So I guess 2016 claimed its biggest victim yet - America


#2053

Well I think his actions are misguided and unnecessary. In fact, I consider him a fool. No argument from me there. But to adopt a phrase, that’s not against the law for Presidents, otherwise half to three quarters of them would be in jail.

But you guys can’t go a day without claiming the sky is falling. You don’t want to be reassured, you want to be upset.

The unfashionable truth is not a whole hell of a lot will change, with the exception of some meaningful policy issues like universal health care. But that’s a slow burn issue which doesn’t translate well to the world of instant outrage. Even this show pony thing with the visas doesn’t effect American citizens. It’s nothing really.

Trump will come, eventually the voters will swing back and Trump will go. That’s how your politics work.

No secession (beyond ridicule unfortunately), no police state, no Trump the despot. Nothing.


#2054

This is seemingly part of the tactics, and existed during the campaign.

The reason why there is outrage and amazement every day, is quite simply, because Trump does outrageous things EVERY DAY.

The effect is, as you provide evidence of, the notion that the outrage must be fabricated… it all becomes white noise… because certainly no president could cause this much legitimate outrage.

But I would offer the counter point that the reason why people are outraged, is because Trump is in fact outrageous, with new acts of absurdity every single day.


#2055

I’m sure McCain, McMullin, Graham, Will, Romney, Kristol, Beck et al. are just secret liberals who are over reacting.

Not to mention the king libcuck Ronald Reagan, if he was still alive. What a snowflake.


#2056

Believe it or not, some of us actually have friends and neighbors that are affected by the travel ban bullshit. What an ignorant statement.


#2057

Well remember, @rowe33, non-citizens aren’t people.

That’s why it’s okay for our drone program to slaughter so many of them!


#2058

McClintock is a conservative republican who is about as safe as it gets in a (for California) amazingly conservative district. This townhall was news all over the state, I saw footage. I don’t think protesters do themselves much good when things get this rowdy.


#2059

And those same people would instantly change their minds if a democrat beat Trump in 2020. They don’t want to leave the US, they want to leave Trump. It’s why it’s a stupid idea.


#2060

I mean I don’t really have much interest in sharing a nation with 60m+ people who’d choose Trump over, I dunno, suicide or whatever.

But I’ve never been much of a patriot, either.

On account of being a filthy pinko commie, you see.


#2061

Never said it wasn’t stupid, I said it would win. All the referendum really does is take language out of the state constitution that bans secession- that’s it.


#2062

I am not sure in the end that it would win. I think when people slow down and think about it they would realize what a stupid idea it was. Remember, California is still a state that not to long ago voted in Arnold and against gay marriage. If it was just a protest against Trump, sure it passes. But sell it as part of a road to secession, and no way it passes.


#2063

I agree a binding vote would be much less likely to pass, unlike Trump wins re-election without the popular vote again. Then America will really feel like an occupying power to many in multiple blue states.


#2064

I hope you are right about that last bit. Sincerely. Despite what you believe I would love to be reassured that everything will be ok.

But we will see how long it takes for a volatile nation like North Korea or Iran to test him and how he responds.


#2065

I am feeling like this is more and more going to be the case. With the whole “repair” Obamacare language coming through, the various leaks of the incompetence of the administration… Nothing is going to get done here. It will take the administration years to get figured out how to do their jobs (leaks are even saying that the staff hasn’t figured out how to get the lights to turn on in certain rooms). They were wholly unprepared for the win, and the senior staff is rife with infighting, and Bannon is looking to turn into a scapegoat for all of the bad press lately.

Not to mention, I think we all forget about the many checks and balances that we have in our system of democracy. The federal courts have the power to block unconstitutional actions, and they have been doing so. Even with Gorsuch as a supreme court nod, I don’t agree with the guy’s politics, but he is VERY into protecting the constitution.

Complaining that the sky is falling isn’t always going to be helpful. (Not to say that everything is great lately) But real constructive things like fighting Betsy DeVos’ nomination are good. She is just hands down a bad fit for the job, her lack of knowledge of the education system is flabbergasting. She was unprepared for very simple questions at the hearing. And we are seeing positive pushback from republicans that were lobbied (via calls) by their constituents. So rather than rage and complain, we need to pressure our elected officials to not stand for this nonsense. By all means, continue to march on Washington, and protest, and point out the psuedo-authoritarian things going on. But we also need to fight with our votes (in 2018) or our phone calls and letters.

But, America will live on, and we need to remember that the overwhelming majority of Americans voted for another candidate, and many businesses (which the pro-business adminstration would like to woo) don’t have to answer to gerrymandered districts and voter-supressed electorates, but 100% of American consumers whom a majority voted against this.

So, we need to keep fighting, but we need to be smart about it. And I think some of the greatest solace we can take (be us liberals or moderate fiscal-conservatives) is that this administration is too dumb to get anything important done. Other than making us look stupid on the world’s stage.


#2066

So if I call my congressmen and women and draft letters, I can only do that OR express my dissatisfaction. We’re not allowed to do both anymore?


#2067

I said to do both, clearly, in the part you quoted. And it is important to do both, and not just share memes on facebook about the nuclear holocaust, funnel the outrage into something constructive.


#2068

Here in Chicago we have WCPT which has progressive news all day. There are several hosts that range from informative to hyperbolic. But it’s there.

But he range is still fairly limited, compared to others. Start getting to some of the outer suburbs, or approach Indiana and it cuts out. Compared to something like WBBM (local CBS affiliate) which can reach almost to Michigan (and under the right conditions all the way to Benton Harbor), it’s quite limited.


#2069

Isn’t “On Point” with Tom Ashbrook available worldwide?


#2070

But you’re making the assumption that is not already being done… it is. For example, the Women’s March sent out communication to anyone who supports them how to contact their reps and send note cards.


#2071

Yes, this is almost certainly true, and anyway a California/Oregon/Washington militia would be absolutely smeared by the U.S. Army. Which would come, make no mistake about it.

Political stability is never a given, though. Countries can sail along for centuries and then suddenly, seismically, fracture. Happens all the time throughout history.


#2072

No. I would give so fucking much to be able to say “Oh, it’s just another Bush administration” and delegate it to the normal CPU subroutines I devote to politics.

But I can’t. I wake up scared every day, dreading what the news will bring. I have absolutely no confidence in the mental stability of the president nor in the competence of those he gathers to advise him. I cannot get my head around the fact that white supremacists are being mainstreamed in a way they haven’t since the '60s. I can’t ignore that he lies constantly, serially, recklessly, pathologically, and his supporters don’t care in the slightest. I can’t ignore that Trump doesn’t even give the courtesy of lip service to the institutions of a healthy republic. I can’t ignore the astonishingly mean-spirited and hateful tenor of his campaign. His tent is big enough to include the guy shouting “Jew-S-A” and the reprehensible slimes who gave Sieg Heils before his inauguration and he is too pusillanimous, or too evil (it comes to the same thing in the end) to disavow them.

I have never felt anything like this before in a quarter century of observing American politics. Maybe it’s just my gut, but when I read similar sentiments in the Washington Post and the Atlantic Monthly, it doesn’t exactly reassure me.