4311

Yup, that’s why playing chicken with Republicans won’t work. Why it can’t work. They’ve already proven that they’re willing to destroy democracy - what do they care about the full faith and credit of the US? They will absolutely trash the economy to avoid being primaried.

4312

From NYT:

“Let me be clear: bringing the so-called bipartisan infrastructure plan to a vote without the #BuildBackBetter Act at the same time is a betrayal,” Representative Rashida Tlaib, Democrat of Michigan, said on Twitter on Tuesday. “We will hold the line and vote it down.”

So…still no headway made on the two Democratic bills. My morning coffee hasn’t quite kicked in yet, so Cynical 138 is winning out over Positive 138. We’re gonna fuck this whole thing up. And IF the infrastructure bill gets passed, it will be with few Progressives and a good number of GOP votes so that Repubicans can hold that over our heads that the Democratic Party can’t even keep their shit together and govern.

And I’m sorry, this petty language being used like “so-called bipartisan infrastructure plan” doesn’t help anyone. It makes Tlaib look like an idiot, for one. And it’s just further dividing the party when it doesn’t need to be divided at the moment. Of ALL moments, right-fucking-NOW is when we should come together as a party and get shit done. The Tlaibs, the Manchins, the AOCs, the Sinemas, etc. need to step off their soapboxes and get this shit done. Oh, and make sure the full faith and credit of the US doesn’t get fucked as well.

Sorry, end rant. I’m just really frustrated this morning that we as a party are constantly getting in our own way. We barely even need Republicans to fuck up our plans, we do a good enough job of it on our own.

Coffee infusion commencing.

4313

Remember the Democrats are the party of everybody else, and the GOP are the party of one ground. It’s just harder to wield the Democratic influence around such a diverse cast.

4314

I guess I’ll wait to see if we fail. I feel the same frustration, but I think Pelosi thinks she has or will get the votes she needs. I doubt a single R will vote for the bill, but if they do and the bill passes, nobody will remember who voted for or against it.

With the reconciliation bill, the problem remains Sinema. By all accounts, she’s not engaged in any sort of meaningful negotiation about that bill, doesn’t really seem to know what is in it, and is so unpopular in Arizona that she stands no chance of reelection. So there’s not an ounce of leverage to be applied.

4315

A good piece from Friedman in the NYT:

So, I repeat: Do Representative Josh Gottheimer, the leader of the centrist Democrats in the House, and Representative Pramila Jayapal, leader of the Congressional Progressive Caucus, have the guts to stop issuing all-or-nothing ultimatums and instead give each other ironclad assurances that they will do something hard?

Yes, they will each risk the wrath of some portion of their constituencies to reach a compromise on passing infrastructure now and voting rights and the Build Back Better social spending soon after — without anyone getting all that they wanted, but both sides getting a whole lot. It’s called politics.

And are centrist Democratic Senators Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema ready to risk not being re-elected the way Liz Cheney has by forging a substantive compromise to ensure that consequential election integrity, infrastructure and Build Back Better measures go forward? Or are they just the Democratic equivalents of the careerist hacks keeping Trump afloat — people so attached to their $174,000 salaries and free parking at Reagan National Airport that they will risk nothing?

And, frankly, is the Biden White House ready to forge this compromise with whatever pressures, Oval Office teas, inducements, pork and seductions are needed? It could energize the public a lot more by never referring to this F.D.R.-scale social reform package as “reconciliation” and only calling it by its actual substance: universal pre-K, home health care for the sick and elderly, lower prescription drug prices, strengthened Obamacare, cleaner energy, green jobs and easier access to college education that begins a long-overdue leveling of the playing field between the wealthy and the working class. Also, the White House needs to sell it not only to urban Democrats but to rural Republicans, who will benefit as well.

4316

That’s all fine but

is so low on the order of importance that this kind of “big tent Democrats or gtfo” sort of commentary feels rather off. Requiring a Democratic President in today’s climate to sell a deal to rural Republicans is a bit of when pigs fly sort of demand. Wouldn’t Jesus appeal to rural republicans?, conservative Op Ed columnist in national paper opines.

4317

As always, Friedman is completely disconnected from reality.

4318

I think that many of Biden’s plans actually appeal heavily to rural republicans. A lot of the rural republicans out here in PA, for instance, used to be blue collar democrats.

They aren’t all hyper partisan crazies. I think the dems could win them over, without even changing their policy goals.

4319

In a sane world, sure. But rural Republicans are the most partisan of the Republican voters. Even if the ACA has been good for them now, if Obama himself showed up and asked them, they’d more than likely boo him off stage anyway.

The problem isn’t an abstract “rural Republicans need to be convinced in terms of policy effectiveness”. The problem is rural Republicans howl like Yahoos at the sight of any Democrat. It’s asking Democrats to fix that that is the issue, especially since they didn’t start or cause this behavior but that it was drummed up by the GOP media.

4320

I think this is true, but I also think that almost none of those rural Republicans will choose to vote for a Democrat next time because their current Republican member of Congress voted down Biden’s plans.

Polls already show that both bills are broadly popular even in some Republican districts and states, but that hasn’t produced any change in the positions of House Republicans (they’re against both bills) or Senate Republicans (most of them are against one bill and all of them are against the other one).

4321

BIden’s plans DO help a lot of rural Republicans, but in my 20 years of Appalachian living, I’ve learned that some will accept the benefits while bitching about them the entire time. And they’ll bitch even louder about their neighbor who gets the same because no one hates poor people more than other poor people. It’s quite sad.

4322

quite simply, the only way that can be fixed is either demographic change, unconstitutional acts of justice, or accelerationism.

Nothing else will work.

4323

I’m generally skeptical of the basic rationality of people, but even I think it isn’t impossible that some people can have their minds changed by good government policies and programs. The problem is that it doesn’t happen overnight. Some people who hated the ACA when it was pending or new, defend the ACA now, but that didn’t help any Democrats get re-elected in 2010 or 2012.

4324

It is well-known and/or generally accepted, at least in poli-sci circles, that broadly-based government programs tend to end up becoming quite popular and difficult to end. The hard part is getting the program started.

Particularly when one side is fanatically devoted to the proposition that a) anyone other than them winning election is fundamentally illegitimate, and b) helping other people is evil.

4325
4326

In normal circumstances yet, but when you’re dealing with a cult, they have to want to leave the cult to change. The never-Trumpers did, the rest are getting so much reinforcement that the efforts need to be on deprogramming their kids.

(Also, primary Sinema hard in 2024. The only reason she should be tolerated now is she’s the 50th Senator. She’s the Dem version of Marjorie Taylor Greene)

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4327

This is spectacularly stupid, but if it has the effect of getting Manchin and Sinema on board — which I doubt, at least with the latter — then fine, do it.

There are literally zero rich people looking to send their offspring to community college.

4328

Default humor is good.

4329

I have a confession to make. I would watch those movies.

4330

Plus you always have Republicans saying the rich pay for it, but then they can’t use it themselves, so it pushes the narrative of “us paying for things for others”.