BFD :)

LMAO.

My argument is that he isn’t very good. The numbers agree with that. If you’re going to say that the proof he’s a good QB is this year, I’ll point out that he just had a massive crybaby meltdown in the face of the slightest bit of adversity. And also that even a Derek Anderson or Matt Cassell can have one good year. If he can do it consistently I’ll be happy to retract this - I don’t see it happening.

If you want to see an example of a quarterback handling adversity well, I’ll dig up some of the shit that happened to Rodgers in the first year after replacing Favre.

Yup. Same thing could be said about Adrian Peterson. Awesome running back and he did get to play for a very good team last year, but you wonder how many more years he can play at such an elite level, especially if his team falls apart for a couple of years.

Rimbo, I’m GUESSING that if you were to do some statistical digging that you’d find that there is a HIGH correlation between wins and Chris Johnson’s rushing. Amazingly enough, the past two years – which you cite as VY’s breakout years of significance – are the ones where CJ has been their primary back.

From my cursory glance of the stats, there is a much higher correlation between CJ doing 100+ than whether Kerry or Vince started when it comes to wins.

On second thought, I’ll just show you - here’s real adversity and how a good quarterback handles it:

http://community.sportsbubbler.com/forums/p/93095/1081015.aspx

Two years ago, as Green Bay’s first new quarterback in 16 years, Rodgers thought the only way to handle angry fans who still wanted No. 4 at the helm was to speak up but not out, to make people laugh and to take the verbal sacks.

And he heard those boos at that first Favre-less practice in 2008, the sarcastic rooting for the New York Jets, the hecklers every time he wound up.

And he felt those boos during Family Night, when he made his official debut as the Packers’ starting quarterback at Lambeau Field.

And his jaw dropped at the kid who cussed at him.

He was often aware of the nasty comments on local and national blogs.

He found his truck keyed at Miller Park.

He read derogatory comments written on his driveway (although we must chuckle at that because it was written in sidewalk chalk).

But it was no joke when he and former teammate Ruvell Martin were harassed at a gas station.

The letters, well, there were too many to count.

“It was ugly,” Packers receiver Greg Jennings said. "They didn’t always mean harm. But it was very harmful, what they were doing.

"I remember this one lady saying, ‘I’m a Favre fan. I don’t dislike Aaron; I just don’t like the fact that he’s our quarterback.’

“I was like, are you serious right now? This guy hasn’t done anything! He didn’t ask to be here. He didn’t ask to get drafted by the Packers. He didn’t ask to be behind a future Hall of Famer. He didn’t ask Brett to leave.”

“I just got to a point where I couldn’t not do something about it. It hurts when I open my car door and a guy yells ‘F you’ to me. You just hold all that in, and I have a hard time holding all that in.”

Buoyed by their support and mentally strong already after a lifetime of being overlooked, Rodgers put up a front for the public. He said most of the right things. He threw for 4,000 yards. He fought off injury. He played well and faced his critics.

But remember the grunge hair? No accident. Everything Rodgers does, even down to his physical appearance, has a purpose and so did that beach-bum look.

“I don’t take myself too seriously. I grow my hair out, grow a mustache in training camp. It’s for comic relief,” Rodgers said.

It was, in part, a way to get all the guys on the team to at least laugh with him and maybe that would lead to unity.

“Well that’s my secret. It’s not going to be a secret anymore obviously,” Rodgers said. "There’s not many things that I do that aren’t thought out. I’m not just a whimsical person. If more people are going to talk about my mustache than Brett Favre in 2008, that’s a win for me. It’s not like I just woke up one day, ‘Oh, I am going to do this.’

Last year, the 11-5 Packers went to the playoffs and Rodgers played brilliantly. He had once vowed to turn the Family Night boos into cheers, and he did it.

That’s a real NFL quarterback, Rimbo. Vince Young is not one.

And he was starting. And he hurt his thumb but thought he could go back in but the coach judged otherwise, and then he threw a hissy-fit. Even Favre the diva wouldn’t have tossed his shoulder pads into the stands and walked out on the meeting after the game. He would have worked the press, whined in his own way, etc., but he wouldn’t have walked out on his teammates.

And of course Favre, for all his diva-ness, still has had a HOF career and plays through pain and doesn’t miss games.

Meanwhile Young seems to need a coach who is willing to be a babysitter. And from what I’ve read, he still can’t run the complete offense so he gets a watered-down version of it.

You wouldn’t happen to have noticed a correlation between CJ rushing for 100+ and which QB started the game, would you?

What’ll happen is that after he flames out, VY will then come up with the excuse that he was diagnosed with some random mental health ailment that explained his emotional outbursts, and then the VY fans will say “Oh man, imagine the greatness IF ONLY HE HAD BEEN TREATED! How come the coach DIDN’T SEE THAT?”

And no one is making excuses for that behavior, okay? Just because VY acted like a little whiny bitch doesn’t mean Jeff Fisher isn’t a dickless scumbag.

Off topic from the current Vince Young is good/bad threads but man, how badly did the 49ers fuck up in not taking local hometown/college hero Aaron Rodgers instead of Alex Smith? Stick Rodgers on that team right now and they win the NFC West easy (… not that that’s saying that much this year) and possibly challenge in a weakened NFC with Rodgers no longer in GB.

I don’t think Young is a bad QB personally, but you can’t have it both ways Rimbo. Earlier you argued that the Titans aren’t using him very much and then point to his win/loss record as proof of how good he is. Now when someone points out that CJ is the reason they have won the last few years you are trying to suggest that VY, despite hardly throwing the ball, deserves credit.

Oh ffs.

From this season:

Wk 1 - W - CJ > 100 - VY
Wk 2 - L - CJ < 100 - KC
Wk 3 - W - CJ > 100 - VY
Wk 4 - L - CJ < 100 - VY
Wk 5 - W - CJ > 100 - VY
Wk 6 - W - CJ > 100 - KC
Wk 7 - W - CJ < 100 - KC
Wk 8 - L - CJ < 100 - VY
Wk 9 - L - CJ > 100 - VY&KC
Wk 10 - L - CJ > 100 - VY

So when CJ was > 100, they go 4-2. When CJ < 100 they go 1-3.

When VY was QB, they went 3-3. When KC was the starter, they went 2-1. I’m seeing much larger relevance to CJ’s performance than to the QBs.

There’s a good chance no one would have done well at SF given the coaching and other personnel disasters they’ve had there. It’s hard to say if player X would do worse or better if they had been drafted elsewhere. Rodgers has benefited from some stability and, to his credit, has had the emotional fortitude to ride the post-Brett shenanigans.

I think the more logical conclusion is that when VY is in the game they just run a lot, force the other team to stack against the run, then carefully pick when they want VY to throw the ball. This is conjecture though since I haven’t looked to see if Collins was used as little. It does look like it could be a classic case where a more trusted QB is given more lee way which actually hurts them since they don’t run as much.

Only thing I want both ways is to say that both Young and Fisher have been dickheads.

Yeah, that’s part of it. Also, Young presents a running threat on his own. Nobody’s afraid of Collins escaping the pocket. :)

Good points. I forget how bad the 49ers were then with all of the head coaching and offensive coordinator changes. Maybe the 49ers would be pining for Alex Smith if they ended up drafting Rodgers. Still would have liked to see the hometown guy get a shot, would have made a nice story at the time.

I don’t know that they ask Collins to do much more, though. Looking at this year, Collins is averaging about 21 attempts per game he has appeared in, ranging from 15 to 31. Young averaged just under 19 attempts per game, ranging from 10 to 28 (I’m discounting his limited appearance in the Jaguar game). Two attempts per game isn’t all that significant.

Young hasn’t been doing much rushing the last few years, though. Last year he only managed about 25-30 yards per game when he ran and this year it was even less. It’s not like what he did when he was at Texas or even earlier in his Titans career.

It’s hard to say how VY would do in a more pass oriented offense.

Sweet fake punt pass.