But like we saw with Al Franken, it’s not a fair fight. The two sides play by different rules for a different kind of voter. Trump supporters are out for blood and have an appetite for this kind of thing. That’s their brand. But much of the left has no stomach for it. We’re too busy studying the rules and looking at optics to operate on such gut instinct.
Plus there’s the sad truth that bullies like Trump want the fight and when they get it, they’re in their element. Bullying works.
I don’t like it one bit but I’m trying to accept it given how goddamn frustrating this is. But I do maintain hope for (another) thorough repudiation of all this on election day.
We get the leaders we deserve, I guess. Get ready for a second Trump presidency.
CraigM
3715
But those election day results only come if the dems DO THEIR FUCKING JOB. They were elected to provide oversight and a counter to Trump. Failing utterly to hold them to any sort of standard is an abdication and proof they are unworthy that mantle.
Polls show that a majority of Americans believe that Trump lied about it and that a plurality believe that he attempted to obstruct the investigation.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/07/23/how-americans-view-mueller-impeachment-five-charts/?utm_term=.79c11f10d43a
I agree, but I don’t see how that helps. Attempting to impeach Trump will him his base, but he wins his base either way. What’s the evidence it will help him with anyone else?
One of my bellwethers for political hypocrisy is how someone would react if you changed the names/party.
Locally, I have a good example. When Ted Kennedy died, Massachusetts had a Democratic Governor. Back when we had a Republican Governor the Democratic legislature passed a law forbidding the Governor from appointing a temporary senator to serve the remaining term. Naturally, with a Democratic governor they proposed legislation to give the Governor those powers back.
I wrote my town rep (a Dem) urging him to vote against it. I got a thoughtful email in return. He said he was more likely to vote for it than not, and gave a few decent reasons why – he needed help at a federal level with things, and two people are better than one. I was happy he replied and explained his logic. When the law passed, I checked the voting records and noticed he ended up voting against it. I emailed him again asking why he changed his vote. His response was that if we had a Republican governor we wouldn’t be having this bill, and that is kinda bullshit (my words, not his).
So, back to this. We all know if this was Hillary she wouldn’t have made it this far without impeachment. Hell, I think no matter what Comey was a dead man walking. Trump fired him for the Russia investigation; Clinton would have fired him for the whole email thing. However, had Clinton done that for the emails I think the GOP would have moved to impeach. And if any other shenanigans came out, that would have fueled the pile on.
Which is my way of saying this is some bullshit. If you chanted Lock her Up over some emails, but think this is ok, that is some hypocritical bullshit.
Yep, those pesky different rules again. Hypocrisy is a motherfucker.
Democrats seem to think we will continue to elect them to office in 2020 as we did in 2018 because we want them to fight the GOP. But if the ones we already elected won’t even make the appearance of putting up a fight, why should they expect we would elect more?
Basically, if Dems can’t take the gloves off and start doing their jobs, the fight is going to end up in the street when Trump wins in 2020, the GOP retains control of the House, and our city street start looking like Hong Kong and Puerto Rico. Our current crop of Dem leadership seems to think that if we can just oust Trump and gain a few Senate seats in 2020, all will be right with the world. Maybe they’re correct, but it’s going to be awfully hard to get those victories if people don’t SEE leadership attempting to fight for them.
KevinC
3720
Anyone else just feeling a seething rage this morning? It’s not even solely directed at Trump. It’s directed at the media coverage of everything, of the Democrats being unable or unwilling to see the stakes and do what needs to be done.
I just have this burning coal in my gut. The country is sliding into the swamp right before our eyes and I feel powerless to do anything about it.
I think, perhaps, they worry that going all in will lead to fighting in the streets rather than the reverse. That what it feels like they’re doing is fighting a rear guard action against a tide which they cannot stop from coming in.
There’s basically no way to stop Trump-ism without ending gerrymandering and conservative media, and there’s no way to end those without basically undemocratic or revolutionary democratic means. So they hold on to what they can and keep the status quo going for a little bit longer.
There’s already fighting in the streets. It’s small, infrequent, but it’s happening. Proud Boys, Antifa, etc. Downplay it if you want but that’s political violence.
CraigM
3723
Look, I’m just gonna say that I’m proud of my new city for beating the Proud Boys down every time they show up in Portland.
When white supremacists show up, the appropriate response is to punch a motherfucker.
Right now those are effectively “student” protests. The wheels of capital keep moving on because everyone is too busy to do anything but work their 50 hour weeks.
When every freeway in LA or NYC has been shut down for weeks, when federal buildings in blue states have been overrun liberal people is when you’ll actually start seeing fighting in the streets.
Society is something that exists because we believe it exists. Pull the curtain back and discover an orange, angry man, and the result isn’t pretty. I think Pelosi et al hope to keep the plates spinning for as long as they can even as Republicans now spend all their energy trying to knock them down.
I’ve been banging on the media sucks drum for some time. Sadly my anger towards them doesn’t change it. :/ It’s not rage I feel now though, it’s something worse.
Defeated.
I’m gobsmacked that any rational human being can think because Mueller wasn’t John Wayne the testimony on his substance doesn’t’ matter. trump has full license now to do whatever the fuck he wants.
We are who we are I guess, and by now it’s sadly apparent that who we are really kinda sucks.
We are who we are because of media. Conservatives understood this back in the 90s - mass media was abandoning rigour for pop culture and views, and this gave the AM talking heads their opening to declare “both sides” and worm their way into the body politic. Now FOX is effectively AM talk radio of the Rush Limbaugh 90s. And most people, whatever we want to believe, are not particularly well informed, insightful or intelligent, and are more easily led than we know what to do with.
Honestly at this point liberals need to be falling back on 19th Century Revolutionary tropes - posters, propaganda, slogans and catch phrases, because we’re not going to win by posting 1000 page screeds on Vox and worrying our hands. And honestly all this virtual ink never-endingly being spilled by concerned or angry liberals is too damn cathartic and seems to be replacing action with words.
Wow. That WaPo article basically summarizes as “Many Americans think Trump lied about his campaign collusion with Russia, a decent number believe he then obstructed justice during the investigation, but most Americans also think there shouldn’t be any repercussion (impeachment) for those actions.”
Also, I’m not advocating for actually moving forward immediately with votes to begin an impeachment process. I was advocating for the Dems playing some hardball yesterday or this morning by announcing their intent to form an impeachment inquiry, and making lots of noises about having confirmation of the investigation evidence from Mueller’s testimony. Essentially, scare tactics to keep Trump and the GOP flailing a while longer while giving the appearance of action on the part of Dems.
Time to wheel out Emmanuel Goldstein and remind everyone who the real monster is apparently, as #ClintonBodyCount is trending on twitter today.
Sure, but if those are the numbers when we know a good many people don’t actually know the underlying facts, what do we think will happen if they do know the underlying facts? What tools do Dems have to make those facts more well-known? Well, nothing they have done so far has worked, so probably continuing to do those same things isn’t going to work either.
And I don’t know about you, but I think the President is a crook who did these crimes and betrayed the country, but we aren’t going to do anything about that doesn’t really sell tickets.
If they can be led, maybe some Democrats should try leading them rather than following them?
CraigM
3732
Yes, exactly what @scottagibson said.
Quit fucking around and dithering ineffectually. Have the AG arrested by the sergeant at arms. If we are going to have a constitutional crisis, then lets have it and actually fight for the country.
