The Vagaries of Clinton's Campaign

With Hilary back in the news and Comey being shit-canned, finger-pointing about the 2016 elections has resumed in several places. I figured we could argue about the myriad reasons she lost in one place rather than spread out among three different threads. Plus, I wanted to talk about a book I’m reading and I couldn’t find a good thread to necro – didn’t we have a “Political Books” thread somewhere recently?

I’m finishing up

The book’s conclusions as to why she lost are far from novel, but it does provide a fair amount of supporting context and examples to back up its (many) suppositions. Very briefly, here are the major thrusts:

  1. Bernie Sanders. The book is pretty harsh on Sanders. Although it doesn’t necessarily criticize his policies or even his supporters (too much), the book does make a compelling case that Sanders’ constant negative refrains about Clinton, her dealings with Wall Street, calling her “Corrupt” and “Untrustworthy”, and staying in the race long after he could have possibly won had a massively deleterious effect on Clinton’s candidacy. The thesis here is that if Bernie had stuck to policy debates and away from character assassination, then Trump would not have had as firm a platform to stand on in the General.

  2. Her Emails. Lots of moving parts here – The authors go out of their way to explain Clinton’s thinking behind the private server, and it details how the Clintons just never quite believed that the emails were ever going to amount to anything: they honestly believed that it was just another GOP hatchet job (like Benghazi) that would quickly blow over. Moreover, the book was very quick to point to Bill Clinton’s ill-advised meeting with Loretta Lynch as the pivotal moment in the whole scandal – if he didn’t randomly pop over for a chat, then most Americans would probably be hard-pressed to name the (former) director of the FBI. Instead, because of Bill, Comey became a household name and her Email Server issue just got bigger and bigger. Of course the conflation between the Russian hacking of the DNC and her private server in the eyes of most Americans didn’t help much either.

  3. Ignoring Rural Voters. This is distinct from ignoring their issues, but it feeds into it. The book makes the case that Clinton’s metrics-based campaign was far too predisposed towards the cities and high-population areas. Her campaign manager was loathe to spend any money at all for rural counties – his data told him (accurately) that Clinton’s supporters were densely clustered in the cities and suburbs, and his analysis said that spending money on ground operations in these rural areas was a waste. They also didn’t want to waste money or effort on converting anyone or arguing her case; they simply wanted to get known Dems out to vote. So they ceded the vast swathes of rural countryside to Trump without a fight; no lawn signs, no outreach, no staff, no nothing. Bill Clinton argued against this approach, but he was overridden. No one seemed to understand that Trump WAS doing conversions within their supposed strongholds.

  4. No Message. If the book has a core thesis, this is it. Clinton and her staff knew that she stood for lots of stuff. Great stuff like equality for all, helping the downtrodden, and protecting Americans. But she (and her staff) were utterly incapable of articulating any of that to the voters. To the vast majority of Americans, Clinton was running… because it was her turn, dammit. She could explain (at length) what she was about to any individual, apparently, but selling her platform in simple language to a mass-audience was simply beyond her. Trump, by contrast, had nothing but one-line, easy-to-grasp slogans and ideals: Anti immigration, protectionist policies that would help rural voters, and an end to “political correctness” (which could mean whatever you wanted).

God, this.

Hillary running felt so much like a Democrat deal made back in 2008. “Look, Hillary, bow out and let Obama win. We’ll prep you for 2016.” And then when 2016 arrived, she was indeed the Chosen One, and the DNC fucked outliers like Bernie with every dirty trick in the book.

Hillary didn’t have a message. Plus, she was a dirty, castrating, eastern-librul bitch, and there was no way that the mouthbreathers out there, made stupid and more violent after eight years of polemic Tea Baggery, were going to vote her in after that dirty Kenyan, Muslim, socialist nigger.

So, a xenophobic voting base breathlessly waiting for all the free candy Trump promised, a surly and betrayed leftist DNC core, some Russian Magic Dust; and here we are today: just absolutely fucked.

Handing Republicans “deplorables” and “irredeemables” didn’t help.

More or less. It was like when the Allies went all-in on the “unconditional surrender” thing with Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan. It made them fight harder.

Unfortunately, the DNC did not have millions of angry Soviets/Atomic Bombs, respectively, to wrap the whole thing up.

Oh FFS, like Trump didn’t bring the majority of the negative comments?. Bernie sliced the Democratic pie and Clinton and her supporters didn’t like it one bit. He came to her defense by the time of the national convention and he also campaigned for her. I mean, come on. You don’t get to run against someone during a primary, then go on to say, “oh, they said things about me that really hurt.” She had the ability to correct the message, and yet the entire campaign was awash of actions she did herself; she made private speeches to Wall Street corps, and she also chose to go rogue with her own email system, bucking one that would have allowed more transparency.

This is a crock-of-shit kind of excuse.

That being said, I love books like this, and you have me interested.

EDIT: By the way, thoughts on if she is indeed done at this point or will she arise again like a phoenix come next election?

If she does I will be voting for some other party, because it will be clear that the Democrats have collectively taken utter leave of their senses.

I’m not sure I’d vote Republican at that point, but I feel the same @charmtrap. I’d especially feel like the entire thing was a bit rigged if the best we could do would be Hillary as the nomination nod again.

Well, The Rock might be the Republican candidate in 2020, and we all know he would make a far better president than Harrison Ford.

Well, I said “some other party”.

I don’t think I’ll ever vote Republican again after this shitshow (I have voted for a couple in the past). Maybe Evan McMullin, if he were running and there were absolutely no viable Democrat or Democratic Socialist or whatever on the ballot.

I would be slack-jawed astonished if she were to run again. I would be even more surprised if she actually got Dems to rally behind her after losing to Trump.

I am continually surprised that the Mormon Dreamboat has any sort of traction outside of Deseret.

I think he looked appealing simply because he was running against Trump. I mean, Donald Trump makes genital mutilation look good in comparison.

Well, now…that was an extreme hypothetical, but from when I’ve heard McMullin speak he seems like a confirmed but principled conservative who’s strong on policy and has an apparent hatred of authoritarianism, which is more than you can say for most of his degenerate party.

This to me is the most damning critique. The other factors vary in how much control they had. The fact that the average person did not grok what her campaign stood for, other than I’m not Donald, is something they should have done better. The slogan ‘I’m with Her’* served to reinforce, for certain segments of the population, that she got the nod because ‘it is her turn’. That was the message, and the slogan reinforced that.

Obviously we know that isn’t true, that she stood for far more than that. We knew she had policy plans, and was a qualified candidate. But we are politically engaged, intelligent, and historically conscientious people here. But your average american, relying on CNN, Fox, CBS, and the like? They’re either too stupid or lazy to see beyond the headlines, the catchphrases, and the slogan. So the message they got was ‘vote for Clinton, it is her time’.

They deserve every knock they get for that one.

But I’d place much greater emphasis on the kowtowing chickenshit media who had a depth of reporting similar to that of a puddle in Death Valley. Bouncing from one overblown breathless headline to the next, typically framed by whatever moronic thing Trump had said, without discussing the merits or truth? I wanted to shout ‘fuck you, you spineless useless bloviating buffoons’ every time some talking head prognosticator came on television and brought up something ‘oh this email thing looks bad for Clinton’ without ever saying what it was! Why it looked bad! Whether there was anything there! This let Trump completely frame things his way because the media just kept reporting his imbicility. He makes a wild accusation of Clinton, and they run with ‘does this look bad for her’.GRRRRRR!

Jesus, ‘she got sick at a campaign event’ and they talked about it for days. ‘this looks bad for her, is she physically capable of the job of president?’ Oh fuck off CNN.

This, far more than Bernie (I’ll spare my thoughts on that other than ‘shove it’), should be pointed out. Our media is as incapable of informing the public as the public is understanding things better than a cat chasing a laser.

*not her official campaign slogan, sure, but how many shirts did they make? Posters? Which was the predominant image her campaign made?

That was largely the one.

[quote=“Skipper, post:5, topic:129739”]
[On Bernie] Oh FFS, like Trump didn’t bring the majority of the negative comments?. Bernie sliced the Democratic pie and Clinton and her supporters didn’t like it one bit. He came to her defense by the time of the national convention and he also campaigned for her. I mean, come on. You don’t get to run against someone during a primary, then go on to say, “oh, they said things about me really hurt.” She had the ability to correct the message, and yet the entire campaign was awash of actions she did herself; she made private speeches to Wall Street corps, and she also chose to go rogue with her own email system, bucking one that would have allowed more transparency.[/quote]
Again, it’s not saying that Sander’s doomed Clinton, or even that he was the primary (heh) cause of her loss – they’re saying that the groundwork that he laid was work that Trump didn’t have to do… and that most of it was against her character, not her policies.

When Sanders announced, many of the Clinton campaign staff saw it as a good thing: a challenger would keep Hillary in the news (in a good way) and give her a foil against which to talk policy. That didn’t last long.

The problems started (or so says the book, but it’s how I remember it too) when Bernie either misunderstood or was misinformed as to the content of an interview that Clinton did on one of the networks. The interviewer followed up on a statement that she had made about Trump being unqualified to be president; he asked her if she felt that Sanders was unqualified too. Clinton declined to answer, basically saying that there was no comparison between the two. Somehow, Bernie heard that she had called him (Sanders) “unqualified” and he got super-pissed off. The next day he went on a tear and called Clinton “unqualified” to be president, and “corrupt” and a bunch of other stuff to pretty much anyone with press credentials.

When it was explained to him that she had never said her part to start with, it was apparently too late: he was either unwilling to retract his strong statements or else he just didn’t believe it or care. From then on it was largely ad hominem attacks from his side – and Clinton was unwilling to attack back because she didn’t want to alienate his supporters. Which may or may not have been the right tack.

Sanders did campaign for her, eventually. But even that was grudging at first, since he thought that supporting her would result in less leverage at the convention, somehow.

On Clinton’s side, they weren’t sure how to deploy him, if at all: in the fall they recorded some TV ad footage with him, but every time they focus-tested it, the audiences all felt like he was only doing it with a gun to his head and it made them LESS likely to vote for her. By all accounts he was happy to do the spots, but he refused to say “I’m With Her” because he felt it was just “too much”.

I missed catching that when it happened, but I do remember vaguely that the gloves had come off at a certain point. It also makes sense that he held that as a grudge. Still, she was the lead. It is a very common tactic to drum up something and go personal when you’re behind.

This was an interesting chapter in the book. She was sick, but out of all the hundreds of people on her campaign, only six people knew it… and her husband wasn’t even in that half dozen.

When she collapsed, she was taken to the hospital and every major news outlet in the country called her campaign headquarters to ask what was going on… and no one they could get on the phone had any idea whatsoever.

The “physically capable” thing got some play because Trump had just been spouting off on it a couple days before (and how he knew to spout off on it is a pretty big question I have; I’m wondering if the Russians had her HQ bugged [#tinfoilhat]), but a lot of the damage from that incident was to loyal Democrats. It underscored how secretive and unreasonably close-mouthed she was, even about catching a cold.

Yeah, people have a weird way of forgetting that Clinton literally did collapse and have to be taken to the hospital. It wasn’t that she looked a little sick or just had the sniffles. She passed out! The pundits and news media asking about that wasn’t some baseless attack. It was a legitimate question.

Well, sure, but the media also covered it with the same vigor and breathless intonation that they did for ‘grab them by the pussy’. The useless louts. That they have finally started to grow a spine and push back at his bullshit does nothing to exonerate them in my mind. The fifth estate no more, long live the useless tools of fools.

I don’t forget, but they treated it as if some grave character flaw on par with Trump admitting on tape to serially sexually assaulting women, and entering the dressing rooms of naked underage girls at miss America.

Yep, it was a desperate reach to be “fair and balanced”. Sure, Trump grabs some pussy, but maybe Hillary just doesn’t have the balls to tough out the presidency???

I mean the problem is the media wants to try to pretend that one side of the aisle in America doesn’t want literally every member of this forum to fucking die.