I would argue that by the end of this film he is not conflicted anymore.
The opening gambit with Poe calling Hux and pretending to have a bad connection was immediately off-putting and terrible. I was groaning.
Leia floating through space, then force-pulling herself back into the ship may be one the dumbest things I’ve seen in a movie. It looked bad from a technical standpoint and it was just conceptually stupid. Yuck.
Every interaction between Luke and Rey, Kylo and Rey, or Kylo and Luke was gold. All three were terrific.
The throne room fight was amazing. From the Argento coloring to the fight choreography to the emotional beats, it kept me guessing. I really liked the outcome with Kylo going even darker despite cooperating with Rey.
I guess Leia will die or retire off-screen? Lame. I really wanted a meaty emotional send-off for her character.
Yeah I said it already but I agree with this completely, and this is what mattered to me. This is why I love this movie, even though it’s uneven and has some non-trivial problems elsewhere.
Understand Hamill’s dialogue about the film now. Jeez, this was trash.
Ok, but let’s think for a moment just why Luke is doing this… The most he could ever hope to gain with this this stunt is waste a minute of Kylo Ren’s time. As far as suicide mission goals go, that’s pretty weak.
It turns out to be a useful delay just by dumb luck, since the rebels take Luke’s appearance as a sign that there must be another exit. But if this was all Luke was going to accomplish and he knew it, how about letting the rebels know that they need to be running away right now? No, of course not. Better to give those idiots false hope, and have them stand in the doorway and gawk at the fake spectacle.
You make a compelling argument!
Haven’t read anything whatsoever of this thread and have no idea what the general consensus here is on the movie, but I just got back from seeing it and I am sooooo disappointed. The more I think about it, the more I hate it. Force Awakens was a weak movie, but stylistically worked for me. This one had bad jokes, visually (ie the way it was shot) it felt flat and boring, the narrative was scattered & had a few interesting ideas but just threw too much in there. Yes, Force Awakens echoed the old movies too much, but this just shat over everything, even the new stuff that FA had carefully set up.
Anyway… needed to vent a bit before going to bed. Curious to see what the general mood here on the forum is when I read the threads tomorrow! (hope I’m not THAT GUY that just seems to be contrarian)
The casino and adjacent race track reminded me of a similar local in another Lucas offering - Grim Fandango. I suppose they are both influence by some real place?
Oh, and can someone explain the Rey’s scene at the cave? I didn’t get that.
Unstructured rant, but god damn do I agree with Mack on this one.
This is where I stand on it. Yes there were issues and everything with Finn was dumb and a time waster but anything that had to do with the force was on point.
I enjoyed it. I do admit the bits with Finn and Rose seemed almost pointless. I had no problem with the status of the Rebellion, after all in the previous movie they lost pretty much all of their backing and support with the destruction of the Republic and even though they won the starkiller battle, it took a heavy toll on their forces. At this point, the 1st order was basically on mop up duty. Also, I was fine with the end of Snoke. Sure he was a very strong dark side user, ancient and powerful but he also had a weakness. He was so sure of his power, strength and control of Ren, that he could not even consider that Ren would betray him. That one weakness was enough to cost him his life regardless of how powerful he was. His ego was his downfall. History is littered with the corpses of great and powerful leaders who thought so highly of themselves that they don’t see the end coming, especially when its from one of their allies.
anyways I thought it was an entertaining movie and while it has its flaws it is still a worthy addition to the Star Wars saga.
Finally, regarding Rey’s heritage, Im not sure I completely buy into Kylo Ren’s story. Time will tell on that one but his version could simply be his way of taking advantage of her need for answers by isolating her psychologically, in order to strengthen her ties to him.
They clearly are twins or at least have some sort of relation. They did the whole force conversation and right afterwards Luke and leia had their twin telepathy thing going. That was clearly telegraphing something.
Thought they later explained that bit as Snoke having set up the connection. I’m really not sure where they’re going with all that, they’ve kind of painted themselves into a corner. It’d be odd if the “your parents were nobodies who don’t matter” bit really is what they meant. That’d mean all that build-up in two movies was a waste of time. (E.g. the flashback of Rey as a child, all those careful set up parallels between the child who was abandoned by her parents vs. the one who abandoned his).
It can’t be the twin thing again. It’d be preposterous on so many levels. If nothing else, Leia would have known how many babies she had… I thought that The Force Awakens was setting her up as Luke’s daughter, but clearly not. Not a ton of other options that would be recognizable to the viewers (rather than just different kind of “nobodies”). The grand-daughter of the emperor, or Obi-Wan?
So very odd. Maybe they started with the “Luke’s daughter” plan, decided it was still too derivative and incestuous, and are now trying to retcon it.
Snoke joined them mentally as part of his trap.
And ISIS claims literally every disaster that happens around the world. Not saying he isn’t telling the truth but I don’t trust what villains say at face values. Especially those who are obsessed with how amazing they are.
He is so deep in Kylos head that he knows his every thought except that he is about to die by force saber.
I think you’re reading way too much into it. If there’s any lesson the Star Wars movies have, it’s that everything is exactly as simple as it seems.
Didn’t they do it again after he was dead though? Or am I misremembering?
Regardless, I was happy with that revelation. And with Snoke just being Snoke. And with the kid at the end force-grabbing the broom.
I’d be happy if it was all face value, and they don’t feel the need to yank the rug out next episode for sake of a big twist.
Saw it and liked it. My only negative comments is the movie went on too long and Leia flying through space made absolutely no sense for her character. She’s never shown the ability to use that much (or any) Force abilities.
Unlike others in this thread, I enjoyed the Rose / Finn stuff.
Where TFA was a soft reboot of ANH, this was an almost complete inversion of TESB. Sure, there’s more (you could say too much more, really) going on but thematically and even structurally, I swear to god that was the story group’s angle.
Episode 9: Return of the Soft Reboot seems like a lock.