Gaming insiders spooked by pay-for-engagement plans

This doesn’t make sense to me. It’s no different than the current microtransaction trends that are already encouraging games that keep you engaged in them as long as possible and only focused on that one game. Even if Stadia was a resounding success, I don’t see it moving the trend line more than it already is.

So it incentives game passes that maximize the FOMO.

This move is counterproductive for Stadia, imho. Unless it’s just a small bonus over a more direct payment method.

If Stadia is somewhat successful (big if):

This will encourage live games with continuous development. It doesn’t help de-risking development (a great incentive of the Game Pass model, or, say the Netflix model for TV production -it’s weird to keep calling it tv, but whatever-).

It also will create a strong competition within the same platform, which will create few winners and many losers, ultimately making entering Stadia a non-profitable proposition unless you are willing to out-compete (and out-spend) the big stablished players. Netflix shows don’t compete with other Netflix shows, other than at a basic level. They compete with Netflix’s competitors’ shows.

Ultimately this leads to fewer games on the “Stadia Pro” catalog since many smaller players will opt-out due to the barriers of entry. Which will be perceived by the potential subscribers as a lack of content compared to other options, and thus will diminish Stadia’s perceived value and potential subscriber acquisition.

The Game Pass model is the way to go. Perhaps it needs to interact with developers at an earlier concept stage (and perhaps use that to get cheap exclusives), but you need something similar to that to make it really attractive to devs and publishers.

“Engagement” is a metric that perhaps is not that useful on a subscription environment. It might help retain subscribers, but if engagement is within a single game, your audience is not sufficiently diversified. Engagement in the platform as a whole is not necessarily engagement with each game, but perhaps the ability to always find something new you’d like to play. Subscription/streaming services live or die on the variety of content.

A lot of the mediasphere appears to be breathless about this, anticipating Netflix will bulldoze the competition. My eyes roll.

I think this is going to fail if the games exec reports to Peters instead of Hastings/Sarandos. Bajaria may have a similar arrangement but she’s just continuing what Sarandos set up and obviously hugely approves of.

I have no idea who has a better shot at entering the games market with success, Amazon, because software is software or Netflix, because entertainment is entertainment.

But I guess Netflix has grown tired of “x is going to be the Netflix of gaming” and decided that Netflix should be the Netflix of gaming. If they manage to do it, I dunno.

There’s certainly been enough reporting about why Google and Amazon failed (and why Microsoft is succeeding with Game Pass) that I think they have a shot. If they let gaming be gaming and don’t try to shoehorn it in to how they run their existing business it won’t be immediately d0med.

Yeah, if they dedicate a couple billion dollars to buy titles ala Game Pass then there’s a good chance they’ll be successful. Any publisher would let them include their titles for the right price.

But I assume this will be all PC games. I can’t think of a way that they could do it on console.

Gonna be some interesting times if Netflix starts rolling out full games on their service because I’d bet Microsoft and Sony will think twice about letting their app stay on their consoles.

But we go through cycle every few years, remember? I mean, after Stadia and Luna, at this point all we can do is just watch and lol. It’s the only way to be sure.

The biggest names in the biz have been to and started some venture or another - and completely failed. See Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Sony et al. But I have to say that Mike actually stepping into this is a big deal, and I think, if nothing else, he has the capability to pull it off - IF they let him do his thing, and give him what he needs. Mike knows the biz, knows how to play the industry “game”, and is well respected. Plus, he’s old school and a really great guy.

I don’t know what Netflix is planning, but whatever it is, I swear if they’re licensing the Stadia White box in order to serve up games via a sub model, I would need to buy more insta-Oxygen cans otherwise I would just die laughing.

I know a ton of people who use Netflix daily but are not gaming on anything except maybe a few mobiles games… if that. I am curious who their target audience is for these games.

I’m all for companies trying to evolve whatever industry their in, but not on my dime for the most part. I’ll just watch.

It sometimes seems like the game industry bigwigs are gearing up to fight the last war, like we always complain about the Pentagon. They see the heyday of obsessive devotion to a single game space (EverQuest, WoW, MTG, that sort of thing), and the immense amount of time and money people put into those things, and they get all giddy. They forget that one, those days were the result of circumstances that no longer really apply, and two, that’s not the way the broad mass of gamers does things now.

Back then, games could monopolize your time because there were fewer options, and many of the most addictive pushed you, really required you, to form communities and become engaged on a continuous basis with a group of people. The games themselves were built in an era where there were few if any other options for intense social experiences in game structures, and when treadmills of grinding were still new (and because they were intimately linked to social behavior, more palatable). Finally, the people who were into gaming, even into the 2000s, were still largely representative of the earliest “geek and nerd” culture, with some exceptions.

When gaming exploded along with the Internet, the Web, smart phones, and social media, everything changed. Digital distribution meant people had instant access to an increasingly large population of games. The spread of connectivity and devices meant the demographic ballooned to include a huge variety of people, many of whom approached games very differently than did the OG gamers. This expanded universe of gamers did indeed start to put a hell of a lot of time and money into games, but that time and money was and is spread across a lot of options and platforms. Where in the earlier years the search was for a gaming home, a place to stay and put down roots, the contemporary trend is to center the gaming experience around you, the gamer, and bring all sorts of games to you.

I mean, I’m just speculating and noodling around here, but it seems these games as service models anticipate a gaming audience that wants to embed itself in one experience repeated ad nauseum. In some ways, that works; a game like Path of Exile, which is almost all systems, can keep people playing indefinitely, but even then it’s not an exclusive activity for most fans, and it’s also free. It also requires extensive revamping every few months to keep things fresh, and to entice people to buy the optional cosmetics. Just as vitally, each season or league starts from scratch so the grind is fresh.

But games like Ubi’s offerings I don’t think can pull that off, for example. In something like a Ghost Recon or an Assassin’s Creed game, once you hit a certain point there is nearly nothing to achieve other than, well, achievements, and I can’t believe those are popular enough among enough people to generate any real buy-in sans real rewards. Adding more quests or missions can be useful, but ultimately the absence of new systems or mechanics erodes their appeal. And if these games try to introduce higher level caps and better gear progressions, you end up shafting anyone who doesn’t keep up with the creep–and usually, the games are not interesting enough to make that many people want to do that, given the options out there that are more rewarding.

So maybe the bean counters have the magic sauce. I could be totally wrong, that’s certainly something I’m no stranger to. And you have to think the people running multi-billion dollar companies know something about what they are doing. But man, when I look around, I don’t see people jonesing to play one game, only one game, all the time. I see people liking things like Game Pass or Ubi+ where you can sample a bunch of stuff, come back to things when you feel like it, and ignore stuff you don’t want. I see people eagerly awaiting new games, sometimes games they’ll play once and never again, sometimes games they will come back to time and again. I just don’t see that players want, necessarily, to be locked into a FOMO-driven Groundhog Day gaming experience.

Of course, being weak-willed meatsacks, if the initial offerings are attractive enough, we’ll probably bite and become mindless drones anyhow.

Yep, this is basically my take too, as above. I believe something like Game Pass (lots of games) is more attractive to both a core gamer audience (how many Steam games do you guys have in your catalog?) and a broader audience (which is not going to look forward to put 40+ hours on anything, but maybe play 3-4 hours and move along to the next shiny thing, if series consumption on streaming services is an indicator).

Games as a service obviously work, but because the entry fee is free and they sell micro-transactions. It’s not clear it will work as a subscription service where you ask payment upfront. And remember infrastructure for streaming is more expensive than a multiplayer service. Allowing free access to million of players and hoping microtransactions are going to pay out the initial investment and running costs it’s a hell of a bet. Yes Fortnite is huge, but if you want to do Fortnite you don’t do a subscription service with a streaming infrastructure. You do a single game and eat the risks.

Once this picks up, and it’s looking it’s accelerating lately, exclusives between different services and portfolio size are going to be the main differentiators, imho.

Most bussines that fail, fail because they where adding nothing new and/or the market was saturated.

The game market is saturated and I don’t see what netflix can add to the table (transmedia is not a good idea)

Maybe games integration in the service? How will Apple react when the Netflix App include games on top of TV series and movies?

All you want gaming for $10 a month?

Subscription services are going to make the game market feel even more saturated when they become mainstream. Look at what happened with TV series. It’s about having such a saturation of content that you will never need anything outside of the service itself.

What Netflix could (or could not) add to the table is money and the right approach. If they follow a system similar to what they did for TV series they can ramp up a shitload of exclusives fast. But it’s unclear who much they are willing to invest and how they are planning to go about it. What’s unique about them if they take the right approach is how aggressive and predatory they are in their content production strategy. I am very skeptical they can pull it off. I’d bet on Microsoft and Sony first (if Sony wakes up and scales up PSNow).

Not disagreeing with you but…

“All you want gaming for $10 a month?”

We already have that with Xbox Game Pass, with Playstation Now (that very few people use), Piracy and other alternatives.

Has for money. Is not something new, either. Microsoft have money. Sony too (less so, but still).
Is Netflix going to put 400 millions of dollars on game developers pockets and expect something in return in 2026 ?

I’ll take “No” for $10, please.

More and more I suspect that this will end up being primarily a mobile play, ala Apple Arcade. They can license out their properties like Stranger Things and get games made more quickly on mobile, and go around and license or acquire other game for the service.

Then they just add a “Games” section to their mobile app and give you access to dozens/hundreds of mobile games as part of your Netflix sub.

Way cheaper and less risk than trying to build a PC/console based Game Pass competitor.

Netflix has over 5 billion US dollars to invest. This money is not previously earmarked for operations or to build new content. They could easily invest $1B to build an exclusive gaming portfolio.

The problem will be where you play those games. I agree with Menzo that it will likely be mobile titles, not core gaming stuff, because people watch Netflix on their TVs and phones. And when you’re talking mobile games, $1B seems like a ridiculously high amount. They could invest as little as $100M/year and end up with a ton of exclusive games, much like Apple Arcade.

And then they simply don’t charge anything extra for them. You have a Netflix account? Great, you get all those games too. Value-added.

If they’re smart, they won’t follow Apple Arcade and release a ton of small games. They’ll go for the gold ring, the hits. The Witcher TV series, the Halo of mobile games. Mobile games with $20M+ budgets.