Why not? What rights do you have in the matter, and where do they come from, and what protects them?
Nazis are often pretty overt in the fact that they are Nazis. They have tattoos and stuff.
So, imagine the situation where one of them comes in, with their SS tattoos, and sits down. How is that going to make YOU feel?
Again, I point out our recent conversation regarding how you felt with a participant in the forum, and that was nowhere near as overt as a Nazi skinhead.
I should be allowed, as the owner of a business, to refuse service to the Nazi. Not only should I be allowed to do it because I disagree with his abhorrent views, but because his presence will negatively impact the experiences of my other, good customers.
I mean, you can go on ignoring my comments if you like, @Timex, but theyâre material and relevant and rebut your own arguments, and you look awfully silly pretending they arenât there. LOL!
If I own a convenient store and some Nazis wants to buy a Pepsi, and he doesnât start anything, Iâm selling him a Pepsi. You realize that minorities have been selling to bigots for like⌠forever right. There was a time when they were selling to mostly bigots, and it wasnât that long ago.
If a Nazis pulls up to a gas station and buys gas, he or she buys gas.
I wonât be going to their rally but you think we have a similarity here. We donât.
Again, if I have a restaurant, and that guy comes in and sits there, are you really going to say that itâs not going to impact you as a customer?
Are you going to feel comfortable sitting in a restaurant next to the Nazi?
I think itâs pretty naive for you to think that minorities are able to conduct business based on only when we are comfortable. Even during the rallies, the Nazis were asked to leave those diners because they were shitty people and couldnât conduct themselves in public. If someone walked into a restaurant covered in swastikas, for all I know he is an ex-Nazis that canât afford to get them removed because thatâs hell expensive.
That person would be served so long as they behaved themselves. Your position allows me to make assumptions about thing that I canât even prove.
But as a business owner, I am interested in making you feel comfortable, because that increases the chances of you coming back. If you have to choose between the restaurant where thereâs a nazi talking about all his nazi bullshit, or a restaurant where heâs not there, youâre likely gonna choose the latter.
We just went over this with GMan. You asserted that his presence here was actively harming you. And thatâs on a FORUM. That would be no less true in a real world establishment. I should be able to tell the nazi to fuck off and get the hell out.
Heâs not a protected class. I am under absolutely no constitutional obligation to respect his abhorrent views. His presence harms my business, and offends my sense of morality and ethics.
Sometimes, when a black person walks into an all-white establishment, they make people uncomfortable. Deal with it.
If the Nazis are having loud Nazi conversations, theyâre being obnoxious and loud and probably purposefully so. They have done something to warrant asking them to leave. This is the sticking point. Your giving business owners an opportunity to just look at someone and say no I will not serve them. I think that is bullshit. Theyâre going to be biased, bigoted and often wrong with those assumptions. There is no reason not to just serve someone who is quietly behaving themselves with maybe the exception of some⌠public figures where public figures fall into interesting categories anyway.
I do not support telling someone to leave because you think they are Nazis. I doubt you know they are Nazis to begin with and minorities had to serve in these conditions for decades, they still do. They do that today, and they do have an option to refuse. Theyâre largely not doing that. Hell even with MAGA hats, you hear about a few incidents but theyâre not being turned away from grocery stores and gas stations because of red hats and bumpers stickers⌠nor should they be.
Yes, and they are legally obligated to deal with it. This is fine. This is not in dispute. We agree on this, so you do not need to try and argue that case further.
What if they are merely sitting there and talking about their nazi shit to each other, at a normal volume? What if they arenât talking to you at all, merely talking about how youâre inferior and should probably be dealt with. You know, as Nazis do.
Do they not have Nazis where you live? I mean real, actual neo-nazis.
Because thereâs no âhey, I wonder if that guy is a Nazi.â They are extremely overt in the fact that they are nazis. Intentionally so, as they use it as an intimidation tactic. They want their presence to make minorities feel bad, or start fights with them.
They absolutely should be, in my opinion. Certainly if theyâre wearing shit with swastikas on it they should be, and I like to think that most places would in fact turn them away.
You really think this rare? You think people, not just Nazis, but people talking about other races as inferior is rare? This happens ALL the time. The only thing that make Nazis different is they tend to label themselves and theyâre tying themselves to a political group responsible for war and mass murder. We know how awful they are, without a doubt.
I think you have the position you have in this particular debate because you are not exposed to not only what it feels like to be turned away from service for literally no good reason at all, but you donât seem to be around people who say this shit all the time or you just donât hear it or maybe not recognize it for what it is.
And to be clear about this forum from say a random gas station, this a community. By accepting white supremacy here, weâre saying the people in the community are okay with it. Letting someone buy a soda, or get gas, or eat at a restaurant does not tell me the person who works there is okay with these random people. I am assuming if they overstep, theyâll be asked to leave.
And yet you think I should be forced to serve them in my business. Seriously, I do not understand your perspective there.
Believing that we should murder minorities is an overstep. Their system of beliefs is abhorrent. I know I donât need to explain this to you, Iâm just baffled that you think I should be forced to accept them into my business.
Regardless, weâre clearly not going to come to any agreement here, and I donât really understand your position, but weâve said our respective pieces.
So, were the two of you fine with the restaurant that asked Trumpâs mouthpiece Sanders to leave?
Clearly I was fine with that.
Me, too. Thereâs a distinction between ostracizing people for their overt actions , and ostracizing them for their mere existence.
Is there any fear out there that the lefts actions will only make things that much worse when the Dems win the presidency in 2020? Will people be outraged when members of that group are asked to leave establishments, or when they are shouted at by strangers in public places.
I know, I am old fashioned and my ideas of propriety are dead, and probably have been since Obama was elected.
Well, I for one think that nothing the Dems can do will change how Reps respond to or engage with Dems. For evidence of that view, I have only to point to how the Reps treated and dealt with Obama. That they can have decided that he was a monstrous Muslim communist tyrant, given his actual behavior and his proposals, says that the actual behavior of Dems is irrelevant to the equation.
I am absolutely done with being afraid of pissing off people on the right. Iâm just done.
I think public figures are different and have clear resources and an open mic at their disposal.
These individuals support Timexâs view, that people can refuse service for any bullshit reason⌠not even sure why those specific public figures even brought it up. This is what they supposedly want. It not what they âreallyâ want because like almost everyone else with this position, they always assume itâs not going to be them that will be refused service.
Then I hope you are prepared for the outrages to come. Because this will only escalate.
And you can argue, like a 5 year old (I donât mean you personally) that they started it and did it first, but that wonât make things better. But we are probably past things getting better.
Itâs already escalated. The shit has already hit the fan.