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So I watched “For The Earth Is Hollow And I Have Touched The Sky” last night. Iconic episode. Imitated/homaged on The Orville, McFarlane must have been a fan.

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There’s one small change in this episode that I personally think would have made this a much better episode. The alien is shown to us, the audience, from the beginning. But Spock and Kirk learn about it about half-way through the episode on the Bridge of the Enterprise when Spock discovers there’s a total number of life forms on board that exceed the number of humans and Klingons put together.

I think that would have been a much better moment to also reveal the alien to the audience. Let the audience wonder what the heck is going on, and let them come up with their own theories in their heads instead of showing the alien from the beginning. Because what happened is that since I’ve seen the alien, I’m waiting for half the episode for the characters to finally realize they’re being manipulated by this thing, and it’s infuriating because they are not even asking questions for a long time. It feels like they’re idiots because the audience knows and they don’t know.

Anyway, let’s pretend the episode played out that way. It was a big mystery in the first
half, and then when we know about the alien, it gets interesting in a different way.

The rape scene in this episode is nowhere near as menacing as the rape scene in Season 1 when evil Kirk is going to rape Yeoman Janice. Chekov’s advances on the Klingon never really seem menacing or believable, for some reason.

The episode is clearly a commentary on war and peace. I was a little weirded out that their theory about the alien feeding off negative emotions was not only true (got it on the first try!) but that there clearly wasn’t that much evidence to go on that this is what was going on. And let’s not even talk about them laughing and mocking the alien at the end. I’m not sure how that wasn’t generating it’s own passive-aggressive emotional energy on its own. But I guess the alien can’t feed off of passive-aggression.

As a mystery (again, pretending that the alien wasn’t shown to us in the first half) this was a decent episode. As a commentary on war and peace, it was pretty poor. I did like the fact that they showed just the frustration of one party wanting peace but just not being able to convince the other party that it’s in their best interest. And the futility of only one side wanting peace. You can’t have peace if the other party is attacking you. That part was actually pretty cool. I just wish they’d expanded on it more.

So maybe not a thumbs up, but not a thumbs down either. A pretty decent episode when imagined with a small change.

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I agree. Its an OK episode limited by the budget constraints (“Enterprise-Only” as @Guap pointed out). I think this might have impacted the alien, its reveal and the resolution. Having said that it adds to “Klingon-lore” so it definitely gets a bump for that . Also Ansara is superb in the episode.

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"I have captured your Engineering section, and now control the ship’s power and life support systems. I have deprived all areas except our own. You will die of suffocation in the icy cold of space. "

All right, I’m bringing up the rear here but I am caught up with the rest of you folks in watching Day of the Dove. I’ll say up front, I liked this episode. It has its weaknesses but usually I find that if there’s at least one little hook, one little bit that catches and fires up my imagination, then I can enjoy (or least appreciate) that episode. For me, it was this one little thing: the existential horror of being caught in an eternal war, endlessly fighting, dying, living again and repeating the cycle, all on behalf of an alien entity’s enjoyment and nourishment. That’s an idea that gets under my skin.

I like that the central conflict between Kang’s Klingons and the Enterprise crew isn’t manufactured, there’s a basic difference of philosophy and culture that lends to conflict between the two civilizations. There’s a genuine feeling of almost hopelessness at the end when Kirk realizes that in order to survive this, all conflict on the ship must stop. Given the depth of animosity the crew already has even before the alien starts pushing everyone’s buttons, that seems almost insurmountable. I’m sympathetic with those of you who feel the ending isn’t earned, it is a little bit too pat for my tastes. But it’s hard to imagine stepping back from the brink like that in a very satisfying way. Then again, that’s one reason why I’m not a writer.

I liked some of the lines in this episode. Kirk’s “Captain’s log, stardate … Armageddon” is a nice touch. And one of my all time favorite lines in any episode is when Kang tries to coerce Kirk to surrender the ship, and Kirk just leans in and quietly says, ‘Go to the devil.’ I guess you couldn’t say ‘go to hell’ in the 60s on TV.

I too agree that Michael Ansara made a great Klingon captain. I don’t recall exactly what the influences on the original Klingon designs were intended to be, but they always put me in mind of a Mongol horde, sweeping out to destroy their enemies and take what they had. Nowadays, that looks pretty racially suspect in retrospect but this episode shoves those racial prejudices front and center, forces the crew to look them in the face. Same with Chekov - who knows what he would have done to Mara if Kirk hadn’t stopped him, and that’s an ugly thought right there. It’s kind of impressive that the show was willing to turn its heroes into villains on occasion, show them as infallible. Sometimes the utopian future lets the underlying human condition show through.

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I also meant to add that I like @Rock8man’s suggested change. It would have been a better episode if the mystery had played out to us at the same pace that it had to the Enterprise crew. It’s not very interesting watching a ball of light slowly follow characters around the set.

1570

“For the World Is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky”

That is a great title for an episode. It seems almost philosophical. And yet, it’s a line uttered by someone and repeated by Kirk, because the man is actually describing living inside a hollow asteroid and having seen the actual surface from a mountain.

The episode starts with nuclear missiles being fired at the Enterprise. I’m not sure why, but the shot of Spock on the bridge is out of focus. And then there’s a scene of the bridge from a different angle that’s out of focus too. Has Star Trek got a director for this episode who is trying to be avante garde in some way? What is going on? And then the episode takes a surprisingly somber turn as Dr McCoy admits that he has found he suffers from a terminal disease and has one year to live. And with that dire message, we go to the title sequence. I have to admit, I was completely hooked here. An out of focus bridge and McCoy is going to die by the end of the season? You can’t drag me out of this chair now.

And surprisingly, the rest of the episode kind of lives up to the opening. One thing I really appreciate about this era of Trek is that the writers are free to make up these beings that lived on a star system that went nova, and they created this space ship that looks like an asteroid to get to another planet. What’s a little weaker is that Spock is already familiar with these people’s written language and history. I don’t understand how this 10,000 year old civilization was studied by Starfleet archaeologists if they only existed in the one star system and that star system went nova. Doesn’t that mean that the worlds would be destroyed? Or are the worlds still there after the star died?

The heart of the episode is McCoy. As someone who has got a death sentence over his head he finds himself confronting his loneliness and his desire to have companionship. He actually weds the leader of these people who are descendants of this civilization, who don’t know they live on an asteroid ship. There’s a moment in the episode when Spock finds out McCoy’s condition, and he touches McCoy on the shoulder to show his concern. But then he keeps it there. McCoy acknowledges it with a look, but Spock keeps the hand there even longer. Damn it, if only I didn’t know this stupid show wasn’t episodic and that they would likely reverse McCoy’s disease by the end of the episode. I still found the moment very touching though. Great work here by all 3 core actors.

I enjoyed the episode a lot. The part that resonated the most today is a moment when the “oracle” (computer entity that controls the population) insists to the leader of the people that it must accept its truth, not seek out THE truth, but accept its truth. The language here reminded me a lot of current times, Fox News, the President’s alternative facts, and the time when the concept of an objective truth are being challenged. There was an emotional heft to this leader fighting so hard against the concept of accepting what she’s being told and wanting the actual truth.

Mystery solved: None of the other shots in the episode were out of focus. The person who shot the opening bridge scenes must have been drunk.

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I though DeForest Kelly did a great job in the scene where he is revealing himself to the female leader. they talk a bit and then she asks him if there is a woman in his life, which he responds no. Then she asks if he is lonely, to which I thought he would balk or say something about duty, but he simply says “Yes.” in a kind of lonely way.

Poor Bones, hasn’t had a love interest since the Salt Monster tried to kill him. That junior officer on the shore leave planet doesn’t count.

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“You’re returning with us?”
“No, I’m not.”
“Bones, this isn’t a planet. It’s a space ship on a collision course with Daran Five.”
“I’m on a kind of a collision course myself, Jim.”
“Doctor McCoy, I order you to return with us.”
“And I refuse.”
“Bones, if we can’t correct the course of this ship, we’ll have to blast it out of space.”
“I intend to stay on this ship, with these people, whatever happens.”
“Your decision is most illogical, Doctor.”
“Is it, Mister Spock? Is it really?”

As mentioned, this week we’re watching For the World Is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky. I’ll say up front, I really like this episode, and for a few reasons that I’ll try to get out of the way quickly. I don’t know if you guys can remember your first encounter with Trek - in fact I’m not totally sure I do either, but I can tell you that watching this episode as a youngster is definitely the first that I remember. I didn’t know much, I may not have known all the characters, but I remember this episode and the fire it lit in me. Looking back, my memory was much larger, more impressive than the rewatch but I remember how it made me felt, and it’s a good feeling. Sometimes things aren’t exactly as you remember, but they live up to the memory in other ways.

I believe this episode was my introduction to the concept of a generation ship, which is certainly a trope of science fiction. You could fairly say that this isn’t the first appearance of such a thing in Star Trek, with the Andromedans making the trip from their galaxy to ours and back in “By Any Other Name”. But this is the first I saw of it, with the inhabitants of Yonada living and dying for thousands of years as their vessel traveled across space to a promised new world. I remember the impact that concept had on me.

But the focus of the episode is McCoy, and that’s another reason I love the episode because he’s always been my favorite. Slight favorite, because he wouldn’t be as interesting without his interactions with Kirk and Spock, but he was always the crew member I could relate to the easiest. And seeing what he goes through in this episode, believing he’s got a year to live and then finding a fulfilling way to make the most of that time is well presented here. I believed McCoy’s conflict, and his desire to connect with Natira and her people. You can understand that, even with his friends and the crew, McCoy’s mission is a lonely one, just as it is for all those who travel between the stars.

The main flaw I can find with this episode only stands out in comparison with other episodes - it’s virtually identical in structure and content with “The Paradise Syndrome” which we saw a few episodes back. The native population of a planet are fairly simple, and unaware of the doom that bears down on them. Kirk, Spock and McCoy have to find a way to resolve that impending doom while finding love and attempting to make a new life with those people. I don’t dislike either episode for it, but I couldn’t help but notice the similarity and it did affect my enjoyment on rewatch.

Still, great character interactions and an interesting premise make this one a positive experience and a walk down memory lane.

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That was a lovely scene. I also loved how the part that made him balk was her suggestion of marriage. He recoiled and diplomatically said they didn’t know each other that well. But she reeled him back in by saying getting to know one another was the best part about having a mate.

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Agree with you there. I feel like that before they replaced the effects shots these two episodes used the same asteroid.

I got that the explanation for this is that the ancient civilization had multiple descendants/offshoots that escaped the original system, and the Federation had encountered these others before. Yonada was an isolated offshoot that was still in transit thousands of years later.

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You guys have much better memories than me. I didn’t pick up on the similarities with Paradise Syndrome when I was watching. But they’re obvious now that I think about it. I think it’s because Paradise syndrome focused on the colony that’s going to get hit by the asteroid, while Hollow World focused on the asteroid itself being a lifeship. It also helps that Paradise syndrome all took place in a beautiful natural setting, while hollow world was the same re-used set they always use for “worlds”. I enjoyed them both without pinging on the similar theme.

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“Must be this space is getting to me, too. I… I know it’s nothing you’ve done, Spock. I, I’m sorry.”
“I understand, Doctor. I’m sure the Captain would simply have said: ‘Forget it, Bones.’”

Welcome back folks, this week we are watching and discussing The Tholian Web. It’s a pretty iconic episode I believe, visually if nothing else since we get to watch the titular Tholian Web being spun in front of our eyes. The Tholians are mostly a background presence in the episode despite having it bearing their name - the immediate danger is the ‘interspatial trap’ for two reasons: it’s pulled the captain into some alternate universe, plus the warp or rift is actually warping the nervous systems of the crew, causing them to go insane and start attacking each other. You can’t say the episode is lacking for drama!

I like this episode, I feel like it’s a solid one that covers interesting territory even though it feels like it takes some weird shortcuts at times. The first thing that strikes me as odd is the crew’s response to seeing the Defiant hanging in space before them. They’ve already been told that the ship isn’t on sensors, it’s giving off no radiation. As Spock says, it’s not there. Yet when they see it they immediately decide to beam over and check it out. Why wouldn’t their first thought be that this is an illusion or mirage, or maybe even a trap?

Second, the conflict between Spock and McCoy seems a bit contrived for my taste. Yeah, I’ll buy that they’re both broken up about their believing Kirk to be dead, in their own way, but Bones jumps really quickly to total asshole in his assessment of Spock’s wishes to assume command. Sure, they argue and bicker constantly but we’ve always been shown that there’s a baseline level of respect between the two, professional if nothing else. We just don’t see that here, at least until the captain’s final orders are shown. Seems manufactured to give those orders a bit more impact, in my opinion.

One thing that’s always interested me about the show is the occasional insight into the character’s inner lives. We’ve seen Spock assume command a few times in the past and it’s always shown to be a struggle for him, that he doesn’t quite live up to Kirk’s level - he’s lacking that human touch or concern in the crew. But this episode gives him a moment to demonstrate that, to show that he does seem to be learning - when the antidote is administered Spock takes a moment to welcome Uhura back to the bridge, and points out that Chekov’s absence was keenly felt. I know this series isn’t episodic, so I’m giving this interlude more weight than was intended, but I liked that Spock had that moment.

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Also, just wanted to note that I will be on the east coast next week visiting family for Christmas so I won’t be able to watch the next episode. I don’t mind a bit if you folks want to keep going, I’ll catch up when I get back.

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I enjoyed the episode overall as well. It’s almost as if Chekov is the comic relief character on the show now. When the episode opens, he’s staring comically at the viewscreen which has nothing special on it. We find out quickly that they’re searching for the USS Defiant, which has gone back in time from Deep Space Nine and disappeared.

When they do find the defiant, it’s a ghost ship made of green ectoplasm. At least when they go over, they do the sensible thing and go in comical space suits, in case the ship disappears again, is probably their thinking.

As the episode plays out, it’s by the numbers, but what gives it that extra spice is the fact that while the rest of the crew goes crazy (Chekov in a comical way), McCoy turns into an asshole who questions everything Spock does. It’s just so out of character that it made for some really compelling viewing.

I also agree that Spock has come a long way, and was way better at command this time around, in contrast to what Dr McCoy was saying throughout the episode.

One thing I also really enjoyed is that when the lady sees Kirk, it proves she’s hysterical and certifiable and is confined to sick bay, but when the men see him, it proves that he’s really there. :-P

1579

What is the purpose of the damned web? It takes forever to build. It can be escaped if even one line is not finished. And it only works on immobile ships? Ooh, scary!

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I don’t get the web either. I mean, seems like it would trap the Enterprise but it’s only effective once it’s complete but it takes so long to finish I have to wonder if anyone actually waits around to get trapped?

Tholian Captain: “Ha ha, puny humans, we have you now! Just sit still for the next two hours while we …”

Human ship nopes right out of there

Tholian Captain: “Right. Well then. Seventeenth one this week.”

But the web and its little builders look so darn cool I can overlook all that.

Holy crap those suits look goofy. Normal enough silver suits I guess but then they stick on all these extra pieces, looks like some kid went a little nuts with legos and glue.

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There was a nice line in what is usually the jokey postscript where Kirk says “I had an entire universe all to myself.” It’s a good “science fiction” moment in the episode, calls back to the brief moment when the Enterprise itself was in that darkness, and gives a nice perspective on what was at stake if the Enterprise had been forced to abandon Kirk.

I interpreted that this and McCoy being a jerk in the medical lab were implying that the interphase sickness was starting to affect McCoy (if not Spock also).

This was a busy episode in terms of plot, dealing with the Defiant and interphase sickness; the Tholians; the death, apparition, and resurrection of Kirk; and the McCoy/Spock conflict but I think they managed to stitch it together well. One of the top TOS episodes.

1582

That’s a reasonable assumption, but then the infection would seem to be acting differently for different characters. We see Chekov in early onset suffering from spasms of pain, which Sulu commented on then Chekov just kind of goes nuts. Then with McCoy you just seem to get general jerkiness on two occasions. Which, sure, totally possible, just kind of plot convenient in my opinion.

1583

I actually like the space suits they use. If you filled in the face screens, they would sort of look Robby-The-Robot ish.

And yeah, the Tholian Web is the worst weapon EVAR.

1584

You guys are cracking me up with the Tholian Web weapon. It’s true! It’s a weapon that’s only ever useful when a ship is already trapped to one location in the first place, and you’re outmatched technologically, but luckily the ship in question doesn’t want to initiate hostilities. In this rare set of circumstances, the Tholian web is perfect!