I’m not 100% positive on the cool game part (that’s going to depend on execution, and the prototype will take still a while to download for me to even guess). I’m pretty sure it’s going to be a BIG game, though (even if it’s not truly finished I couldn’t see how this won’t be so).

What on earth makes you think that?

Derek Smart’s Desktop Commander:

Deserves a re-posting.

— Alan

That video was the cause of either the first or second threat of legal action by Derek smart against something awful.

They handled it better though. I think they just made fun of him harder.

On that note, let me remind you all of the most epic reply to any threat of legal action made by Derek Smart EVER.

https://www.somethingawful.com/game-reviews/completely-libelous-review/2/

P.S.: you can see Derek Smart did learn some things since then. Like letting his professional lawyers write the letters. ;)

Masterful move by Chris Roberts.

Somehow he managed to link Derek Smart with the mentioned article even though i don’t think there was any proof Derek Smart was behind it. Then he attacks Derek Smart in order to discredit the article. It is similar to linking support for pedophiles to a bill to save the puppies in order to tank it.

I feel like i’m back in the pope thread where everything is some grand conspiracy by the Illuminati backed by moon people.

Oh god the memories. Namely of JeffK and Taco teh Wonderdog.

I think this is my first post in this thread. It’s been so glorious. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I would get so much entertainment out of this.

I take an interest in $$ and burn rates and I know lots of other people have run the numbers, and this is largely treading over ground others have done in the past, but here’s my take on it:

Looking at this from a dollar standpoint, and being very conservative. For example - $2M per month burden rate on 260 employees (where this Wired article says they had 320 back in March), and discounting the first year as they didn’t just hire 260 employees on day 1, they’ve spent about $60M on h/c alone. Burden rate is the applied cost of salary, buildings, electricity, insurance, desks, computers, etc. I have 60 employees spread over 3 geos, so I’m just applying my own burden rate assuming a 60/40 split over low cost/high cost geos - again erring on the side of caution to give CIG the benefit of a doubt. They likely have spent more, but hey, let’s assume small numbers.

So, they had $30M to spend on talent, advertising, making movies, bling, whatever. Now looking at Juan’s calculations he did a few pages back, he may have missed something - as the Wired article pointed above for the 320 employees, also states they had collected $77M as of March - meaning they are essentially pulling in almost $2M a month as an income stream (90-77 = 13 over 7 months).

So the real question is how much has been spent on movies, talent, bling, etc. because whatever is left is the cushion - assuming they can somehow maintain a $2M income stream, they could effectively operate in perpetuity and never release the game.

Tom or someone else might be able to shed light on the movie costs - that is probably the biggest chunk. Plucking an arbitrary number out of the air just for dartboard sake, let’s assume they spent $20M, so they would have $10M left over.

Taking that assumption further - If / when their income stream drops to $1M a month, they would have 10 months left before running out.

Or, they could have already spent the $30M and are talking to investment angels as we speak.

But then, if I were a investor, I’d be lining up to fund more at a huge discount rate. The large risk and $$ have already been spent, and they could get some really good terms on that. Hey, if I had $12M, I could get a good chunk of ownership out of it.

But - until their investment stream drops below $2M / month, there really is no point in trying to project when things are going to get dicey. Every time people start rubbing their hands and mischievously grinning, they somehow pull out another ship & sign up more citizens.

In the meantime, we get a glorious show! It’s wonderful!

I think they are at 290 employees (per some stuff they said lately). But yeah, I do agree with your outlook, except that maybe the burn rate is slightly lower here (it seems they are leveraging fans) but probably not significantly so (a while ago we were talking about that $2 million a month as a ballpark for this).

However, with the funding what happened is that in June and July (just before DS came in) their revenue dropped from around $3 million per month (March-May) to $1 million per month. It’s since gone back up. In a way, DS response was provoked by a very real slowing in the funding. But that slowing might have been a blip, who knows.

Certainly there has to be an upper limit on how many people are willing to invest in this game. At close to 1 million backers, we are talking about a significant chunk of their potential customers already, unless this is wildly more popular than just about any other space shooter in recent times (which it might very well be).

But I agree with you they seem to be managing to keep the revenue stable just fine. Also I would love to see how much art has been produced already versus how much is planned. I have the feeling this project might not be that difficult to downsize once content is locked in, but that’s a very uninformed guess.

Was just thinking the same thing. I got a lot of mileage out of “SLOBBAR FARGORT” back in the day…

Is that 290 number salaried, workplace employees - or is that everyone/anyone with a finger on the game in some form?

Mmmm. Latest number seems to be 260+, as Tman says… They describe them as employees, so I’m guessing they are salaried, yes. Most likely some of them won’t be workplace employees (external contractors) and some of them will be low pay interns.

Forget Derek Smart. He contributed, said nothing negative for a couple of years, then decided this was a game development out of control. He pointed it out in his over the top style.

But for the people here who defend SC by attacking Derek, I suggest subtracting Derek completely from your thoughts. There is zero evidence DS had anything to do with the Escapist’s article, in spite of Roberts rambling rant in which he came across slightly deranged in his rants about Smart.

But forget Derek - there’s plenty to talk about with SC. The people here who are expressing concerns/skepticism about SC and Roberts aren’t doing it based on anything Derek has said. raising my hand It’s all about the huge money raised, the going off the rails (IMO as a very early contributor) in terms of loss of focus in the development, the selling of $1000 promises based on pretty pictures while the game we contributed to seems to be nowhere in sight, the reports not just in the Escapist article but elsewhere of developers talking about taking weeks to chase some silly idea Roberts forces them to work on (and then abandon when it turns out to be as stupid as they told him it would be,) a game that so far shows no signs of being actually developed anytime soon while Roberts is off cavorting with Hollywood stars, etc. None of which has anything to do with DS.

If the main defense of this project is “Derek Smart sucks” it’s a pretty weak defense.

In the meantime, Derek Smart has indeed taken credit for shopping around his “sources” to various publications. Only The Escapist fell for it.

(It’s hard to dig up one or two specific tweets confirming this, just read his timeline from the last few days if you can stomach it)

I believe citizenCon takes place this weekend, so we should get to see what’s going on in terms of progress on the game.

I shudder to think how much that is costing to put on. Are there any other ‘cons’ that a run by companies that have not even released their game yet?

This makes lots of sense. I can certainly curb my skepticism for a few days till CIG’s big reveal (or not!). Chris has all the incentive in the world to shut Derek up for good this weekend.

I would think the SC people would be all over this if true…is there an actual link for this? I did not see any evidence he made the comment.

Are the charging for the con? Maybe it’ll actually make them money. God knows they’re good at doing that.

I think it is a one evening deal - I was looking at their page and it says staring at 6pm in some hall in Manchester. It looks like it is $40 of British funny money. (~$61 usd)