Seemed like Snoke pushed them into making contact, but it was still something coming from their power too, so I don’t specifically remember if they did it again after he was dead, but it wouldn’t seem weird to me if they did.
I liked Finn, I liked Rose, I liked their relationship a lot. But the casino had the tackiest production of the whole film—all digital and artificial feeling, their mission raised further questions about the goofy setup of the pursuit between the First Order and the rebels, and the movie felt too long. Finn and Rose were great, they just got stuck in the weakest part of the movie.
Leia and Kylo felt each other’s presence. Luke and Leia felt each other’s presence across the galaxy (or wherever). Rey and Kylo were connected (facilitated at least at the start by Snoke). Luke projects himself to everyone from across the galaxy. In the original films you’ve got Obi Wan and Vader sensing each other on the Death Star. The movies are full of people strong in the force making connections to various degrees, some relatives, some not. I don’t think that’s evidence that Rey and Kylo were biologically related, just that they’re both strong force users.
I don’t think Kylo was lying to Rey because she buys it. She’s clearly been struggling with some idea of what her past is, somewhere between not fully remembering it, and not fully accepting it. When he lays it out for her, it’s what she was sort of aware of but sort of afraid of. She doesn’t argue or disbelieve him, because it’s what she knows is the truth once he’s said it. I also don’t see what reason he would have to lie in that way.
Pretty much this whole thing. Maybe when I’m not on a phone I’ll expand, but the Rey/ Kyle stuff was great.
I hate that she stole my name.
I have mixed feelings on the movie – it never really gets going, and feels “small” - it is the first movie in the series to feel more like a (good) episode of Clone Wars/Rebels than a major movie. It sometimes feels like fan fiction, but it’s also the first movie in a long time to actually move the franchise forward rather than regurgitate beats. Maybe since Empire.
I agree with almost everything WhollySchmidt and others have said about the strengths of the Ren/Rey/Luke scenes – all of that, and the Snoke, Yoda and Leia parts – are great, and collectively make this movie rank highly in the franchise hierarchy – or would, if not for the fact that everything else is weak to terrible. The New Order characters are too over the top silly/stupid; the casino world was a weird, heavy-handed distraction; I was initially happy that we were finally getting a lot of spaceship action in a Star Wars movie but almost none of the space combat or related plot made sense.
Another thing I liked was some of the moral grey - the issues Luke had rebuilding the Jedi order; the Benicio Del Toro character (both actions and dialogue); Ren’s motivations; Rey’s confusion and constant anger which made her seem more like a dark side character than any Jedi character in the franchise; Yoda blowing up the temple. Also Poe’s heroic actions having negative consequences.
But even that is all undercut by some of the movie’s lack of clarity – was Snoke even a Sith Lord, or just an ancient creature who happened to be force-powerful? I don’t need an extended background of the character (and dislike that it’ll probably be created for some spin-off novel, comic or whatever), but it would greatly help this movie’s themes to better understand what he is, and whether he is yet another in the cycle of Sith lords, or something different that already shows evolution from that dichotomy – which would also color Luke’s opinions and actions.
One thing I absolutely despised: Luke’s death. It just seemed so pointless and arbitrary - he just “pooped himself out”? I didn’t even really understand wtf was happening. I was happy with his trick, and it resulted in a cool scene, but thought it was just his way of re-engaging with the rest of the characters and would lead to him physically rejoining the fight in the following movie, etc. – instead he just keels over and dies? WTF? What a terrible waste - and judged as a suicide mission, it made no sense and just seemed so worthless and unlikely to even help in any meaningful way.
It also just made me sad that this series of episodes now seems designed as 3 successive stories to send off the 3 main original characters, and that plan has been thwarted now by Carrie Fisher’s death. And New Order seems more like a North Korea analogue than a Nazi analogue - a small group of guys that got their hands on some tremendous weapons and cause great damage - they seems small and petty, unlike the massive scope of the Empire. The end of this trilogy just seems destined to peter out - nobody will really care when a buffoon like Hux is killed, and while Kylo is an interesting character, he seems so broken that it won’t be that satisfying to see him killed either, or surprising if he turns back to the light and yet that won’t be fully satisfying either since he’s done some unforgivable, monstrous things.
The threat isn’t as fundamental as “the Empire”, or the “Sith Lord” – instead it’s just stopping a handful of assholes who destroyed the established society because they happened to get their hands on some powerful weapons. In a way, this movie ended a lot of the magic and myth-building of the franchise. That’s not necessarily a bad thing if the future is in the hands of quality creators, but it feels like the end of a lot as well.
Yeah, for me it was a “search your feelings, you know it to be true” moment. Except it was the opposite of “I am your father”. :)
I think it’s very clear in the movie that Rey’s parents really are just nobodies who died, and it’s an interesting answer that better grounds the franchise rather than making the galaxy seem so small.
The more interesting question is whether that was really JJ Abrahm’s intention (which seemed to lean to making her Luke’s daughter), and with JJ taking over again for Episode 9, perhaps if his intention was different he will try to revert again.
Omg hahhahahhahhahah I’m dying!!
Return of the Jedi: Join me and we can rule the Galaxy as father and son.
The Last Jedi: Join me and we can rule the Galaxy as cryboy and nobody.
I’m really dying here haha
Who drops bombs in outer space? Rian Johnson does.
I was 8 when the original Star Wars released, and was thrilled.
My 9 & 11 year old kids were bored by The Last Jedi.
Luke’s moment-of-weakness contrivance followed by his death by Force hologram was an utter waste. Talk about a Luke-warm send-off. Couldn’t give him a brief John Wick moment?
Bah, I can’t find the passion to rant. Star Wars is pure marketing and CG. Any three random Marvel movies are better than every Star Wars flick since Empire.
Yeah, that part almost ruined the whole movie for me, looked like something from early Dr Who!
I’m still grappling with how much I actually enjoyed this movie, but one thing that is making me lean toward enjoying it less is just how GOOD all the Marvel films are by comparison when it comes to the plotting, character arcs, and most of all, motivations. Those intertwined films have really raised the bar for effects spectacles in every way beyond the effects themselves. They treat the audience with more respect for their intelligence IMO.
With that said, I think the Kylo/Rey/Luke/Leia stuff is rather good in this film and I was captivated by that. I also think the hyperspace jump through the First Order ship was one of those sci fi moments like the crash of the Enterprise in Star Trek: Generations that was as incredible on screen as it was in my head going in.
Also, I agree 100% with @Desslock that Luke’s sacrifice was not the way I saw him going out and was very disappointing. Maybe Mark Hamill told them it was time for him to go too since he seemed to have some issues with how Luke is portrayed so they wrote him out too?
Rian Johnson is the guy for the next trilogy right? I can’t decide if that’s a good thing now and I really loved Looper and was expecting this to be more like that where it seemed that they really thought it all through before filming.
It’s funny that I really don’t care about any force “irregularities” or anything. It’s space magic, I can’t be bothered to care about how internally consistent it is. Even Snoke isn’t a big deal to me, as when Return of the Jedi came out, The Emperor had just about as much screentime before being dispatched with about as much ceremony. I cared more about it then because I was a kid, but I imagine if I had been an adult at the time who had seen as many movies as I have now, I would have added the Emperor to the same “forgettable villain” pile that Snoke belongs in.
What does bother me are things like: if ramming ships at lightspeed into other ships is even remotely practical, clearly no one would be using turbo-lasers, they’d be propelling the smallest possible lightspeed capable projectiles, and no military ship would be larger than required to fire that weapon. Outside of transports for the movement of troops/supplies, which would probably just be unarmed because they’d get destroyed in one shot anyways. Basically might as well just fire X-Wings piloted at droids into enemy ships.
And maybe I’m being a little over-sensitive, but I walked away from the movie feeling sort of grossed out that I was supposed to be cheering for the team using suicide bombers. I feel like one noble self sacrifice is all well and good, but when suicide bombing is the actual strategy I start to feel a little dirty. Fine line, I know, but something about it didn’t sit right with me.
The emperor ‘worked’ because his mysterious past is part of his character. We know he is evil, we know he is powerful and we can only speculate how he got there and the speculations add to his flavour. The same goes for the Joker in TDK but it doesn’t work for Snoke because we have 6 backround films that span for decades and there’s no mention of him whatsoever.
RotJ is a good movie with some silly bears. I agree about the rest.
I was saying before the movie started I’m more excited for Infinity War than anything Star Wars. There’s no love or passion behind these movies, it’s like skilled artists doing commissions. The product is beautiful and technically sound but there’s no soul behind it. The people making the Marvel movies love what they’re doing and love those characters.
I am not a fan of all Marvel films but this year, Thor Ragnarok takes the crown as far as blockbusters are concerned. It is so good compared to Last Jedi.
It is true that a lot of fuss gets made over a film franchise that hasn’t even released a great movie in over 30 years. I suppose it is the childhood nostalgia. I didn’t hate or even dislike this movie, compared to Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones it is basically a towering work of genius. I think people forget Anakin’s virgin birth and midicholorians because they don’t want to remember. I can’t blame them.
But I’m extremely pragmatic and understand that what I want from a new Star Wars movie is to feel the way about it I felt as a kid, and that simply isn’t possible. The best I can hope for is an entertaining movie.
And yes, Thor Ragnarok was easily the best Blockbuster this year, and by a fair margin. I found the first two Thor movies utterly forgettable, so I wasn’t going in with high expectations.
Dont want to waste time, but man was this movie bad. This movie made Suicide Squad really good. This was TERRIBLE. It made me cringe and feal REALLY sorry for all the actors. To me this is a really really awfully messy movie and feels nothing like Star Wars.
WTF how are they giving Star Wars to Rian Johnson. what are they smoking at disney??!?!?!?!?!?!
BTW, If you can go lightspeed you can destroy anything huge. So stupid.
I’m not certain if I’ve ever hated a movie as much as this one. I was annoyed at all the giddiness over AFA when that movie had already been made. Loved the original characters and their interactions (except for the excessive schmaltziness of Jedi toward its end), but these depthless characters I can’t be bothered with. They toned down the Mary Sue aspects of Rey, but Trashman Trooper, Wedge 2.0, and the others are completely boring characters.
And what a stupid goddamn plot.
Some more observations on the chase plot:
Given that Finn and Rose are able to leave and return without incident, couldn’t they have sent someone to get some more fuel to relieve the time pressure? You know, since Holdo and Leia’s plan ultimately revolves around holding out until someone answers their calls for help.
The First Order call back their strike craft because they’re apparently too far away for the Star Destroyers to cover them. What does that even mean in this context? They seemed to be extremely effective against the larger resistance cruisers.
Benecio betrays the resistance by revealing that they’re trying to escape on sensor-cloaked transports. Hux confirms this with a scan that can detect cloaked ships (just as well they didn’t use that one in the first place.) Apparently Poe told Finn’s group about the change in plans. So why are they still trying to complete the original plan of knocking out the tracking system?
Are the smaller transports capable of entering hyperspace? The similar-looking ones in ESB were. If so, it seems like a better strategy would have been to scatter the dozen-plus transports in different directions, overloading the enemy’s ability to follow them. If they aren’t capable of it, it makes the previous point even worse: there’s no way for them to capitalise on knocking the tracking offline.