre-programmed moves I would say go with Galaxy Trucker. I find it much more fun more interactive as you’re trying to get pieces for ship before the other players and it’s just heartbreaking as you watch your ship destroyed by bad rolls and poor ship design.

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I can’t speak to the multiple player scaling, but unless you’re much better at the game than my group, it is not multiplayer solitaire. Too much coordination necessary, too much hidden information, too much panic, not enough time. And failure. Piles and piles of failure. Maybe not forever, but you need to carry a, “Losing is fun!” attitude into the game. The tutorial helps set that expectation, but if you’ve got players who are cranky perfectionists, then, maybe not so much.

From a detail standpoint, you’ve got a hand with two types of actions on them, a series of challenges, and a timer. The timer goes off, cards get played for the actions, and then, once the timer expires, you play the game out step-by-step to determine if you’ve done what you’d expected. The timer differs from an egg timer in that it presents challenges at unexpected times, sporadically prevents you from talking at the table, and permits you to exchange action cards occasionally. Information about threats and others’ action hands are limited, some by space at the table, some by rule. Gameplay mechanics reward coordinated action, but the timer punishes useless chatter. Delegation becomes especially significant because one player can’t hold the whole scenario in his hands, and must solicit input as to who can accomplish what, and then give leave to the player to do so. And this delegation and coordination leads to a lovely balance between taking care of your own business and supporting others that is very rewarding.

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Agreed.

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Is Small World really THAT accessible to compare it to someone like Guillotine? I had no idea. Funny, it was one of the first apps I planned to get when I got my iPad, but never did for some reason.

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I’ve never seen a rules explanation take more than five minutes, but ymmv. It’s more complex than Guillotine because it has more stuff, but it’s pretty easy to grasp when it’s all in front of you. Being good at either of those, of course, is a different story.