They had a lot of plans that changed so far. It’s entirely possible they will change this particular one as well, though I hope they don’t change it any further.
This is more nefarious than any three anti-consumer moves made by EA and Activision. In fact, I bet there are a few executives that have been fired from EA, Activision or Ubisoft because they didn’t figure out this scheme first. Roberts’ years making crap movies taught him a thing or three about suckers and sheep-fleecing and all that.
Your point would make sense if Star Citizen delivers. It hasn’t, I doubt it ever will, and @slapbone is right that it’s a harmful precedent for the industry. Incompetent game-makers using nostalgia and celebrity to bilk large amounts of money from gullible people is not something that should be financially lucrative. Unfortunately, even if these guys go bankrupt, the precedent has been set. They’ve made (and wasted) millions of dollars. Yeah, sure, it would be cool if they knew what they were doing and we were well on our way to getting the best space game of all time, but that’s obviously not the case here.
Star Citizen is Grimoire but with a less psychotic snake oil salesman at the helm.
-Tom, also an asshole
I think this has more to do with current MMO landscape and what it takes to run dedicated servers in an increasingly post-subscription model market. I always see Guild Wars 2 held up as the gold standard of non-obtrusive cash shops, and yet they offer in-game boosts and currency exchange for real money.
At this point, my main concern when it comes to RMT is how grindy the game is without spending money.
So, it’s a harmful precedent if they don’t deliver? So then why is @slapbone hoping they fail? Wouldn’t that be hoping for the harmful precedent to be set?
Yea, I guess it’s kind of Utopian but, in the future, I would like for companies to look at the funding model that CIG used and think “burns like fire”.
stusser
4474
I sympathize with that, but I want to play the game they’re supposedly making and if they go under quite a few people won’t be able to get their kids braces or pay their mortgage. There is a real human cost.
I get that, but the needs of the many and all that. There was a real human cost to Enron, but they needed to go down for the greater good. And besides, if CIG goes down that’s not on me, its on the Roberts. Me sitting here hoping doesn’t do a damn thing.
I doubt anyone sane wants rank and file employees or their families to suffer. The issue here is that the funding campaign has been predatory and the studio heads have thus far been cavalier and arguably dumb about the way they’ve spent the money raised. Most of us cringe when we see EA or Activision push out yet another pre-order scheme with $100 worth of steelbox packaging and gewgaws, so CIG’s crazy-ass virtual ship sales should rightly draw some fire.
Now, if (a big giant crazy if) the game actually gets made to the spec they’ve pitched, they will have earned some consideration for the way they’ve handled the project. Success, after all, brings some immunity from criticism. I have a feeling that will not be the case. I think the devout CIG fans are going to go through some rough self-examinations someday.
it’s kind of a “but what about the children?” argument. This business model is… unpleasant and probably ungood for the industry.
It’s a harmful precedent even if they do deliver (haw!). Nick’s use of the word “predatory” says it all.
As has been covered, I’m sure no one here wants game developers to be out of work and unable to feed their families. I don’t doubt there are talented and well intentioned folks working on Star Citizen. No one wishes them ill. But at a different level, the Star Citizen developers have been a real blight to game development, crowd sourcing, their own genre, Chris Roberts’ legacy, early access, and so on. They’re a sad joke and they are not in a “karmically neutral” place. Hence the idea of hoping they fail.
Look, I don’t normally weigh in here, since I honestly appreciate how you and @Timex want to give them the benefit of the doubt. It’s refreshing to read. You guys have been real troupers, and I don’t mean that to be patronizing. But if I’m going to speak honestly, Cloud Imperium is taking you guys for a ride and I’m bummed to see them getting away with it.
-Tom
Timex
4479
But it hasn’t been an expensive ride. It doesn’t cost much to give them a little money and wait.
The fact that it’s late doesn’t really bother me that much. There’s nothing really riding on it.
That’s the thing that strikes me as weird, about the folks that actually want to see it fail. On some level, there’s just some amount of generic trolling, to be sure. Some folks just like other folks to fail.
And I totally understand how, if this were to actually fail, then it would make sense to want some sort of Justice or punishment leveed against Roberts for misleading everyone (that’s not really my opinion, as I kind of knew exactly what I was getting when I made my contribution, but I understand this at least).
But if he actually delivers, then there’s no malfeasance. There’s no crime… Although maybe that’s it? A desire that it fail in order to justify criticism and wrath?
Strikes me as odd.
wilykat
4480
I’m all for devil’s advocacy, but I think you need to concede that $155m in funding is actually pretty expensive. I am aware that no one person needed to put in more than a relatively small amount to buy in, but that’s not really the point.
I want it to fail because I miss the days when you paid for something when you got it and you could make some kind of assessment about whether it was worth your money based on reviews or actual lists of features, like 99.9% of the rest of the world works. I am not looking forward to the internet anguish if/when this actually releases and people have to decide whether they really got their $150m worth, if it has the exact feature set they were promised five years ago, and how it compares to No Man’s Sky. I don’t want this to become EA’s business model. I don’t want Trump to succeed because I don’t want the next candidate to look at his shit and say “well, that’s what winners do.” and I don’t want this to succeed for the same reason. There are a fuckload of other devs, other politicians, and other everything that I want to succeed, even people whose output I have zero interest in. But I don’t like this.
RichVR
4481
I don’t have a dog in this race. OTOH I do have an issue with wanting it to crash and burn. It seems like a really nasty form of schadenfreude. Not so much that the failure will have a chilling effect on anyone who wants to do something shady in the future. It won’t. Let me repeat that. It will not. More like I want them to fail because it will be oh so glorious. I may be wrong, but that’s what I got from earlier comments.
Timex
4482
Heh, I meant my personal ride. For my personal contribution, I’m perfectly comfortable.
But you realize you could do exactly that?
I mean, no one is in under any obligation at all to contribute any money to CIG. If you want, you can wait until it is in a state you actually want to play, and purchase it then.
On every limited time sale page is the following, plainly visible:
Disclaimer
Remember: we are offering this pledge ship to help fund Star Citizen’s development. The funding generated by sales such as this is what allows us to include deeper, non-combat oriented features in the Star Citizen world. All ships will be available for in-game credits in the final universe, and they are not required to start the game. The goal is to make additional ships available that give players a different experience rather than a particular advantage when the final persistent universe launches.
If they don’t fail, will they still be a blight to all those things?
Again, I have to ask if this sentiment is predicated on them not delivering on their promises, or have you evolved to the point where it is impossible for Star Citizen to not be a scam?
I can’t speak for Tom, but I don’t think it’s possible for them to deliver on their promises.
Is that a scam in the cynical, on purpose swindle sense? No. I’m sure there are plenty of CIG folks that believe in what they’re doing. I just don’t think it’s realistically feasible for them to attain what they’ve pitched. Further, I’m sure some of the same folks that believe in what they’re doing at CIG know this, but handwave it away like Molyneaux did by claiming that it’s all good-natured hype.
DTG
4485
I learned this lesson from buying the Ultima 9 Collector’s Edition pre-order.
I loved Wing Commander, but never considered giving this any money.
It’s the amount of money that’s staggering to me.
I simply cannot envision firing up any game, and after playing it for several days, saying to myself, “Well, I can certainly see how that experience cost $150 million to make!”
More to the point, I’m wondering what this game will actually have cost to complete once it is finished. $300 million? $1 billion?
My mind boggles at these numbers when in regard to making a game. Even the lowest number I just mentioned, $150 million. Wow.
But hey, maybe once I play it, my mind will be blown accordingly. :)
Eh… Modern warfare 2 stands at $280 million adjusted as the most expensive game made. Granted, it includes marketing, but I guess we all agree SC has also spent a sizeable amount in marketing already.
Destiny is reported to have been around $140 million without marketing even factored in.
What I mean is that it’s not an unusual budget (for now) for an AAA game, much less unusual for one with strong MMO elements.
