The action roguelite thread

Jesus Christ. You people that are looking forward to this know that you’re some kind of masochists, right?

My guess is there’s not going to be a Switch version.

https://twitter.com/mossmouth/status/1294330530691862528?s=20

I just posted it because it was relevant to the thread,I never played it before, I only tried the free version (and bounced back from it)

Despite my previous, somewhat cold impression of Risk of Rain 2, I’m playing it a lot in the last days.
I was able to finish the game (on easy), and got a few more unlocks, and well, I kind of learned how really play the game, what pace is the right one, and what are some of the secrets.

One of the more divisive design decisions it has is how challenge/unlock oriented is.

There are challenges for everything, and each one usually unlocks something. A new character, a new item that can appear randomly in the game, a new loadout for a character, a new game modifier…
But the game perhaps goes too far. To have so many things to unlock, it means the base, starting game is somewhat devoid of content.
Therefore, you have to unlock most characters to even be able to play them. There are three that aren’t that hard, but others require a more involved process. And their alternative loadouts are even worse, some of the weapons are tied to challenges that you could play for dozens of hours without getting them naturally, you have to do runs and play in a specific way to obtain them.

And perhaps the most egregious case, there are a series of optional game modifiers, what would be mutators for example in Streets of Rogue, that are all locked (hell, locked and hidden) behind a complex challenge. The list is here
https://riskofrain2.gamepedia.com/Artifacts
To unlock each one (so yes you have to repeat the process a dozen times), you have to obtain a secret cryptic code hidden in the different game environments, learn their purpose, reach the fifth stage of the game in a run, then go to a location where there are a series of interactable objects, use the code, a special teleport will appear and upon using it you fight a special fight to obtain the game modifier.

In other words, this is too much obscure, look-how-hardcore-I-am shit for what it should be basic features of the game, just a series of options like ‘Friendly fire is enabled for both survivors and monsters alike’ or ‘Fall damage is doubled and lethal’.

On the other hand… you can unlock everything by editing manually your save game, with just Notepad. I can only think the devs made it easy to bypass all the unlocks this way as a conscious decision.

I’m surprised to hear this! I think the enemy variety is just fine and art direction excellent. Almost all the enemies are distinct, from their appearance to their attacks–and that’s disregarding the ice, fire, nasty green and elite variants. When you start throwing several types together and in such vast quantities it’s pretty damned impressive, and half the fun is trying to juggle/manage them.

Just for some perspective, I sunk 100 hours into this before it left Early Access and played the original game a lot (both with friends and solo). Risk of Rain 2 is one of the best translations to 3D I’ve encountered and while the soundtrack is great here, I think the original OST is still better.

This is the ideal but most of the time it’s a war with the ever-increasing difficulty. If you spend too long exploring levels for more items then that’ll bite you, go straight for the teleporter and you might not be powerful enough to tackle the boss and rush of enemies. A big part of the appeal for me is playing within that margin. I’m less interested when I’m doing 28 level monsoon runs co-op with my friends and we’re so far beyond the power curve that the game is throwing hundreds upon hundreds of enemies at us and the chain effects are so absurd that my computer literally dies from the number of effects. I think Risk of Rain is a lot more fun when you’re approaching the peak of the power curve but not quite over it; when you’re powerful but still vulnerable.

I’ve wrestled with this before. I look at a lot of roguelikes and roguelites I’ve played and a large part of the experience is random, and you’re either trying to mitigate that risk or you’re rolling with whatever you get. Risk of Rain is indeed a game of loot boxes but a big part of the magic is synergising and stacking effects. Sometimes those synergies are accidental, sometimes they’re intentional. 3D printers, multiple choice ‘booths’ and healing, utility and attack coloured chests help steer your build somewhat. Items only get you so far, but so does playing well.

Yeah, the roster is great and each character plays very differently, suiting different item combos and playstyles. The Captain is new so not sure on that one yet.

I’ve never played with randoms so can’t vouch for the server browser but with direct co-op games with friends we’ve never had any issues since it launched into Early Access! The original Risk of Rain co-op is a port-forwarding, NAT type and IP address nightmare that was prone to disconnects (and no rejoins).

Yeah, I’m torn on this too. A lot of the challenges/achievements of the game are great fun to try and conquer in themselves, and the rewards add more variety too, but at the same time some of the really cool stuff (like the Artifact modifiers and certain characters) can be a lot of work to unlock. Take the Command artifact (which is in the original game), it allows you to select what items you get from chests (categorised as white, green, yellow, orange, red and blue). This totally transforms the experience into something a lot more deterministic and allows you to indulge in all your wildest theorycrafting OP combo fantasies. Should this be available straight away? I don’t think so. Should it be a cryptic bastard to unlock? I don’t think so either.

A great many of them you would struggle to discover/unlock without external help and I just hate that. I’ve managed to unlock a few of them mostly on my own, otherwise I’ve played with the Artifacts thanks to my friends who cheated (one of them got 100% of the achievements yesterday and the other is working on the last one now, just shy of 600 hours played between them–I don’t think I’ll be that hooked!)

So yeah, I’m a big fan of Risk of Rain 2 despite a few… I dunno, conflicting thoughts on it. If you’ve got friends, I think it’s totally worth trying to explore and play together. At the same time, I think it’s also a great game solo because your success is your own.

I did a small summary of the secret areas I know:

Aqueduct (2nd stage) : Two pressure plates (place engineer turrets to activate) open the big locked door, secret elite fight inside.
Wetland (2nd stage) : cave in cliff below big square thingie.
Rallypoint Delta (3rd stage) : timed chest, rush it under 10 minutes, it gets you the Preon Accumulator.
Abyssal Depths (4th stage) : legendary chest in ground near center of map, behind some plants. Also, take fuel cell to Rex in this level to unlock him.
Siren’s Call (4th stage) : secret boss fight by destroying nests with eggs.
Sky Meadow (5th stage): below area with laptop to open access to Bulwark’s Ambry (artifacts).
Void Fields (hidden): Hidden stage, access below spawn point in secret shop. Beat to unlock Acrid.
Gilded Coast (hidden) : Hidden stage with boss fight, need to activate an Altar of Gold.
A Moment, Fractured (hidden): Hidden stage, to unlock the Merc, or alternate skins on Hard. Use portal on the 3rd stage on the second loop.
A Moment, whole (hidden): Hidden stage with boss fight, reach A Moment Fractured with lunar item ‘beads of fealty’.

So @TurinTur, overall, would you recommend Risk of Rain 1+2 to me? I noticed the bundle is on sale on Xbox Live this week for $11.54.

I didn’t like RoR1, but I’m liking 2. So for that price, yes, given that RoR2 is $15 on Steam!

It’s also perfectly playable solo, it isn’t really a inherently coop game.

Rogue legacy 2 really looks like more of the same, in regards to grind at least

A very veteran player of this genre plays for two hours, and still get smacked by the first boss, with the boss still having 80% hp.

Veteran player, sure, but looks like maybe he’s playing wizard for first time and doesn’t have many damage upgrades yet. Not to mention, not being at full health and being on a character with Diva, so he went into the fight significantly handicapped. Finally, first time seeing boss, I think, so no idea what attack patterns look like. On his second try, he’s taking double damage because of a relic.

Rogue Legacy was at he forefront of a revolution. I found it meh, ultimately. It lacks the in-run upgrade flavor that dominates these games, and the persistant upgrades are very granular and not that interesting.

I’m seeing the same in the sequel. They have retained the “legacy system”, which never made any sense and is really just “here’s 3 characters to choose from and some of them have traits that might be positive, negative, or both and this apparently has no bearing on your last character”.

It feels like there’s more platformy sections this time around, but there’s something slightly off on the movement for me. The combination of those two things is certainly not to my taste.

Although it looks like they are adding stuff on the “in run upgrades” front. I think there may have been a patch but I did like 10 runs yesterday and saw nothing but found something just now.

So there are two sorts of special upgrades you can get in run. Some of them are permanent - I just unlocked dash. The others are just sort of powerups, but I’ve been sort of underwhelmed by the few I’ve seen. E.g. For the cost of 31 max health (this run only), every 5th hit does more damage. Or For the cost of 31 max health (I think all the upgrades cost max health), do and take 200% more damage (someone good at this game would rock that, of course; that’s not me). I saw another I can’t recall. And in one case I had a choice to take a refill on health and mana (which I needed at the time - down to 10 health). It’s always “take one of two”, that I have seen.

The permanent ones are. . . odd. I’ve seen two I think? You are put through a series of challenges which range from “here are 10 mildly obnoxious challenges you need to clear” to “fuck off I didn’t sign up to play Super Meatboy inside your game”. These are brief areas - some are just a normal room, some a bit bigger - where you have to use the power you are gaining quite a bit (uh, sort of). Very platformy, in the case of dash. I again don’t get along with the controls so I found this frustrating, although I got it 4th try (when you enter, you get topped off on health I think, but you can die in them).

The other one was weirder. There’s a section where there are these glowing red things and if you are violent within them (attack or cast a spell), you get shot at with not a lot of chance to dodge. Violence is the only way to open doors (attack, spell, or the lb spinny jump maneuver). So, that’s a problem. In some of these cases, clever use of spinny jump maneuver (which you can use to get extra air by bounding off of certain objects) can save the day. But eventually you get a prompt saying “the nigthmare ahead of me, perhaps there’s some way to clam it?” or something. That didn’t make sense to me and I missed, on that one, that you can hit RB to interact with and turn it off. this doesn’t last forever, but it’s key to the next section. . .

Where you have to find within fields of these things (sometimes overlapping). Now that I know you can turn that shit off for a time I can probably beat this although my first two attempts failed. I’m not sure what power I am getting from this though.

There’s more traits that change the game visually this time around, at least based on what I rmeember. There’s a sort of Gameoby like one. There’s censored enemies. There’s one that makes objects too bright that. . . honesltly wasn’t good for my eyes when playing. There’s another weird one that I’m not sure what they were doing to the screen. And there’s diva, which puts a spotlight on you but you can’t see outside of it which is kind of a pain. I think some of these feel out of place.

But traits now give bonus gold (or did they before? I don’t remember), as a % of gold found. And there’s an upgrade for incrfeasing this somehow but it;s pricey (level 1 is 1500+ gold, I have only gotten into the 1100s or so twice). Vegan - food damages you - gives a cool +50%. Pacficist gives +75% but, uh, pacifist (you can still spinny jump through doors). So don’t plan on any boss killing I guess (although if you hit an enemy with spinny jump you do very light damage).

I find the hitboxen in this game - or whatever it’s using - also to be finnicky and this does not pair well with the movement and I not getting along. I’ve had some trouble on the mage.

I think fans of the first will probably like this and for now I will keep playing. But I am not wild about it by any stretch.

Big nerf to the final boss of RoR2

Captain’s Supply Drop now presses the buttons on Abandoned Aqueduct

Heh, I was wondering whether this worked.

Atomicrops is releasing on Steam and GOG next week, and with a meaty update:

New Content

-New Character: Dandelion - Flying. Starts with Cleats and Crampons, unique movement system.
-New Character: Thyme - Days are longer, lose time when damaged. Starts with a pig.
-New Weapon: Flamethrower - Lights enemies on fire (and crops, unless you’re careful).
-New Weapon: Catling Gun - Aim, hold the trigger and watch things die.
-New Weapon: Biodegrader - Flings massive explosives for great area damage.
-New Tractor: Tunneler Tractor - Creates a tunnel back to your farm or breaks a crust if already on the farm.
-New Upgrade: Fraidy Fert - Create fertilizer when damaged
-New Upgrade: Early to Rose - Harvesting Roses increase day length
-New Upgrade: Chill Beets - Harvesting Heart Beets increase day length
-New Upgrade: Chrono Seeds - Sowing seeds increase day length
-New Upgrade: Chrono Weeds - Cutting weeds increase day length
-New Upgrade: Hotwire - No tractor cooldown but 25% chance to take damage when using a tractor
-New Upgrade: Beet Drop - 25% chance to drop a Heart Beet Seed when damaged
-New Upgrade: Duck Wings - Fly! (allows player to pass to zones without repairing bridges and allows them to traverse connecting passages to other zones)
-New Upgrade: Bundit’s Foot - Increases luck by 50%
-New Upgrade: Daily Orchard - Gain a tree every day.
-New Upgrade: Shroom-mates - Mushrooms grow near the well every day.
-New Permanent Upgrades - added 12 new permanent upgrades
-Online Leaderboards
-Daily Runs
-Definitely didn’t add a secret reward which only the very best players will unlock. (PS: Remove from patch notes. We shouldn’t tease them like this. Nobody is even gonna be able to unlock this, it’s so difficult.)
-Added new tutorial popups
-Added Key Rebinding
-Added Streamer Mode: Replaces all leaderboard names with friendly names

Balance

-Year 1 has been made easier.
-Heart Beets now drop as seeds, requiring you to farm them to gain health.
-Buffed Sniper Rifle damage
-Increased health of tree monsters
-Increased health of Gatling Gun Bundits
-Reduced Rain Cloud scroll duration by half
-Final boss now drops Cornucopias
-Final Boss skull spawn rate ramps up slower on year 10
-Final boss has less health on year 10

I’ve literally just come off Atomicrops after a rough time trying to crack year 3. Looking forward to the update; that’s a lot of new stuff so I’m excited!

Atomicrops is one tough game though and after a brief hiatus I’m still discovering new things, item synergies and tricks. There are some mighty puns here.

So, it’s not out yet, but it has an update? Was it in beta or something before? Or it was available in Early Access, but not anymore? Or was it available on Epic Games Store, and is now coming to Steam and GoG?

That last one.

About time. Yeesh. I spent waaaay too much time beating my head against this on the Switch.

-Tom

Curse of the Dead Gods has released a new update with a tutorial, gear recycling and new room weapon upgrade. It seems they are two updates away of finishing EA: