If you’re going to release a game that the featured class in is Jedi, then why make it so ridiculous and time-wasting to reach?
Well in any RPG you have to have goals. If, for instance, a D&D game started you out at level 30 with nowhere to go from there, it would take some of the fun out of it.
Sure, the “leveling” (or whatever you want to call it) treadmill to become a Jedi is probably tedious as hell. But isn’t that more of a general indictment of MMORPG gameplay, than a specific critique of the Jedi thing? I don’t have a problem in principle with a game rewarding effort and time investment, or laying out some holy grails to be reached.
Ok, but again then, doesn’t it just mean that advancement in SWG has to be fun – not that it’s inherently a bad design choice to make it hard to become a Jedi? Why not have that be the “brass ring” – something has to be?
I don’t think that it’s SWG’s fault, exactly.
The whole idea that multiplayer gaming has to be based around a 30 year old paper gaming system is just nonseniscal.
Yet here we are, still making D&D variants for Star Wars geeks to get their game on.
I’m not denying that at all, Gordon. In fact I believe in that aspect you’re completely right, but as I mentioned before I think it’s ridiculous to have to start a new character and go through even more shit to eventually have that character die and you have to start all of your hard work over.
I know that there are many pro-permadeath people on these boards, however I’m not one of them. It’s easily equatable to a 80 hour RPG without saves on any console. That would be hell, and add that to the fact that no matter how great the game is, if you make it to where your character dies for good, people aren’t going to continue playing it.
I like Star Wars a lot, I’m not the biggest fan, but it’s a good story that lends itself to games. I just don’t understand the punishment that’s levied out to players who want to be jedis and don’t have a million hours of playtime to attain that goal.
I don’t think that it’s SWG’s fault, exactly.
The whole idea that multiplayer gaming has to be based around a 30 year old paper gaming system is just nonseniscal.
Bingo. That’s the problem. It’s compounded by the fact that the model is successful in many regards even to the extent when computer game people talk about ‘roleplaying’ qualities in games they’re often talking explicitly about the levelling/power-inflation paradigm.
SWG seems to be taking some of the sting out of it while still keeping the system in place. While personal power is still important one gains it through individual skills rather than all-encompassing levels. ‘Hit points’ are also made less important as all characters (varying with race and stats) can take similiar amounts of damage. Skills are important for avoiding that damage and inflicting it but the idea, as I understand it, is to make it more practical for characters of differing levels of ability to still group effectively. There are many other ways in which inter-character cooperation makes for power more readily than the old internal levelling systems. I think, don’t quote me, that the idea is that more newbies and casual players interested in the multiplayer-cooperative aspects of MMORPGs often feel alienated by the old acute power-levelling systems. Ironically, as I recall, it’s these folks that actually stick around longest as they form communities and entertain each other as much as the MMORPG does. Power levellers tend to depend more on the game developers producing content, and at a high rate of consumption, to keep themselves amused. They’re also the first to quit when they’ve ‘finished’ the content.
Aiming at a more social and casual gamer seems to be a deliberate design decision. That’s not to say there’s not plenty of room for competative types as SWG seems to have quite a bit of elective PvP content in which one can indulge at one’s own level of preferred comfort (or discomfort) and there are definitely careers that allow for successful soloists to do their own thing (scouting, bounty-hunting, smuggling, etc.) while still contributing the the communal interactions that make SWG such an interesting premise.
I wouldn’t call SWG a level grind but I can see how one could do just that if one wished as well.
Maybe it doesn’t have to be expressed in terms of traditional leveling or powergaming, but I still say some kind of “advancement,” some sense of “moving forward in the world” is essential to the enjoyment of an RPG. For me it is, at least. Maybe because I have to compensate for my lack of advancement in the real world… :?
I think that “advancement” is indeed what makes RPGs work. But there’s a lot of way to skin that cat, besides, you know, skinning enough cats that you finally “level up” in cat skinning.
I agree with you. I still wanna be a smuggler. Only thing is I’m not sure if this is going to have what I’m looking for once the space expansion is released. With that I want to be able to wander around my ship before taking off. Also I want to be able to customize the outside and make it much more ‘mine’.
I’m sure it’s going to be nothing like that but I can hope and wish. That is part of a dream Star Wars MMOG that me and a few of my friends have been talking about for years now.
Shadowbane effectively tops out at right around 50. You can get higher but you have to do so by killing other players. The game is still fun due to the amount of things to do in it.
Let’s step back and be honest for a minute, though. I mean who here really thought that SWG would be something more than another crank of the “spit star wars product out” machine. I’m not talking about who wanted it to be more, hell everyone wants more. But who realisitically expected more?
Nah, Han’s the man (I know, that only looks like it rhymes in print, say it with a Jamaican accent and then it rhymes). Han’s got it all. He has the best line in Star Wars: “It is for me, sister!” He has the sideburns, the car, the pistol, the faithful badass companion, the connections, he gets to be a General, and he gets the girl in the Jabba palace bikini in the end. Luke gets a sister, a dead father, he loses a hand, and he’s still whiny at the end of the picture.
Bah!
I’m a scoundral. I just like the sound of that.
“Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.”
[size=2]Yeah, Derek has a point that Solo is much less cool without space travel…[/size]
HAN SOLO: Han Solo. I’m captain of the Millennium Falcon. Chewie here tells me you’re looking for passage to the Alderaan system.
BEN KENOBI: Yes, indeed. If it’s a fast ship.
HAN SOLO: Fast ship? You’ve never heard of the Millennium Falcon?
BEN KENOBI: Should I have?
HAN SOLO: Well… no, not really. I don’t really HAVE the ship WITH me. If you want to hang tight for a bit, order some drinks, wait for the expansion pack…
BEN KENOBI: Never mind. Come, Luke–let’s go hunt some wamprats.
But wait! I’m wearing the shoes that made the Kessel Run in less than 12 parsecs!
(Incidentally, how can you complete a race in “less” than a measure of distance? That’s like saying “I ran the New York Marathon in less than 2 miles.”)
