Well, if any of them are fans of Pamela Adlon or believe (like I do) in the immense power of storytelling as a force of good in the world, then sure. Even some of Louis’ material on men and women would qualify. But not everybody feels that way. Some just see it as “just jokes” or escapism or whatever.
Yeah, men and women are really fucking different. I know that I’m kind of a monster in your eyes but I hope I’m an empathetic, sensitive, articulate monster with his heart in the right place. I wish you could understand having a penis and this grotesque reptilian-brain instinct we have to MAKE MORE BABIES!!! You’d be pleased that so many of us behave as properly as we do.
Nesrie
3191
I completely disagree with your perspective on this particular issue, but this is not true nor does it represent how i see you or most men. I don’t knowingly talk to monsters. You might be surprised with how few brush strokes I use over here to paint a person simply because we went at it over one topic or two… err maybe three. heh.
Once you objectify people, like force them into nothing more than sexual objects for pleasure and desire, it would take a lot more than a few words to convince me that same person will now look at others as actual human beings worthy of respect, worthy of consideration, worthy of just empathy.
Bro you gotta chill with that shit it’s not helping your case.
FYI women experience lust too. Just not my wife! /rimshot
I trust it’s abundantly clear, even via words on a screen, that my tongue is firmly planted in cheek.
Besides, I don’t have a case! Except the struggle for empathy and understanding and forgiveness of all points of view in an effort to achieve moral justice in the universe. What’s stopping us? How hard can it be??
Timex
3195
“Did Louis C.K. feel shame?” Is a question that could only be posed by someone who had never seen his act.
LOL, exactly.
All the other notorious #metoo men were acting ‘out of character’ with public perception… except Louis.
Of course he went and did that. Uchh.
But he also went to Afghanistan to entertain the troops and threw in a duckling when he fictionalized it.
Funny, but somehow I don’t think the women who got to see his act were amused by it.
Not a bad article… I agree with her conclusion that more needs to be done if they want to come back into the public eye. I think ‘he had counseling’ is a cop out. Even if it might help the individual, it’s so common as to be rendered meaningless as a public display of remorse or contrition. But a large donation to the right organization would have an impact. Maybe there are other ways.
But this line bugs me:
All of them appear to be closely following the same publicist-approved playbook: go to ground for a while, then quietly test the waters.
How the heck else are they supposed to do it? If I make a room full of people, or, let’s say, my whole family really angry, I leave for a while. Then I come back to see if they’re getting over it or if I’m still in the doghouse. I don’t need a publicist to teach me that… it’s human nature.
I keep thinking about Nesrie’s thought experiment and my take away; I’m simply not capable of comprehending how the victims feel. I can more easily imagine the discomfort or resentment at not wanting to be permanently associated with that gross display and the resulting story.
RichVR
3200
Bad example. Not meant as a dig, just a comment:
If I rape a girl or expose myself to them, I just go away for a while. Then I come back later to see if they’re getting over it or if I may still be arrested.
See the problem? Again, not a dig, seriously.
Edit: I understand your perception. When is closure? When is it fixed? I think I’d have to ask the victims. And like you, I cannot know what they are feeling. If one victim is left out and still feels pain, can there ever be closure?
ShivaX
3201
I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t interested in how he’s going to handle this.
It does feel a little too soon, though a single off-the-cuff show at a comedy club is hardly a Netflix or HBO special.
Scott, this stock reply of yours is offering diminishing returns! Heck, even Louis CK understands the value of writing fresh material.
Well, I believe he has the forgiveness of his victims and the audience at the Comedy Cellar were not his victims. My main point is the unfairness of the phrase “publicist-approved” to describe something which sounds to me like common sense. “Go to ground then test the waters.” Even the phrase “go to ground” describes an animal instinct. Foxes don’t have publicists.
Not a bad idea!
Meanwhile, the AV Club wins best headline:
jostly
3206
You’re missing one piece of this thought exercise; the relative difference in power. This is something that I lacked full comprehension of for the longest time, but #metoo finally unlocked it.
Consider the joke: “Men fear that women will laugh at them. Women fear that men will kill them.” Except it’s not funny, because it’s true. If you want to try to get into the headspace of the victims and think of what you would have done in respective cases, you have to add that fear into the mix.
When you imagine yourself in the situation, also imagine that the perpetrator has the ability to physically overpower you. Also imagine that you do not know how the situation will end. Maybe you’ll just try to leave? That might make your attacker violent, and what might start out as emotional trauma could turn into physical trauma or death. You don’t know.
Sure, you might think, you have no reason to believe X will turn violent, he never has before. But on the other hand, he hasn’t whipped out his dick in front of you before either, so it’s pretty clear you’re in unknown territory.
But wait! There’s not only the immediate risk of violence, but maybe they are also much more powerful than you in your chosen line of profession. In that case, doing something that piss them off could end your career if it does not end your life.
Maybe it’s better to suffer the current emotional trauma, maybe it is better to just accomodate his wishes this time, instead of risking all that? And really, who would you tell? It’s not like people will readily believe you. And if they do, what will they do? Probably nothing, since this seems like a thing that has happened to others before you from this particular guy.
THAT is the headspace you need to be in when you consider what you would do in the circumstances.
True and well said! That’s a pretty thorough account of what I could never feel or understand.
Not for nothing, it occurred to me while reading your post that if you added some laugh lines, it could be a Louis CK bit. Or episode of his show. That’s exactly the kind of subject he liked to explore. I’m thinking of this bit in particular.
@rrmorton, one breakdown I think I see happening here is that, because of your experiences of Louis CK’s act and influence on your life, you look like you feel that provides you with insight into what kind of person he really is and what it’ll take to reform him.
I think the exact opposite. Out of all the posters in this thread you are the one who is uniquely unqualified to judge his merits as a person and a performer.
