Calelari
7993
On the whole “ordering a nuclear strike”, a discussion that includes a bit on how it actually works and what Woodward’s story means re: COC:
Tom Nichols has the best take I’ve yet to read on the situation. The Right’s unrealized irony here is that they’re the jackasses who put Milley in such a bad place, yet are now demanding his resignation.
ShivaX
7996
The irony is that Nichols came out pretty strong against Miley, but then people started saying “treason!” and other nonsense and he pushed back against that stupidity. So now he’s labelled as being in Miley’s corner and also a Communist or something.
I think that was his initial reaction, but once he dug a bit deeper he came to the conclusion that while Milley stepped up quite close to some very uncomfortable lines that shouldn’t be crossed, the additional info he gleaned showed he hadn’t actually crossed those lines.
KevinC
7998
What a flip-flopper. You’re supposed to stick to your original position no matter what addtional data/evidence might show!
Strollen
7999
i think that’s the best piece of I’ve seen on the subject. At this point, until the book is published and Milley testifies, I don’t think we will get a better take.
The article raise some interesting question, what limitations are in place for the huge number of “acting” people in the administration. I and think most people largely ignored the “acting” description.
But it raises an interesting question. if Defense Secretary Esper said do X, but Acting SECDEF Miller says don’t do X, what is General Milley suppose to do.
I wish there were video of this
The leopards are full, milord.
RichVR
8003
Nonsense! There are faces galore to be consumed!
God what I would pay to see it.
Alexander Vindman says Milley should have resigned rather than subvert the chain of command.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/alexander-vindman-general-milley-resign/2021/09/17/79fe52d8-17b1-11ec-a5e5-ceecb895922f_story.html
He made clear that any orders from Trump to employ nuclear forces must be routed through him. If Milley confirms this reporting in his testimony before Congress on Sept. 28, only two actions can restore the crucial balance of civil-military relations: Either Milley resigns, or President Biden relieves him of his duties as chairman of the Joint Chiefs.
A resignation accompanied by a letter similar to Mattis’s would have shed light on the seriousness of the situation inside the White House. In addition, Milley could have publicly expressed his concerns and joined other senior leaders, including Cabinet officials, who stepped down after Jan. 6, which would have been a proactive move against further abuse of power.
The Joint Chiefs of Staff consist of more than a half-dozen four-star military officers, each with several decades of honorable service and dedication to defending the U.S. Constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic. I am befuddled by the notion that only Milley was standing between a madman and Armageddon. That is the plot of a Hollywood blockbuster. That is not the way the U.S. military operates. Any one of the other chiefs of staff or the vice chairman would have stepped up and continued to serve as a guardrail. Milley’s resignation would have put people on alert and made it nearly impossible for Trump to use the military to extend his presidency. The vice chairman automatically would have served as the new chairman until the Senate was able to confirm a replacement.
In recent years, too many leaders have succumbed to situational ethics, and the public has looked the other way when people considered those leaders part of their faction. Doing the wrong thing, even for the right reasons, must have consequences. Many people in the Trump administration — including me — resigned or were fired exactly because they did the right things in the right way. Milley may have done the wrong thing for the right reasons. But the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff does not deserve greater consideration for doing the wrong thing — he deserves greater scrutiny. As my friend and former Pentagon official John Gans tweeted: “You can break norms for a greater good, but that often comes with a price. Paying it is the only way to ensure the norms survive for the next time.”
Alstein
8006
Given the short-termness of the situation, I disagree respectfully. I do think he would be right if it was not the lame duck period.
You can’t just resign because the wrong guy is in office though, but I see Gen.Milley’s actions as merely a safeguard against unconstitutional orders.
Calelari
8007
The problem with this objection is that’s the way it actually works:
(link for those who didn’t read Adam’s article what I linked to above)
Enidigm
8009
The face-eating industry is doing well. Leopard firms are at capacity and are happy to to pass on face-eating contracts to competitors. After hours everyone is in good spirits, though they wonder if they need to invest in training new Leopards and improving the image of the face-eating industry to keep up with demand. Trade shows show the number of Leopards decreasing over time and the number of faces to be eaten going up exponentially, and grey-maned veterans discuss the possibility of looking for additional Leopards overseas. There’s been incredible progress by professional organization’s political arm at getting Jaguars reclassified as Leopards; hope is by Q2 2023 this will be approved nationally.
This very much made me laugh this morning and I thank you for it.
Assuming ‘may’ in that quoted bit has the effect of requiring the President to direct the order through the Chairman, yes. But I don’t think it actually does, and lots of other people seem to agree that the President can go around the Chairman whenever he wants, since the Chairman is an advisory role, not one in the actual chain of command.
Calelari
8012
It seems trivially true that the CIC doesn’t have to follow normal, expected procedure. I mean, he could also in theory call up a theatre battery commander in Outer Bumfuck and order him to start shelling the third village to the left. I imagine he could also leave the SoD out of the loop on ordering a nuclear strike, too, if he really really wanted and could figure out who else to give the order to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
“Things will happen the way our doctrine says they’re supposed to happen, big red flags if it doesn’t, make sure I’m in the loop” seems like it should be non-controversial for Milley to reinforce.
Like.
