Non “sensible” Ukrainians are still Ukrainian citizens. Also, I doubt this is true anyway.
aeneas
20442
I would say that all the Western goodies that have been off the table are now likely on the table for Ukraine following the missile attack hitting Poland that would be the escalation that would be seen as a measured response.
I that Poland might be painting everything in their inventory blue and yellow.
strategy
20443
Bad choice of words. Rephrased - Russia has forced the vast majority of Ukrainian citizens who support Ukraine to leave those regions (less so, perhaps in Crimea than in the Donbas which has been wracked by active conflict).
The difficult question that Ukraine may have to answer at some point is whether liberating those regions is worth the thousands of additional dead it would cost.
abrandt
20444
I could see Poland reaching an agreement with Ukraine where Polish AA ends up stationed in Western Ukraine with Polish troops manning them.
I could also see us moving closer to a situation where any missile sites in Belarus are declared valid targets for Poland.
jpinard
20445
Dear Poland,
Strike back, don’t let your people have died in vain.
Likely repercussions from the missiles hitting Poland. @aeneas might be right on target.
Something that can’t be said of Russian missiles.
A pretty good explainer on Article 4 from German public media:
Strollen
20447
It seems only fair that Poland gets to shoot two missiles into Russia. I suppose ICBM wouldn’t be proportional, but Tomahawks into the Kremlin would be.
After watching the Frontline documentary, I don’t know how this war ends with Putin still in power. Many horrifying stories, perhaps the scariest is about a Russian/Ukrainian professor, whose parents are in Mariupol. He get fired for posting a video of destroyed Russian tanks. He couldn’t convince them to leave the town, and who knows what happened to them. Meanwhile, his teenage daughter is literally trolling him by sending him Putin propoganda videos about the evil Ukrainians.
There are good Russians, but Putin didn’t rape and torture all those people, Russian’s did. They need to be deprogrammed, and I don’t see that happening with Russia suffering an immense amount pain.
KevinC
20448
In the name of peace, I think Poland should surrender an eastern buffer zone to Russia so that any future missiles don’t accidentally land in Polish territory.
abrandt
20449
You are of course right. When will Poland finally end their increasingly provocative behavior towards Russia and come to the negotiating table?
Hey, no fair! It was only once, and anyway we were on a break!
Besides, despite the runaway success of a certain poem, we did actually win.
Aceris
20451
chefkiss
There’s Gallipoli as well.
Then again “fighting on penisulas near the black sea” is a military weakness I can live with.
Given the sides, that war would have been hard to lose.
abrandt
20452
There was that holiday trip to Gallipoli you sent your troops on a few decades later. Just saying.
And yes, your side did win. It just was kind of a disaster there for a good chunk of the conflict.
Strollen
20453
Really, I didn’t know that or if I did I forgot. When did the UK lose Crimea?
I guess on my to-do list in Vicky 3 is to play as Britain and conquer Crimea.
You’ll find what you want in the Portobello Road
Glass ornate flagons, Ivory dragons; Mandolins mellowed by music of yore
Austrian crystals, Napoleon’s Pistols; Swords that came back from the Crimean War
Russia is if course denying it was their missiles that struck Poland, and there’s some speculation they may have been S300 missiles launched by Ukraine that didn’t track their targets when a cruise missile barrage came in. Seems unlikely but plausible enough to take time for people in charge to evaluate.
abrandt
20456
They didn’t lose Crimea. They were one of the countries that invaded the Crimean Peninsula during the Crimean War(hence the name). It’s a really fascinating and not very well known war in the 1850s. But basically all of the countries involved were just absolutely not prepared to support a war on the peninsula. Russia and the Ottomans were kind of expected to be disasters, but the UK was too. As I recall, France started as the most competent of the bunch, but I don’t recall that lasting?
The Charge of the Light Brigade is probably the most famous work that came out of the conflict highlighting one of the many questionable moves by the British, but Tolstoy was also heavily influenced by what he experienced on the Russian side of the war. Was also the war where Florence Nightingale did her work, one of the few bright spots in the whole affair.
Also was the introduction into warfare of a lot of technologies, so that side of it felt one half Napoleonic and one half WW1, much like the Civil War ended up being. I recall it being the first war to be photographed? I think another weird thing that feels sort of out of time was how much of the build-up was due to religious issues.
Britain and France invaded Crimea in an attempt to stop a runaway Russian victory against the Ottoman Empire and the threat that the Straits might end up in Russian hands. Which was successful. Crimea was never part of the British empire ;)
The memeing goes into overdrive:
JonRowe
20459
Crimean War baby!! or WWI: Origins
jpinard
20460
Memes from Polish people. I think they want blood LOL:
