I’m kind of in the same boat as you, Zeke. I just turned 28 and have been perpetually alone for much of my life. When you go so long without results, it’s really hard to pull yourself out of it. After a while it seems clear that the problem is you, and that weighs on you and turns into a self fulfilling prophecy. You go awhile without attracting women, you feel unattractive, which then becomes wired into your brain, and then women are less attracted to you because you give off the vibe that you aren’t confident. It’s a psychological cycle which I haven’t been able to get out of.
I hear what you’re saying about meeting new people. I’m not much of a conversationalist. It’s very hard for me to walk up to a stranger and just start talking about something. I don’t really know what to say to people I don’t know in general, let alone a woman I find attractive. I know it’s a skill you can develop like anything else, but there’s just a psychological barrier for me. It sucks because I generally like people, I guess I just have always been passive in making connections with them.
Take an improv class. I was / am in the same situation. I’m not Mr. Social or anything, but I can at least hold my own in a crowd.
Otherwise, just learn to be comfortable with the social awkwardness. Most people are awkward. Some express it by being extra effusive in conversation, so it’s hard to tell.
ZekeDMS
5623
Delirium-See, on top of the whole “one second date a year” issue, I’m generally misanthropic. I never liked people as a kid even, much less an adult. And when it’s added to the “They all hate me anyway” cycle…
Gourmand, four years of theatre actually. I don’t have any issue talking to people I don’t know within context. When I was behind a counter, easy. Sales pitch, no problem. When I’m interviewing people, no problem. But as soon as it’s a personal encounter…I lock up.
That’s actually a pretty good idea, I think, for me. I had been thinking about joining Toastmasters to try to work on getting comfortable talking in front of people (which I of course haven’t done, because I’m gutless) but improv sounds like a lighter/more fun alternative to helping improve in that area.
ZekeDMS
5625
It is fun, it’s just learning to transfer the skill that was my issue. Not a bad way to meet people though, especially if you’ve got a quick wit. Maybe impress someone!
Haha, no I’m not very witty. I think I would be terrible at improv, actually, but I think it could be helpful in getting over social anxieties.
People who are witty can be terrible at improv, too. If they aren’t mindful they can dominate scenes, and turn everything into “LOL, let’s be zany! Oh look, a velociraptor.” Not a lot of fun.
You’ll be awesome if you can just manage to be present. Which, it sounds like you’re totally capable of doing.
re Zeke: Right on.
It sounds like I’m in a similar space as you. Anxiety aside, my biggest issue is dealing with the depressed mindset of “Aww man, no one wants to be around me”. Which rationally I have no issues being like “Fuck you, self. What a terrible and unrealistic outlook”, but on an emotional level it’s hard to shake.
Well, that and my OkCupid dates seem to all be fucking nutters. One last week told me she recently lost 70 lbs, within 7 sentences of chatting with each other. Then, later in the week she sent me a picture of her sneaking a bar of cream cheese under her desk at work. So she could eat it. I don’t even fucking know.
One this week was 40 lbs heavier than her photo, self centered, and dumb as a brick. When we ordered food I chose a Prosciutto half salad. For which, I was immediately ridiculed (“Really, a half salad?”). The rest of the conversation was about her challenging work as a day care admin, and how she doesn’t make enough money. Fascinating.
So, my hope is still on learning to dance. It’s god damn terrifying. As in, it’s the most uncomfortable situation I can possible imagine putting myself in. But, it sounds better than braving the crazies on OkCupid at the moment. It also sounds better than being lonely.
Crazies on OKC != Crazies on Craigslist. Nuff said.
— Alan
ZekeDMS
5629
Truth. Craigslist was nothing but disaster for me. I decided to take a swing over and see what things looked like these days.
“Looking for hot older men… - 23 (Tolleson)”
“I love older men, looking for someone attractive, no skin & bones men, no beer belly men, sorry just not for me.”
“I’m 23, in school for psychology, no job though I do some online tutoring and paper writing when I can.”
And of course, the pictures.
So I guess it isn’t THAT different.
ZekeDMS
5630
Yeesh. I just ran into this profile on OKcupid. I’m now dizzy. She seems like a nice person (that I can find absolutely no interest in), but that’s a horribad way to present yourself.
Does this girl have no friends? Does she think the FGAS is just a diagonal angle, not a high one? Why, why would you ever take that photograph five times?
Amazingly enough, her profile is her pictures in written form. It’s all one big long paragraph punctuated by smileys and mentioning her desire to be a trophy wife. Yikes, man, just yikes.
Trophy wife? She might want to look up the definition of that.
“What contest in hell did I win…”
I tempted to ask my other half if I can start meeting people on OKCupid just to witness the crazy first hand. Unfortunately, based on the last two pages, I’m more likely to bear-hug her and say “never leave me” over and over.
The only way to deal with a lack of self-confidence is exactly that; to just deal with it.
This is quite true - self confidence can be temporarily boosted by other people (friends/family) saying nice things, but ultimately the only concrete improvement will come from you. I was incredibly shy during my teens and even managed to ignore the not-so-subtle hints being given to me by a girl who, if she were to have gone one step further, would have leapt onto my face. Looking back I cringe at every memory. I forced myself to become more outgoing, and it helped. As JM will attest for sure, as I’m frequently an idiot in public.
Also those pictures that Zeke posted are a little scary.
Panic not. That’s a normal male reaction :) Dancing is the quintessential way to meet women though. It works a million times better if you focus on learning to dance and let everything else take care of itself.
In most places salsa’s a fairly universal language - what are you planning on?
Hey Zeke, is there a chapter of the ACM or IEEE at your college? Long shot, I know, since it’s a community college, but worth checking into. Are there clubs, and if so, is there a boardgaming or pen & paper gaming club? If not, you might look into starting one.
The last game night I hosted may have been majority male, but it was a close call, and a couple of the girls who showed up were definitely on the prowl for a reason to stay the night in Baltimore, if you know what I mean. wink wink nudge nudge
(Well, okay, to be fair, they were until one of them started feeling ill and they went home early.)
Zeke and delirium, I know it sounds really tough to just do it, but believe me, I was in the same boat as you guys. When I turned 30 I had pretty much never dated, I spent most of my time working or playing/talking about video games, and while I could have a good time with my friends and they all thought I was fun, I was cripplingly shy around new people and convinced that I wasn’t capable of saying anything they’d be interested in.
Then I turned 30 and decided that if I thought my life was so uninteresting other people wouldn’t care about, it was time to go do some more interesting shit. So I started inviting friends out regularly to get together at a bar, started inviting co-workers out regularly for drinks, and eventually did what I said above - just went to a bar and tried to talk to new people, just to make friends. There were some awkward moments the first few times, but I just sucked them up because I knew it would help me get better at it.
What I found was that a) the more I went out and just forced myself to talk to new people, the easier it was to do it the next time, and b) the more I went out and met new people, or had parties with my friends, the more interesting stories I had to tell. Everyone can relate to a story about some funny thing that happened the other day, so it really fills you with that ammunition for small talk. Another thing that actually works well (compared to online dating where you get a lot of crazies) is speed dating - you are forced to talk to a bunch of new people in a night, and you learn that you can actually have a decent conversation with just the basics (“What do you do?” “Why did you move here?” “Where did you go to school?” and so on).
Once you are used to talking to new people and meeting new people regularly, you find that talking to girls you are attracted to isn’t really any harder - you know you are going to meet more people, so the pressure to succeed with this particular girl is a lot less. These days I’m like the complete opposite of how I was 15 months ago - I can go out to a bar and walk up to any group of people and just start a conversation. No “openers” or other BS, just say hi, ask them how the night is going, why they are out, etc. If they don’t want to talk, you will get that vibe really quickly and you can just go talk to someone more friendly. I will say though, that it helps if you don’t walk up with the idea in your head that you are going to get some particular girl’s number. Walk up to make friends and see what they are about. And if it’s a group of guys and girls, talk to the guy first - it’s easier and it also communicates to them that you didn’t come over to hit on someone. If the conversation goes well, you can hit on her later ;)
On the flip side of the coin, I hate bars and avoid them as best I can. grins Bars are not a necessity; meeting new people is.
Zuwadza
5637
Ugh. It really depends on the bars. Some bars are better than others. I’ve found “pubs” to be harder to meet people in than “clubs.” If people are there for music or dancing I find it’s a lot easier. Pubs tend to have groups of people there to wind down or just start their night.
Well, ok so bars are my thing, but the same principle applies to anywhere you are meeting people. And to be clear - I’m talking about Fri night after 9 or so meeting people who are hanging around the bar itself. Usually that’s people who came out to have fun and meet others - if they just want to hang with friends, they get a table or go somewhere less visible.
Zuwadza - I hate the music you find in both pubs and clubs. Me, if I’m going to meet a girl, chances are it’ll be through OkCupid or through geeky/nerdy activities (like the NODE, or building robots, or a MtG draft, or pen & paper gaming…)
Salsa and Swing. You’re the 4th person to recommend Salsa, so I’ll take it as a good sign! Swing because the music already grabs me. A friend also said it’s a decent place to start.
