The Miami incident

Suprised no thread yet, a passenger has been shot dead at Miami Airport

I can’t see any fault by the air marshalls so far, and the story is running on all the news channels.

edit : bipolar/mentally ill travelling with wife but running amok and claiming to have a bomb, and its confirmed no explosives have been found.

Unless some future revelations are revealed that seriously counter everything in that article, they did what they felt was necessary. If you say you have a bomb, and nobody knows you’re making it up, then start reaching into your bag, you’re probably going to get shot.

If you say you have a bomb, and nobody knows you’re making it up, then start reaching into your bag, you’re probably going to get shot.

Pretty much like telling a cop you have a gun and then you start to reach for something. They have seconds to decide and there are countless lives at risk if this person would have had a bomb.

Sucks the dude died and all but they did their job and I am glad they did not hesitate in doing so.

Man, crazy people the world over had better thank their pink elephants that Greyhound doesn’t enjoy the same layers of protection that American Airlines does; it’d be a fucking bloodbath.

I don’t see any quotes beyond government officials on the bomb claim, though. Guess we’ll find out.

Yeah, I heard Cheney personally gunned him down from the grassy knoll.

LK I don’t think your prodding is going to actually get Jason to argue with you. Sometime after the election he turned off his ability to actually express a point or rebuttal without a link that he may or may not agree with or be his point.

But it would be nice if he actually attempted to defend any one of his nutbar hyper-liberal paranoia episodes.

Holy christ, so true. I’ve been on two greyhound trips (in northern alberta) where the driver had to radio for a cop because some stupid drunk started getting violent. That’s out of… two trips.

Prodding? Why, whatever do you mean? I was agreeing

Greyhound is scary. Layovers at the Port Authority in NYC at 2am…even scarier part of the package.

Edit-Fixed quotes

Should have tasered him…


Did I hallucinate the entire “bomb scare” in Britian where they gunned down a totally innocent man with no bomb? The part where they said he had a bomb, yelled out he had a bomb, made a move to a bomb-filled backpack - and it all was flat-out wrong, he did none of those things?

Clearly I should just shut up and believe the first thing the media or government reports. They’ve been quite trustworthy as of late.

Err, the major difference being that in the London incident, the victim said nothing, while the police said he had a bomb. In the Miami incident, the victim shouted that he had a bomb. There’s a world of difference between some guy running away, and some guy shouting that he has a bomb!

No, no, no, it was alleged he said those things about the bomb. In fact, it was just a psychologically crippled man gunned down by the vast right wing conspiracy.

So you guys can’t think of any instances where the first blush of what a government or media source said later on turned out to be entirely false and/or fabricated? Oh, you can? Why then is it so hard to agree that early reports aren’t always trustworthy? or are you just Trolling?

No, I can’t think of any at all. Unless you want to dispense with pleasantries, in which case:

More accurately, unlike the Underground incident, this does not smell right off the bat. Not just because Air Marshals are quite unlike a suddenly paranoicized British po po, but because of the context in the article. Of course, all final words are reserved for when more is known. It could well be Mr Cheney with the candlestick in the ballroom. But I just don’t see an inherent virtue in casting conspiracy and player hating as an opening salvo in this discussion. Not just as a matter of principle, but because kneejerk tactical moves like that in this forum annoy me when I do them, and at least as much when others pull them.

Let me help you read this forum by replacing a few words.

So you guys can’t think of any instances where the first blush of what a liberal paranoia posters said later on turned out to be entirely false and/or fabricated? Oh, you can? Why then is it so hard to agree that early liberal knee-jerk reactionaries aren’t always trustworthy? Or are you just Trolling?

You might want to replace Liberal with whatever word you prefer and in many circumstances the word can be “Conservative” or “Republican” and it holds just as much water as liberal, or Democrat.

However, if you are talking about this forum, you would probably better served with liberal. Unless of course Gideongamer is posting.

I don’t hate the player, just the game.

The main difference for me, LK and Zen, is that I don’t fear some random liberal poster because he has no power over me, and thus cannot abuse his power to harm me. Moreover, if there was a fuck-up, such a “liberal” poster has no incentive to cover it up.

The government on the other hand (whether liberal, conservative, monarchist, fascist, or whatever) does have such power over me, and does have an incentive for cover-up. This country was founded on the firm belief that you can’t blithely trust governments with such power, and I find it disturbing that some do so blithely trust, and slam anyone who says it is sometimes wise to look beyond the face value of what is said.

Now, I do agree that this particular account seems likely to have happened as reported (and I bet Jason feels the same), but I’ve often seen front running news reports and “offical word” be flatly wrong, and don’t think it’s unreasonable to trust what’s said less than 100%.

Oh, they were probably perfectly reasonable in blowing him away, but lately first news reports & government statements on stuff like this have ended up being spectacularly wrong. Based on just the quality of the sourcing, in this MSNBC article, for example, I’d say he probably was running around like a deranged fool but it’s only a rumor he was claiming a bomb.

(Relevant sections)

An agitated passenger who claimed to have a bomb in his backpack was shot and killed by a federal air marshal Wednesday after he bolted frantically from a jetliner that was boarding for take off, officials said. No bomb was found.

A witness said that the man frantically ran down the aisle of the Boeing 757 and that a woman with him said he was mentally ill.

The passenger was confronted by air marshals but ran off the aircraft, Doyle said.

The marshals pursued and ordered the passenger to get on the ground, but the man did not comply and was shot when apparently reaching into the bag, Doyle said.

avid Adams, a spokesman for the Federal Air Marshals, said in a press conference the air marshals asked the passenger twice to drop his bag and put his hands on his head.

“The air marshals discharged their weapons” when the man failed to comply with them a second time, Adams said.

Gardner said she heard the woman say her husband was bipolar, a mental illness formerly known as manic-depression, and had not had his medication.

Note that there’s multiple non-government sources for everything but the bomb claim in this article and others; therefore, it’s perfectly reasonable to treat the bomb report as not reliable yet, especially considering how wrong this “intense” sort of article has been lately.