It only matters if being “universal” matters. And that only happens if being on Windows Phone and Xbox One matters. Otherwise games can get the entire Windows market, including Win 10 on desktop/laptop just through Steam. It remains to be seen if anyone will give a flying fuck about portability to Xbox One or Windows Phone. Both markets are pretty small with users who spend less on average. Microsoft thinks they can leverage Windows 10 on PC to strengthen their position on those devices, but the actual synergy is running in the opposite direction from what they need.
Razgon
6150
MS has tried a similar stranglehold with windows 8 only games and both games died quickly. Try taking a look at their own minecraft/creation clonegame for Xbox / windows 8 as well which they have invested a LOT of money into - its not going well and I doubt that unless they get the big publishers to use this (And why would they), that your scenario will play out the way you say.
No, they didn’t. The key point here is very easy porting from Xbone to windows universal. That’s new in win10.
Endusers don’t care about portability. They either game on console or PC, and overlap doesn’t really matter.
So I guess the argument is that if a developer is going to make a game for X Box One, than he it might as well develop it as a universal app so that the developer can grab some of the pc market, even if he wasnt planning on doing that in the first place and if it is on the PC through the universal app, why both making another version that can sell on steam.
On the otherside, if and only if the windows store gets traction, you could see pc developers create a game as a universal app so they can tap into the phone and xbox market at no cost. That might be very tempting to smaller or indie developers, but again, only if the Windows universal app store gets traction.
I easily see first scenario, Since they are developing for xbox anyway. That first scenario might drive market share to the windows store and if it does than I can see the second scenario happening. But that would require improving the windows store experience and more effort on MS part.
Yes, that’s it in a nutshell.
I’m torn by this. Windows Phone as an operating system, gets great reviews, but no traction because of the lack of apps. I wouldn’t mind moving from Android to Windows if it had the applications that I wanted and the user base to guarantee support. So to my mind, the universal app store is one of the only ways that Windows can hope to get any traction, and allow them to be on par with Google and Apple and be a viable 3rd option, but it seems that same strategy might hurt the online retail gaming space, like Steam and GOG, which I’m not a fan of.
Well, we’ll see what the future holds. It would be nice to see Microsoft actually get their act together though, and do something worthwhile, and I think the universal app store is a great idea for developers. I’m just not sure how great it is for customers.
On one hand, PC gamers will see console ports much faster, and higher quality, and maybe even some ports that might otherwise never have come over.
On the other hand, this screws those third-party storefronts and locks PC gaming into a walled garden like iOS. And Microsoft is historically incompetent, while Valve provided a great service for many years.
So, comme ci comme ça.
Thraeg
6156
If this was five years ago, then sure. But these days, with both consoles being based on standard PC hardware, there are already few games that are exclusive to one console for reasons of technical difficulty. Exclusivity is now almost entirely the domain of games partly or fully bankrolled by the platform holders as a marketing weapon. The default for everyone else is releases on both consoles and PC. So yeah, this will be relevant for first-party MS titles, and will certainly carve out an Origin-like niche as the only store on PC that can sell Halo 6 / Gears of War 4 or whatever. But for anyone else, I just don’t see a typical dev with no financial inducements deciding that easier XB1-PC porting is worth giving up the sales they’d make on PS4 by launching on all three platforms simultaneously.
Who said anything about giving up on PS4? Certainly not me. This change does make it less likely that PS4 will be the primary platform, however.
Imagine it takes 100 “effort points” to release on your primary platform, XBone or PS4, and 50 “effort points” to release on a second platform, PC or the other console. Here are your choices.
-
Release on XBone, PS4, and win32/64 PC. 100+50+50 = 200 effort points total.
-
Release on XBone, PS4, and universal windows PC (and easy porting to win10 phones and tablets too!). 100+50+10 = 160 effort points total.
Does that make it more clear?
(Note: the 50 and 10 numbers were pulled straight out of my ass, I have no real insight into the level of effort to port from one console to another or to PC, the point is that universal windows apps are just that-- universal. Porting is trivial, and then you just need to customize controls and offer niceties like PC-specific control schemes and graphics options.)
JoshV
6158
If developers have to abstract things out and be able to work on both PS4 and Xbox, they’re already most of the way there to a plain jane PC game, and that lets them put it up on Steam, and reach more than just Win10 users. (Which, there are still going to be enough hold out Win7 users, even after Win10 that it will end up being more worthwhile)
I agree for an indie, it might make sense, except Sony has been way better at courting indies than MS this gen.
I’m also not sure that being a Universal app will at all improve a games port quality.
Well yeah, if the whole thing is bullshit, we have nothing further to discuss.
There are two different things.
The first one is porting the game engine to another platform. This seems to have been eased considerably.
The second one is porting a game (that is using a compatible game engine) to another platform. This remains mostly the same (maybe eased somewhat, but it’s not a big deal, I think).
Since very few companies have the same team working both on the engine and the games (most use engines externally developed -even if it’s by teams in the same company-) this might not change that much, other than easing the budget of those companies still making game engines (most use third party engines anyway).
Thraeg
6161
And certainly not me either. But what you did say, and I was responding to, was that developers would treat the PS4 port as a later, optional afterthought:
That’s why I said “give up the sales they’d make on PS4 by launching on all three platforms simultaneously” – a belated port well after the marketing and hype has died down will generally sell considerably less than a simultaneous release. And if you’re going to hold off on a port for one of the consoles, it’s probably not going to be the one with the larger install base.
I just don’t buy this scenario. The hardware is very similar, and major middleware engines already support relatively easy builds for all three platforms from the same codebase. If your lead platform is the PC and you’re already going to go to the effort of making your game fully playable with just a gamepad and meeting a set of arcane certification requirements, the marginal effort needed to meet a second set of certification requirements is tiny compared to the potential additional sales of being on an additional platform. Or as JoshV said, if you’ve already built a PS4/XB1 cross-platform game, the effort you’ve put into making each set of platform-specific stuff modular already gets you most of the way to a basic PC version.
The argument is clear enough, but the premises are flawed. Without going into the weeds of critiquing made-up numbers, I think you’re drastically overestimating the effort currently needed to port between similar platforms with similar control schemes using engines designed to run on all of those platforms.
You’re also placing a ton of faith in vague promises ("If you’re an Xbox developer, there are some tools that we’re providing that allow you to seamlessly move from Xbox to PC") being an order of magnitude better/easier than the efforts of Unreal / Unity / etc. to solve the same problem of cross-platform builds without cutting yourself off from a significant part of the PC audience.
The “and then you just…” already represents the bulk of the effort to go into a good porting job. We have a ton of ports that half-ass it and don’t bother with any of those things. The developers obviously didn’t put in the resources to do it right, so the fact that they did it at all strongly argues that making a perfunctory port is trivial now. I really don’t think there are many console-only games left that don’t do PC versions because it’s too hard from a technical standpoint – more stuff that isn’t perceived to fit the platform like party games and some sports games.
New update preview. Lots of Win 10 stuff.
Xbox on Windows 10
Here’s a closer look at the great new features coming to Xbox on Windows 10 with this month’s Xbox app preview:
Avatars – You can now download and launch the Avatars app from within the Xbox app. After the app is installed, select Customize > Customize your avatar to launch the Avatars app and edit, dress up, and buy new items for your avatar.
Friends updates – We’re making it easier to add friends, designate them as favorites and share your name from the Xbox app. The friends list will also show you which of your friends are in a party, playing multiplayer games, or broadcasting. You can also report or block people from the Xbox app.
Game hubs – Similar to Xbox One, you can now view the game hub for an Xbox One game and view the activity feed curated by the game’s community manager. Click on any game tile, under Home > Recently played or elsewhere in the Xbox app, and you will be taken to the game hub.
Game DVR – You can now alter the keyboard shortcuts used for opening the Game Bar, starting and stopping recording, taking screenshots, and more. Also, you can now view and manage your cloud-based game clips from the Xbox app by selecting Game DVR > Shared.
Testing streaming – The Xbox team needs your help in providing information about your PC’s performance and connectivity characteristics as we prepare to enable game streaming from Xbox One to Windows 10 PCs. To do this, connect your Xbox One to your Windows 10 PC using the Xbox app: from the Connect menu, select your Xbox One console then choose Connect. Once connected, click on Test streaming to anonymously send the team diagnostic information about your PC and network settings.
Turn On/Off your Xbox One Console – The Connect menu in Xbox app has been updated to let you power your Xbox One on and off from your Windows 10 devices when they are on the same home network as your console.
The Xbox app will sign in using your primary Microsoft Account and associated gamertag that you use to sign into Windows 10. If you want to sign in with a different gamertag, you will need to set up a second Microsoft account on your Windows 10 PC. The ability to sign into the Xbox app with a different Microsoft Account/Xbox Profile will be re-enabled in a future update.
Xbox One updates
The Xbox team is gearing up for E3 in June and we’ve got some exciting things to share with you there, but first, this month we’re continuing to preview a few things while we gather feedback and work toward making them available to everyone.
Games with Gold for June:
Pool Nation again!?!?!?!?
Fucking amazing. Just make that thing permanently free.
Massive Chalice free on debut. I guess Double Fine got a nice money hat from MS for that one.
I assume they got their hat size wrong and will be asking for a larger one soon.
I’m happy with Massive Chalice. Looks more interesting than some of the other recent games.
Cool, I didn’t even know Massive Chalice was coming to Xbox.
Razgon
6168
Indeed - the Kickstarter/Early access financed the xbox port…
