3241

I wonder about that. Demon’s Souls ended up selling a lot better than anyone involved expected. I suspect a lot of people ended up going into the game armed with advice from friends or the Internet.

I think Yahtzee did accurately reflect what someone’s first few hours with the game is like, whether you end up liking it or not. So on that level it was pretty amusing.

3242

As someone who hasn’t played the game yet, I thought it was a perfectly cromulent review. In that, I mean, it told me everything I need to know about the game.

3243

A lot of people who play Demon’s Souls get to that point he did thinking the game is just too rough… but it’s really not far after that point just after the first boss and exploring the other worlds where the game clicks and the difficulty is seen not as a detriment or insult but as a welcoming challenge that can be overcome with patience and timing.

Shame it didn’t click with him but not everyone can like everything.

3244

I got the distinct impression that he played the first level and quit, which would be grounds for me as some guy on a forum to bitch about it, but hardly enough for a review or any kind of critical perspective. Which he usually seems to manage, or at least fake.

3245

True, but I really can’t blame anyone for putting the game down at that point. Yes, it gets better once you’re past that part and start to piece together how everything works, but the initial learning curve and introduction is on par with EVE Online in terms of impenetrability. At the very least, there’s almost nothing in that first hour that hints at what the meat of the game holds in store.

3246

Unless it’s something you’re going to write a review for in a semi-professional capacity or whatever you call what he does. I like his approach generally, but his rushed take really limited his ability to speak intelligently on this game. Like I’ve said before, I don’t mind when a Chris Nahr cyclically chimes in with how much he sucked at the game while trying to get through the start screen without accidentally swallowing his controller; that’s the consumer’s prerogative and a natural consequence of an unconventional game. The game has a tremendously interesting learning curve. It’s one that allows tactics that work for mediocre players as much as good players, but it does require an investment by the player of time and thought. It is a shame if someone who plays games for money can’t muster either.

Anyway, I don’t think we’re really disagreeing that much.

3247

I would have to agree. I also found the review quite entertaining. I’ve never played the game but as people have said in this thread it is about what you would see from someone new to the game. Perhaps later he might pick the game up and try it again but like he said we (meaning I) can’t expect him to beat his head against a wall until it does click for him. He may have enjoyed the game but the barrier for entry he feels is too high.

I do plan on getting the game once I get everything set up and I do look forward to hitting my head against the same wall as he did.

3248

I can go either way, really. On one hand, yeah, he should maybe go a bit more in-depth on the game if he’s going to do something critiquing it for money. On the other, I don’t know that anyone really makes purchasing decisions based off of ZP. It’s just entertainment, really.

3249

Review was spot on for me… I put about 10 hours into the game, and tried to like it so much, but nothing about it makes sense. Its like if someone told me to take the wheels off my car to make my trip to work each day more difficult, why should I?

-Chris

3250

You’d be surprised how many editors these days are pointing writers at ZP and going, “Write something like this for us, but with more facts in it and also you can’t swear.”

3251

Second level, obviously. He talked about getting to the castle at the end of the second level in the first world.

3252

Don’t worry, you’ll find the start button eventually. Everyone’s pulling for you.

3253

Right, he got through one boss, completed exactly the introductory level of the game (which is challenging, to be sure) and then Nahr-quit before completing the second one, which is designed as a reward for the skills you should have been developing in 1-1. He doesn’t even mention in passing the other 4 worlds that open up at that point, which suggests he was utterly unprepared for it by the person who recommended it. The difficulty of DS is not really the key variable so much as the perceptual shift that is required in how you define progress. But that is what it seems like if you don’t get far and keep trying to play it like an ordinary checkpointed game.

Did you master sprinting past dragon flame? Great! Here’s some more stuff that fits that pattern in slightly different ways. Do you understand phalanxes? Here are some that are easy to isolate and drop valuable items. Do you want to cower in the battlements during a scary boss fight? Knock yourself out, and with a little preparation, you can even win that way.

Dogs and geckos are the only real new twists, and only one of those is an obstacle to progress. He hasn’t even gotten to a point in his observation of the game where he can observe that the same brief heal time limit that constrains him applies to most enemies. So instead you get his little watercress rant.

It’s actually nothing like that, but if you need help understanding the game, there are plenty of people who’d be happy to talk you through. The feedback loop is there, it’s just provided in a different manner from most games.

3254

I’d say the single biggest improvement DS could undergo is PS3-wide: Sony needs to replicate or improve on the 360’s level of voice chat/party friendliness, so that people can easily employ it while playing a game like this. I shouldn’t have to skype to add what is basic functionality (although I’m not sure if it works for silver, so I guess it’s extended functionality) on the 360, and being able to talk to someone while playing the game, especially early on, can help a great deal.

3255

I’d be interested in you elaborating on this. Perhaps in the Demon’s Souls thread if this is felt to be the wrong place for that?

3256

I firmly believe universal/cross game chat will be on PS3 next year. There has been lots of rumblings to support that rumor.

3257

How hard is it to not respond with “So nothing like this, then?”

3258

As Lynxaxa says. There was a reason why Charlie Brooker was such an important games journalist in 90s UK, y’know? It’s a very popular approach when you get someone who can do it.

KG

3259

Man, you really get the feeling that he played it for maybe three or four hours before calling it quits and heading to the microphone, on that one. Still hilarious, though, and regardless of how wrong I think his conclusions are, I can’t imagine anyone who’s been through the first few levels not laughing their assess off at his description of the way the game starts off with a sucker punch and follows with a crotch kick, difficulty wise.

Heh, you know, it’s funny - I was just saying that it sounded like he tried tearing through the game the wrong way, Chris Nahr style, ignoring the advice of everyone else who’d been playing it since it first came out, under the unshakable conviction that he had to go through one world at a time, from start to finish. He didn’t even mention anything but world 1.

3260

such a shame that gameswipe was a one off affair