Simracing Fans - David Kaemmer Returns!

I’m so damn excited about this. It’s apparently tech for a new game engine with physics by Kaemmer of course but they’re wrapping it up in a sanctioned racing league. Even if I never get involved in that, the fact they can sim just about anything has me excited, especially given Kaemmer’s pedigree (Papyrus Racing Games).

The best part is what they’re working on now. SK Modifieds, USAC Midgets, Sprints and Silver Crown… sign me up! The rest is just gravy. Short track oval racing is so perfectly suited to competitve simulation/videogame style gameplay that it just fires me up at least twice a month when I think how few have even tried, the now deceased Ratbag being one of the few.

Looking forward to this. I imagine others here will be excited too!

How does this compare to rFactor?

No clue. There’s nothing playable there yet. I think they’re just getting the ball rolling with this Craftsman Truck sponsorship on Friday. I want to know more though. I’ll see what I can do. I dunno if Andy Mahood still reads Qt3, but he might have more info.

I mean, c’mon… they already recreated Stafford!

Surely that hasn’t stopped the rivet-counters from passing judgement on it.

Holy shit! Sprints! Midgets! Modifieds! I am so there!!!

Thanks Dave for this heads up and I would definitely appreciate any future info your insider developer super-powers can glean.

I am a dirt track junkie.

Some interesting reading re: David Kaemmer/First Racing/iRacing’s on-going legal tussles with the sim modding community.


After reading that I have a sudden urge to take a shower…

So the pricing for iRacing is out, and it’s, err, different:

BEDFORD (23 January 2008) — today announced pricing for its racing simulation, which will be available on a subscription basis starting in 2008. A one-year subscription to the service will cost $13 per month and includes all of the content necessary for a subscriber’s first season of oval-track and road-racing. Shorter terms of six and three months are priced at $15 and $17 per month, respectively. A one-month trial subscription is available for $20.


The list price, before credits or volume discounts, is $15 for cars and $15 to $25 per track. Licensing three or more pieces of additional content reduces the price by 10 percent, and six or more reduces it by 20 percent.

“We’ve spent a lot of time and committed substantial resources to create the most accurate racing simulation outside of what the top Formula One teams use,” said Gardner. “With this approach we expect a typical member’s average monthly cost, including content, will be on the order of $16 to $19 over a three year period — which we think is very reasonable for the quality of experience we provide.”

IMHO - waaaaay overpriced for any market. Sure, there’s this notional “credits” thing, but it stills seems to be an awful lot to pay compared to say rFactor. I kinda get where they attempting to go with fidelity but I can’t see there being too many customers.

I don’t understand the pricing. What does the monthly 15$ give you, just membership, and then separably buy each car and track? If so I don’t see many simracers going for that. Simracers are used to free cars and tracks added freely by modders.
It will be interesting to see how this works.

I buy about any racing simulator that comes out. I have LFS, rFactor, GTR2, RACE 07 and GTL.
I have a G25 wheel and got a 3 monitor setup mainly for racing.
I’m not likely to get this.

Especially since you have all the others. That’s why this makes no sense. It’s not like race sims have dried up. This one would have to be the second coming in order to sell at these convoluted prices.

Well, considering the source, it may just be the second coming.

I got the pricing e-mail yesterday, too. It’s certainly different. I think they’re expecting a lot of folks to stick to one particular type of car, though. I know I’m interested if I can drive an SK modified at Stafford and various other ovals from around the country.

I think road racing will be their primary concentration of racers, though. If the sim is as good as it should be given the developer’s pedigree, there will be a lot of folks that race real race cars that will be giving this a try.

Eh, I like a good racing sim, even if I’m not terribly good at them, but that’s way too hardcore for me. I can already come in last without having to spend a small fortune.

Edit: And after checking the FAQ, yeah, they’re not really aiming this at us armchair racers anyway, but are trying to position it as it’s own valid type of professional motorsport. It’s priced specifically to keep dilettantes like me out.

Race and flight sims are the games that never get uninstalled from my system. I look forward to the next best thing, of course, but seeing as I can dip into older games any time and often do, this would have to be the one and only racing game I’ll ever need from here on. And since it seems online only, it won’t be.

Also… the graphics could be much better? It looks like GTL.

Wait… you love sims but you don’t race online?

I find it really difficult to want to do anything but race online. I’ll stay offline to learn the circuits and set up the car, but AI is just not even close to the excitement of racing online in a proper simulation.

I just can’t be bothered. Waiting around for a race to start, lag makes cars jump around all over the place, noobs run you off the road and cuss you out. Sure, offline AI can be predictable, but at least I can start up my game of choice and jump right into any race quickly. If I crash I can restart the race in seconds. Besides, I’m not so good as to be able to beat the highest AI or difficulty settings consistantly anyhow.

I don’t like online anything, actually. I find my ratio of playing compared to waiting unacceptable, and usually people wind up ruining my immersion rather than creating it.

Speaking of which I wonder what Geoff Crammond is working on? Anyone know?

Despite the pedigree of the developer, it does not look like I’ll be interested. I cannot get by the legal position they are taking in regards to modding (see the lawsuit link given above). The sim community is a small one, and a burnt-crop strategy is going to hurt them.

I also do not see what this company is bringing to the table that Race2play doesn’t already have. It is sanctioned by a recognized racing group, has all sorts of careeer tracking stats, and provides a good matchmaker service for people who want to race online. The advantage to Race2play is they are an open system that allows racing in multiple games and using multiple mods. And some of the mods are simply awesome IMO, like Power&Glory and LeMans prototypes mods for GTR2 and the karting mod for rFactor.

I think their primary market with this thing is actually professional racing drivers and teams. This subscription thing for regular sim racers is just gravy. I don’t think it will be all that successful in terms of huge sub numbers, but I think they know that and know who they’re targeting. You know, people who spend $1500 on an ECCI wheel, and buy or build a cockpit, have giant screens, and build a top of the line PC for nothing but racing games. There aren’t a ton of them out there, but there are still quite a few. Once Dale Jr gives it his seal of approval a bunch of his followers will surely hop on board.

Anyway, I consider myself a moderately hardcore simmer, but I won’t be buying it, mostly because of the cost, but also because of iRacing’s… previous attempts at community building. I do imagine that it will be far and away the best racing sim available, though, since pretty much every other sim these days is built on the tired ISI engine, which I was never really a fan of, even though rFactor is currently my game of choice.

I think this is exactly right. This won’t be a mass-market kind of thing - I am guessing it will be heavily promoted to guys (and gals) who already race at some level and are looking to use this both as a way to race when time/travel/weather constraints prevent actual racing, and/or by people who use this as an actual training tool for track familiarization.

While I race only infrequently (in the real world), I instruct with various clubs monthly, and I’m not only going to get this, but will likely recommend that some students pick it up as well if they want to work on racing basics.