Democrats will say that Clinton’s failure to stop the Rwandan genocide is excused by his not wanting to be accused of “wagging the dog”. That’s pretty damn craven, in my eyes.
If the clips I heard from Coulter and Hannity this morning are anything to go by, the Republican noise machine’s answer to this is… wait for it… you’ll never guess…
It’s actually Kerry’s fault. He voted against the military appropriation, so Dems have no standing to complain about how the troops are armored. (The fact that Dems wouldn’t have sent the troops into Iraq presumably doesn’t really matter).
I really think that if this had happened 3 months ago, Bush would’ve lost the election–one of the Republican strong points has always been the image that they “support the troops”, that they’ll protect our guys in uniform.
Gav
Doubtful. There were plenty of news items about the lack of armor, the lack of equipment, stop-loss measures, wounded troops being made to pay for their own hospital meals, etc, well before the election.
He voted against the military appropriation,
He voted against an inadequate spending bill. Cheney has done quite a bit, far more than any mere senator, to prevent the troops from access to everything they need. This important fact is left out.
Doubtful. There were plenty of news items about the lack of armor, the lack of equipment, stop-loss measures, wounded troops being made to pay for their own hospital meals, etc, well before the election.[/quote]
That’s true, but none of them got the kind of play this story’s gotten, maybe because (1) this time a soldier is asking the question, and (2) Rumsfeld was caught so obviously flatfooted on it.
Gav
I don’t know Derek - when my Dad commanded a NG division around 95-96, I remember he was all excited that they were getting M1IP’s (intial purchase) to replace the M-60’s they were still using.
There is something to be said about sending the National Gaurd into areas they’re under equiped for, but most of the stories I’ve heard from the people I know in the National Gaurd is that the people that are under equiped with the new combat toys are the REMF’s (not saying that’s the case in the article, just a personal anecdote).
It’s not coincidental that many of the 1,281 US troops killed were REMFs (“Rear Echelon Mother F*cker” for those who’re wondering).
Iraq isn’t set up like a traditional war, where there’s a front to move on and a rear to be protected in. Our makeshift bases are spread throughout the country, and a large number of non-combat units work in some of the most dangerous areas of the country because there’s no way to do what’s required otherwise.
For example, transportation companies, like the one the soldier mentions in his question to Rumsfeld, have to make several trips daily back and forth on unprotected highways and cities full of makeshift bombs, mines and snipers.
Mechanics, fuel specialists, doctors, just about any non-combat MOS you can think of are routinely found making trips outside their semi-protected bases in order to help the combat troops complete their mission, so I think the fact that the so-called REMFs aren’t protected is a serious issue.
No they don’t. I don’t. I don’t know any Democrats who do. Who are you talking about?
Got a source for what percentage that is Derek? Just curious.
No they don’t. I don’t. I don’t know any Democrats who do. Who are you talking about?[/quote]
I was just talking to one last week who said this. How do you feel about Clinton’s failure to stop the Rwandan genocide?
You know dumb Democrats. :D
It was an appalling inexcusable stain on his presidency. Yes, the GOP and the public at large didn’t give a shit about it to start with, but that doesn’t excuse it.
rummy coulda shot the guy who asked and then mowed down the cheering soldiers with a machine gun and half this piece of shit country wouldnt blink. Jesus said it’s ok, so you know, they can do whatever. So, luckily, he showed remarkable restraint. He probably ate the poor man’s tongue later for dinner.
They dislike abortion! MANDATE FROM HEAVEN!
Wasn’t this same type of thing how the military blamed Somalia on the Clinton administration? Essentially that they failed to supply them with adequate equipment for operations, thus leading to “Black Hawk Down”, and a quick subsequent withdrawl.
The right’s compliant was more of “shouldn’t have been in there being all wussy nation-building help-the-darkies in the first place.” This morphed into “Clinton’s personal wussiness was responsible for the fuckup from top to bottom at all stages.”
I agree with Halberstam that it’s technically the military’s fault for giving Clinton stupid advice, but he’s the President; it’s just job to filter the good from the bad and take responsibility.
Most complaints about lack of equipment during the events of Black Hawk Down fall under complaints about the lack of light tracked armored fighting vehicles in the Army Ranger units there.
For more about this view, check out this.
Of course, many of the soldiers complaining here are from units that are far more underequiped than any of the units involved in BHD.
So when you asked before “Can you imagine Democrats doing this [kind of spin doctoring]?” can I point to your later post, quoted above, as reason for my answer: yes?
DerekMeister: Thanks for the link. Looks like you are right; the only thing they didn’t get which they requested (in the realm of equipment) was tracked vehicles. The movie of course mentioned not only that but heavier choppers and better personal gear.
I seem to recall the movie going out of it’s way to show overconfident Delta Force guys convincing the Rangers who obviously worshipped them that they wouldn’t need most of their equipment, followed by scenes of soldiers removing armor plates from vests, and then getting shot in the back later, or leaving night vision goggles behind because they didn’t figure they’d be out past the afternoon.
I think the movie went out of it’s way to play up the idea that any lack of gear was a direct result of the decision of the soldiers themselves.
Those were actually Rangers talking to each other: “you ain’t gonna need that, dude!” But yeah you’re right about it.
Um, shift, can you point to some Democratic apologia for Rwanda? I’m pretty sure I can find 10 “that rat fuckers” for every one you can find.