Absolutely agree that this would have been a great finale episode. This episode had a few of the typical Trek flaws (calling to each other through the portal, when the Atavachron is not dialed in to either era…), but a lot of great sci-fi elements that work really well: the librarian with his clones waiting to the very last minute for any stragglers; the librarian’s conviction that Kirk and his friends are crazy rather than being from outer space makes total sense for the world he is supposed to be inhabiting, where interstellar travel is inconceivable. The fact that Mariette Hartley was exiled by a dictator-- from a completely unknown era in the planet’s history by the way-- is another element that gives the planet some depth, when so many of the civilizations the Enterprise encounters seem to be fragile constructions existing only so the Enterprise crew can topple them (see Cloud Minders, Archons, Spock’s Brain, The World is Hollow…).
@Guap, @Navaronegun, @BennyProfane, @scottagibson, @Courteous_D, what did you guys think of the episode?
And if you had to make the same choice as the inhabitants if the Sun was going to go nova, which era of the past would you want to go back to?
I liked it a lot. It’s a solid story, the known characters behave the way we expect, the new characters are interesting people. The bit where Spock is trying to understand what this machine is while everyone is ignoring him is brilliant.
If there were things I didn’t like:
- the implication that going back in time is a cause of changes in behavior; it’s perfectly plausible that a character might fall in love and have their behavior altered as a result, without needing a physiological reason for it;
- the plot device where people have been physically altered to survive in the past, and can’t return for that reason; this was entirely unnecessary IMHO, a crutch installed to create a reason why Zarabeth can’t return.
Neither of these are fatal, though. This is good Star Trek.
Yeah, the “regression thing” is ludicrous. Bad science even in the 1960s. Just a plot device to create conflict. regarding Zarabeth, they could have explained some “metabolic preparation treatment” necessary to survive the time travel process long term, but didn’t. Which would have solved that incongruity.
But all in all, fantastic episode. A really great sci fi good bye to the series before the finale (which is probably one of the worst episodes ever).
Guap
1809
I liked the episode over all. A good Spock and Bones side story that didn’t quite make sense (Spock was devolving because they went to the past? Whut?). It was also interesting they saved the “criminals” too, just made their life harsh.
The gizmo they used reminded me of a similar doorway portal device on an episode of TNG. In that episode Picard destroyed it so it wouldn’t fall into the wrong hands, I guess the same was accomplished here with the nova. And by the way, how about that closing shot? Credits roll as a star explodes behind them and the planet is casually destroyed.
I thought maybe they were going to do some kind of “science vs religion” trial with Kirk and the witchcraft, but then it veered off when the fat clergyman (or magistrate? not sure who he was) revealed himself as a time traveller.
Where would I pick to go? Probably like 50 years or so in the past so I can live out my natural life. I’d miss medicine, food supply chains, etc. Plus, the futher you go into the past the more literature and entertainment is missing.
Also, what percentage of this fleeing population were chased down or arrested on arrival? The more foreign you appear in the past the more likely you don’t make it.
Definitely one of the better episodes of the show. I thought the librarian was one of the best weekly characters of the whole show–focused and single-minded to a ridiculous extent, but you would have to be to accept that job.
As for myself: given sufficient money to make it work, I would go back just to the early 50s and follow the Beat movement and then the rise of rock and roll. Can you imagine hanging out in Greenwich Village with Ginsberg and company, seeing the Beatles in a basement in Germany? Seeing Johnny Cash and Carl Perkins and the Carters all together? Go to Woodstock, Monterey? See all of those 60s and 70s groups live in their prime AND get to be the old bearded guru dude that the young hippies look to for wisdom? My idea of heaven.
Guap
1811
Oh yeah, my favorite scene in this episode was when the librarian knocked out Kirk then put him on a flat cart and tried to push him through the portal. Kirk wakes up at the last second and rolls off the cart before it hits the portal. That was hilarious.
Guap
1812
So I am watching the beginning of Star Trek: The Motion Picture with my 5 year old (to try and bore him to sleep) and the first scene with Spock comes on.
He asks me “why is that man angry?”. I’m a bit confused because the scene is a typical Vulcan emotionless exchange.
Then I notice. Spock’s eyebrows (and in fact all Vulcans) are painted on in the classic “anger” position. I guess I’ve been watching Trek so long it’s just background now.
But yeah, no wonder Vulcans look so serious, they are all angry looking!
This was, indeed, an absolutely hilarious scene. Thank you for reminding me of it. It’s rare you see a great comedy action scene with a prop.
my favorite part is spock being smooth as fuck and even kirk noticing.
PLASUS: A most gracious act. One of our planet’s most incomparable works of art. My daughter, Droxine. Captain James Kirk.
KIRK: Pleasure, madam.
DROXINE: Indeed, yes, Captain.
PLASUS: And First Officer Spock.
DROXINE: I have never before met a Vulcan, sir.
https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/6f74bfd9-5605-45f3-8b88-2ffa02ce06c1
Guap
1816
Who wants to start the last one?
I had absolutely never seen this one. It turned out better than I thought, and it seems like the whole cast got their say, and there was a trial.
I can see how people may think it was controverstial, but I think you have to take the female guest star in context as representing only herself, not her entire gender. It’s her obseassion to be the captain of a starship, though not having female captains allowed is a dumb plot device from the 60s.
Good to hear the positive impression! In fact, there was murmurings upthread about the last few episodes not being great, but these last few have been really good, in my opinion. So I’m hoping they’re wrong about the last one too.
It would be easier to do this if all TOS scripts, almost without exception, didn’t include cringe-inducing misogyny. For me, this was the primary thematic takeaway of our review of the entire series.
In how many episodes are female crew members the only ones to express fear, and have to be protected from whatever threat?
In how many episodes do female crewmembers betray the Enterprise because they are seduced by an opponent? Or do female aliens betray or inadvertently fail their own kind because they are seduced by Kirk or someone else on the Enterprise?
In episodes where females reject their “natural” role as caring nurturers, how are they punished?
In how many episodes do the female characters wield not any formal authority, but only their sexual power? In how many episodes (Turnabout Intruder is one) does having any romantic attachment to a female render a man weak, untrustworthy, or evil?
Editer
1819
I just started watching some of these with my girlfriend, who has seen all the new Treks but hasn’t seen TOS since she was a kid. We started with The Man Trap, which was really a crappy way to start the series (we watched “Where No Man Has Gone Before” second, which she agreed was significantly better) and the sexism was right there – “How’d you like have her as your personal yeoman?”
But that said, you have to remember the time. It’s absolutely sexist as hell in so many ways, especially through the lens of 2020. But at the time, just having women as bridge officers was amazingly progressive. Everything Antlers says is true, but for the time the show gave more agency to women than most contemporary programs.
But yeah, baseline sexism lasted into TNG. Deanna’s uniform and being driven by emotional empathy, the other main female lead being the doctor and some of the terrible stories she was given, the portrayal of Yar as security officer vs. the way Worf was written…
It wasn’t until DS9 and Voyager that you really saw women characters with the same independent strength and agency as the men.
TL;DR: Yeah, TOS was chock full o’ sexism, but it did pretty good for 1966-69.
CraigM
1820
Counterpoint: how many times did Worf get his ass handed to him in the series?
I think he, dialogue and narratively, better treatment. The whole Tasha implied assault backstory is… yeah. But in action Worf gets more than a little dissonance from what we see versus what is said vis a vis his combat prowess.
I don’t mean to be jerky but I really like this thread and I return to it quite often - and hearing Spock say ‘Nor I a work of art’ every time I do so wears a little thin after a while, can you do something about the autoplay?
Me and my brother joked around a lot around when Season 7 was airing about how Worf always lost, and everyone was always able to do whatever they wanted on the Enterprise because Worf always got his ass kicked.
A friend of my brothers was really bothered by our jokes and I remember him explaining, no, Worf is really good, so by showing us that a particular threat can take out Worf easily, they’re just showing us how strong that threat is. Of course, that might be a valid argument if there’s lots of examples of Worf having the situation under control, but there aren’t many. So that might have been the writer’s intention but they did it too often and it had the opposite effect.
Edit: Bringing that back around to the original series, I have to say the security on the Enterprise is really poor, as we’ve remarked here in several episodes.
Well, every redshirt knows that if they try to play a role, they’re dead. So they all just hold back and let someone else take the bullet.
(Also, it’s weird that Scotty is a redshirt.)
RichVR
1824
Yeah. I blocked the element but that just got rid of the video. The sound still plays. It is annoying.
