5563

Yeah, I learned to stay away from GiantBomb a LONG time ago. To be fair, I stay away from most of the game media these days. Either I’m weird, or they are, but it’s pointless to argue which - I just stay away and enjoy my games.

5564

It’s a game that needs a minimum amount of effort by the players. I think that’s the problem of some people who didn’t play the past two games, now they hear about Witcher 3, and they hear it’s good but they are like pfff too much effort. It needs effort because you aren’t a generic warrior hero saving the world in a generic fantasy setting: There is a unique setting to know and learn, with witchers and Temeria and Redania and the Nilfgaardian Empire and sorcerers and the situation of the non-humans and the witch hunters, you have to, like, talk to people and hear what they say and read journal entries, you have to learn the magical signs and potions and like too much to learn.
I suppose that’s why some people like super generic settings: if your options are warrior, archer and mage, if your enemy is a demon bent of world destruction, if the mage spells are fireball and lightning, they can play the game without needing to LEARN ANYTHING. There are some people allergic to learning.

5565

It’s been over a year since I listened to the GB podcast weekly. While Ryan Davis’s passing was a horrible thing, the thing that may have hurt the podcast the most was losing Patrick Klepek. I didn’t always agree with his views on a lot of games, but Klepek never wanted to be dumb for the sake of being dumb, and he helped to push a guy like Shoemaker into not sliding into that easy dumb-guy persona. Which is good, because with Vinny and Gerstman, the show absolutely has deliberately dumb well-covered. The show is now “What dumb guys like.” Which is fine, and clearly a niche, but it isn’t me or my taste.

5566

To be fair, I also loved that aspect about Destiny (the fact that I could play it while snapping TV to one side on the Xbox One). You can like that, and you can still adore The Witcher 3. It’s not an either/or situation. Sometimes it’s cool to have a game that lets you optimize your entertainment/media time, and other times it’s great to get absolutely knee deep in a game world, giving it your full attention.

TurinTur: As someone who only played Act 1 from Witcher 1, I thought going into Witcher 3 would leave me confused and scratching my head at times, but that hasn’t been the case. While it’s tough to see something called “The Witcher 3”, and NOT think that you’ll be missing out on a lot by not playing the previous game, that you’ll be confused, the fact is that CD Projekt has done a really great job slowly presenting the world fiction in small doses over a huge game, so that it’s very palatable and not confusing to newcomers like me. I get your point about perception, but I was really glad that perceptions and expectations didn’t agree with reality in this case. Absolutely no one should be scared to getting right into Witcher 3 with no background in the universe. It really does take only a minimum effort from the players.

5567

I’m talking of the impression that people have, the idea that there is going to be a wall there they need to climb up first to enjoy the game, not the reality. Yes, they did a great job introducing the world and characters from past games. The fact is, it’s still a epic RPG game with a setting you shouldn’t ignore, and storylines, dozens of characters, magic, potions, oils, crafting, trade, combat, exploration, character advancement, choices in the plot… it needs commitment. it’s so much easier and lazy to choose something more “pick up & play”, something more immediate.

But as I say, it’s some people’s impression. Imo they also did a great job introducing not only the characters and the world but also every mechanic with the White Orchard part. The game took your hand to show bit a bit how a typical quest work in the Witcher, how sometimes there are choices with consequences, how to do your first potion, your first bomb, how to use detective mode for some quests, of course how combat works, etc.

5568

The big ask from Witcher 3 is 100-150 hours of time either within a short period of time, or at least spread out evenly such that you don’t need to try to come back to the game after 3 months of not having played it, and having no idea of what’s going on. Especially true if you’re in one of the couple of quest chains that seem to just go on and on, so even getting in a couple of hours of game would just have gotten you another 2 hours of not having found Dandelion yet.

5569

To clarify, I also love that about some kinds of games. I play a ton of titles such as Spelunky or Diablo III or HoMM VII while watching TV. But for the GiantBomb crew it literally DID seem to be either/or the way they went from talking about Witcher 3 and how they couldn’t get into it and then talking about Destiny and how they could, “especially since I can watch WWE while I play” and such. That bit you wrote about getting knee deep in a game world and giving it your full attention? They didn’t seem to like that about The Witcher 3.

Here are some quotes, something from all of the crew present on the podcast, and it didn’t sound like a single one of them were into it. I shouldn’t be surprised, these guys never talk about something like Wasteland 2, or Pillars of Eternity, except maybe in passing. It’s all the most AAA-ass games all the time, really, and it’s kind of no wonder they are so cynical about gaming if they never try any of the other amazing things out there.

“I will certainly spend some time with The Witcher 3 before we get to game of the year (talks), but I hit the level cap in Marvel Heroes because I sat at my computer like, ‘I really don’t want to play Witcher 3’”

“…gameplay wise it’s not doing anything for me. Combat not doing it for me any more, it’s not introducing new mechanics, or items or anything. Metal Gear was constantly like, ‘Oh, cool I’m almost at the next R&D level’ … I just closed The Witcher 3 down and I was like, ‘I’m done’”

“…Dude gives you a cross bow and tells you to use it and then the fight starts, it’s the most ass backwards way of going about a new mechanic. Give me the crossbow first and let me play with it before I have to use it!”

“I don’t like the characters, I don’t like Gearalt as a character.”

And then they segue into,

“I just am not having fun any more so I put it down, meanwhile I load up Destiny and that’s the opposite, I am bored of Witcher 3 now and now I love Destiny so I can watch [stand-up specials] while I play Destiny! I don’t give a shit about what anyone says in Destiny…” After that they all start kind of making fun of Destiny as a platform for telling a story worth paying attention to, which I suppose is why it’s perfect for them.

They go on after that describing the games they are playing and all of them seem somewhat mindless titles that allow you to consume other media while they play. It’s probably not totally accurate, but in that 20 minute stretch of the podcast yesterday it was the impression I got, very strongly, and it’s by far not the first time I feel like this crew has become so far removed from what I personally enjoyed about listening to them talk about games, I guess.

Okay, rant mode off, sorry, I just used to really love that podcast so much, and I guess once Patrick left and Vinny left it’s never really been the same, imo. Ryan passing was very sad, but I felt the combination of Jeff, Brad, Patrick, and Vinny was very strong. I still don’t like Dan, and the other 4th guy that’s on there now also isn’t great. Part of the problem is they only seem to want people that have the exact same taste in games as every one else, perhaps.

5570

For me, the podcast was never fun to listen to. Even in the days with Vinny and Patrict, they still had Brad and Jeff, both of whom were so cynical about games, that really affected me when I listened to them. I’m impressionable and listening to so much “and here’s another game that does the usual gameplay elements…” can quickly make me cynical too. So yeah, I never listened to them for that reason. Cynicism is like a virus. I don’t want it to infect me. (That’s also why I have certain Qt3 members on Ignore. Not the annoying ones, just the cynical ones. They’re fine posters, but I’ve got to inoculate myself from that).

5571

Hey, we should totally have a Giant Bomb thread! I’ve always enjoyed the Bombcast, but it definitely took a hit from losing Ryan and then Vinny for my listening money. Never gave a damn either way for Patrick. And while I really do enjoy listening to them ramble on (and on) about whatever is going through their minds, it’s actually the holiday top 10 lists that finally burned me out on those guys and their passive aggressive sniping about each others’ lists. I know they’re all old friends and that’s just how they react to each other but my god, it’s like sitting through an interminable company meeting where everyone would just rather be anywhere else.

Oh, and really do mean to get started on Witcher 3 one of these days.

5572

Yeah, I don’t mean to be down on casual games, since I’ve become a fan over the last 18 months, and yes, I enjoy the story-less smashing loot hunt of a Diablo III very much. I love mindless fun!

What I guess I don’t like is the suggestion that you have to be “committed” to The Witcher 3. I’m certainly not! As much as I love the game, I’m sitting at 87 hours played, but that’s on my initial foray on launch day back in March. I’ve found that playing for a few hours per week spread across one or two gaming sessions–has been fine, given the excellent glossary and quest story writeups in the in-game log. I always feel like I can catch myself up quickly.

But anyway. I think my biggest problem with what GB has become, and what irks me about some media and podcasting sources in general, is slumming in dumb. There’s a way to be smart and engaging when discussing goofy, easy-entry games that are involving and fun to play. They bum me out because they want to discuss such games in a way that isn’t any of that. I hate listening to smart people who have decided to stop being engaged and curious and interested in things.

5573

That’s just embarrasing.
Anyway, Klepek did some nice stuff about Witcher 3 on Kotaku, I bet he left GB because he couldn’t stand being around people who don’t like it :p



Just very nice reads.

5574

I swear I was done talking about GB you guys, but this reminded me of something related. You say this as a joke, but I honestly am unsure. Not just for the games he was into vs. what everyone else liked (though you do have to wonder) but I noticed another change in the GB content I don’t like - they have almost completely abandoned the written word in favor of video content. It’s a huge bummer. Sure, they still have the occasional article up there, but almost every news bit has the little “play” button on it. Patrick was a prolific writer and his work was excellent, and then he left and as soon as he did this change happened. Did Patrick leave because he wanted to write and they wanted to go more video? I’m not sure, but it was definitely the beginning of the end for my enjoyment of those guys, a slope I’m still sliding down on.

Okay, if anything else comes up I’m making a new thread. :)

Back to the Witcher 3! Yeah, it’s pretty damned great, that’s no question. I had to stop my second play through (WELL before I got to the new content) as it’s just a busy time of the year with all the other great stuff coming out.

5575

Sometimes I want easy-entry “casual” experiences. Sometimes I want something more meaty that requires more from me as a player. I think there is room for both in my life.

The Witcher 3 definitely falls more on the demanding side of the spectrum. It’s not an especially hard game mechanically, and CDPR did a great job of catching people up on what’s going on in the story, but if you’re not fully engaged with it, it can be really easy to get lost. You need to actually pay attention and listen to the dialogue as well as watch people’s faces during the story bits. If you just autopilot through the game, I can totally see how it wouldn’t be very satisfying.

5576

One of the things that doesn’t get mentioned in this thread much, I’m assuming because of the need to avoid spoilers, is the Wild Hunt. The game is named after them, after all. I just want to reference them in a vague way here, staying away from any spoilers. What we know about them at the beginning of the game in the opening cutscene is that they are these mythical boogiemen. We see them again and again in the actual game, and that perception slowly begins to transform into understanding.

What I love about that is that it’s a very slow reveal. It’s not a “gotcha” or “HOLY SHIT I CAN’T BELIEVE WHAT I JUST FOUND OUT” type reveal, but just little bits and pieces over the course of the game. Most of what I’m discovering now about them is so different from what I thought of them in that opening cutscene. I’m just amazed at how adept this game is at revealing information.

5577

Yeah the Wild Hunt is neat. So much more than faceless bad guys.

And I don’t think the other discussion is necessarily about casual vs. core. I’ve found that some games are simply more compelling. I finally shook off the somewhat technical Transformers Devastation to try to wrap up Falcon 4. It can happen with any game. (Since I care about breadth, I sometimes really have to fight it.)

5578

The write-ups in the in-game log and the glossary are definitely excellent in catching me up on most things. But I can see what jsnell is getting at too. You do need a certain level of commitment to finish a 100+ hour game. Especially one that’s so heavy on story. Skyrim was also a similar 100+ hour game for me, but story never mattered to me in that one, so beyond the start of the game, I could drop in after taking a break from it for a few months, and be okay. That’s not as practical to do with Witcher 3. I’ve been devoting most of my media entertainment time to Witcher 3 since it’s release in May, and I’m at 110+ hours, and I’m finally in Act 3. It took a fairly heavy commitment from me to ignore most other games to get this point.

5579

Oh, I’m like that a lot times too. Hell, when I pick a game in my backlog is usually a straightforward action game before a complex strategy or rpg game, and that’s how now most of my backlog are games from the latter category. :(

But if you are professional game journalist, you are supposed to appreciate almost all genres, and have the ability of being able of putting effort in a game (we don’t know if GB crew case is that they were in humor of something light right now… or they have always that preference) and with the critical darlings like Witcher you should look into it. And once you are playing it, I can’t conceive someone dropping it because not liking it, unless you have a closed mind of what’s “good” and what’s “bad”.

5580

If that was the case then why did they hire Austin Walker of all people?

Editorial: Why We Write: On Game Critique, Influence, and Reach

I think your comment that they are only interested in AAA titles is also a bit unfair. The site covers a ton of indie games, some of them quite obscure. Who had even heard of Contradiction before Giant Bomb made it popular? But no, Jeff, Brad and Dan aren’t really isometric, party-based RPG guys. The site did however have lengthy “quick” looks for Shadowrun: Hong Kong, Wasteland 2, Divinity and Pillars of Eternity.

To add some context to your W3 quotes, it’s worth noting that Brad and Dan actually both loved the game until they put it aside for months while playing other things. Dan put 60+ hours into the game and said very recently that it would be in his top 5 of the year. Unfortunately he tried going back to it after a very long absence and wasn’t enjoying it anymore. Brad hasn’t gone back to it yet, but as far as I can tell his only real problem with it is the commitment involved. He did also mention how well done and interesting the world building and characters are in that same podcast you’re referring to. Vinny loves the whole Witcher series and has even read some of the books because of his love for the games, but he has a young family now and only gets to play games for a few hours.

The fourth guy you mentioned is Matt Rorie, who is the product/community manager and not one of the editors. He doesn’t usually appear on the podcasts but did this time as Drew and Jason are both away. Incidentally, he previously worked at Obsidian and despite his dislike for the Witcher, is a big RPG guy.

Anyway, I realise this is way off topic. For the folks that stopped listening to the Bombcast a while ago, you may be interested in trying the friday podcasts (the Beastcast) by the Giant Bomb East crew: http://www.giantbomb.com/podcasts/beastcast/

5581

You Witcher 3 die-hards are going to hate me for this but I did a lot of multitasking Witcher 3 on Sunday and yesterday. On Sunday I was watching Football (American) snapped to the side and yesterday it was the 5 hour World Series game. In both cases I found there’s lots to do in Witcher 3 when you can’t pay full attention to the story and play the game in Fullscreen. I played a LOT of Gwent, and I did quite a few Witcher contracts that I’d been too low level for during most of the game. So I ended up spending a lot of very low intensity casual hours of Witcher 3.

My total is up to 136 hours now. And I have enough cards that I can not only play as Northern faction, but also the other 3 factions too. It is pretty fascinating how each of the four decks require pretty different strategies.

5582

Why would I hate you? Witcher 3 is good for focused playing and also for multitasking gaming. Gwent is particularly well suited to multitasking. So why would we hate you?