Trying to learn Linux (ubuntu) and hitting a wall with problems

[Tman]

I’m going to chronicle my journey here. I need to get a programming environment up, do a build, and write some code (this is my eventual goal), and I’m ready for a 30 day crash course, but holy shit what a first day. It really makes me wonder how anyone without the patience or a friend to help, can be successful on Linux.

So I have installed Ubuntu Linux … I’m trying to follow along a class on Pluralsight that is a few years old (it was using 14.04 and I’ve downloaded 16.04) and my experience for the past 6-8 hours is giving me this massive negative feedback loop on how bad Linux is.

I need to do a factory reset on my brain & figure out how to do so many things, I was hoping that some of the people here could help me out.

It took me 2 hours of trying various combinations / searches / just to get a bootable USB key and in the end, I think the entire problem was I was trying 17.04 - once I switched to 16.04, and used that ISO on the universal USB creator (I tried LiLi as well), it worked. I was so happy once that happened…but holy heck, 2 hours of no luck was really frustrating.

First off, I tried using Firefox - but the inability to download videos and instructions on how to install an Adobe Flash player on FireFox met with huge problems. Eg, I tried to download Flash from the Adobe site, but I get this “Choose an application” to use to run this & searching gives me about 20 different options - I tried several to no avail (how can the very first thing a new user on Linux will encounter not be a default option? Finally I stumbled upon a question on askubuntu where they said to set up Canonical as a software provider (why do I have to do that?) and to use a command line interface to download it. Ugh, so much pain.

Trying to use the Ubuntu Software “app store” is so frustrating. I searched “flash” and trying to decipher what may work proved to be too frustrating. Is this app store worth anything?

Then I downloaded Chrome off the chrome.google.com site, and while I can use it, (I chose “Ubuntu Software” to run it) I can’t sign into Chrome. It just has a perpetual little circle indicating it’s trying something. I signed out, signed in & it’s fixed.

Tonight, I’ll try to follow along on another set of videos off of Pluralsight and make a bit more progress.

[rhamorim]

I use Linux Mint (18.1) at work with zero problems, but then again I don’t use Flash for anything. I have installed Firefox and Chromium from the default Software Manager in that distribution again without issues, but I don’t sign into Chrome/Chromium ever. Google already knows more about me that I’d like. ;)

[arrendek]

I’ve posted this before, so I’ll just quote it here:

@arrendek

Every time it goes this way for me.

1. People say Linux has matured and is a direct competitor to Windows.
2. I install Linux, it goes fine, the install process is nice.
3. Some stupid bullshit isn’t working, something “solved” like USB mice, a wireless card, a certain HD.
4. 4 hours later I’m in some forums and I’m re-compiling drivers and they’re talking about doing shit to the kernel or something.
5. I shelve Linux for another 3+ years, since clearly it’s still not ready.

This has been happening to me for more than 10 years. In fact it was the release of Ubuntu that really had me convinced.

Sorry, this post is not helpful for you fixing problems. :(

I will say a bash shell and a lot of the tools of linux make some things awesome. I’m putzing around on servers on a semi-regular basis.

[stusser]

Adobe stopped releasing flash for linux in like 2012. I think you can still get it embedded inside Google Chrome.

That was a bummer back in 2012 but these days who needs flash anyway? I don’t have it installed on windows or macos, and disable it inside chrome.

[Tman]

@stusser

That was a bummer back in 2012 but these days who needs flash anyway?

How do you run videos off of sites like IMDB w/out Flash?

[Tman]

@arrendek

I’ve posted this before, so I’ll just quote it here:

What version of Linux for 2014-2015?

Every time it goes this way for me.

1. People say Linux has matured and is a direct competitor to Windows.
2. I install Linux, it goes fine, the install process is nice.
3. Some stupid bullshit isn’t working, something “solved” like USB mice, a wireless card, a certain HD.
4. 4 hours later I’m in some forums and I’m re-compiling drivers and they’re talking about doing shit to the kernel or something.
5. I shelve Linux for another 3+ years, since clearly it’s still not ready.
   This has been happening to me for more than 10 years. In fact it was the release of Ubuntu that really had me convinced.

Sorry, this post is not helpful for you fixing problems. :(

Yes, I’m in the same camp. For heaven’s sake, I’ve managed Linux developers (but always ran windows on my work laptop) and this is the first time I’ve decided to jump in - I really don’t have any option this time for what I need to do, so I’m going to have to buck-up and figure it out.

[stusser]

@Tman

How do you run videos off of sites like IMDB w/out Flash?

I guess I don’t? It hasn’t come up, and I haven’t had flash installed for well over a year.

Edit: I just went to imdb and the videos played fine. They’re HTML5.

[Tman]

are you running firefox or Chrome? Chrome(ium) has flash built in, whereas Firefox doesn’t. I was trying to use the default Firefox out of the ubuntu install and it prompts me to install Flash.

[rhamorim]

Yeah, most places support HTML5 video just fine nowadays. I haven’t used Flash for anything for an year or so, but I’m not the typical web user.

As I said, I’m working on Linux exclusively for over a month now with zero issues (and lots of pluses compared to Windows), but then again, I’m a software/web developer, which Linux is naturally geared towards, so to speak.

[Gendal]

@Tman

Yes, I’m in the same camp. For heaven’s sake, I’ve managed Linux developers (but always ran windows on my work laptop) and this is the first time I’ve decided to jump in - I really don’t have any option this time for what I need to do, so I’m going to have to buck-up and figure it out.

You might want to check out the Windows 10 Bash on windows. It’s ubuntu 16.04 and works great for a lot of different things, especially on the developer side.

Of course it has it’s own hangups and issues, which may be even harder to navigate if you are not a linux expert. It will however get you a bash console up that you can even run X-windows programs if you start an xwindow server like VcXsrv.

[stusser]

Yeah, I wouldn’t do that. Ubuntu on windows isn’t there yet. Tons of unexpected gotchas, and he needs to run the exact same thing as his developers.

My suggestion is to run Windows on your PC, with a linux VM.

[Gendal]

@stusser

Yeah, I wouldn’t do that. Ubuntu on windows isn’t there yet. Tons of unexpected gotchas, and he needs to run the exact same thing as his developers.

It’s come a long way since the first update. It’s hard for me to judge what would be hard for him and what would not be though. On the good side, it’s super easy to startup, on the bad side less documentation and help when things go wrong because of how new it is. Other than java compilers (clojure) I haven’t had any issues as of late.

What tech stack are you trying to work with Tman? That can majorly cloud which direction to point you in.

Another option is just to embrace the pain and start up archlinux. It’s my favorite distro but installing it from scratch, as it’s designed to be, is going to be daunting. If you do get it installed you can look forward to a much better understanding of how linux works and what to do when things go wrong.

Really the key component here I think is patience and the time to practice it.

[stusser]

The windows firewall blocks ubuntu on windows, and there is no way to fix it other than setting the firewall to permissive. It’s not fully baked yet.

[Tman]

@Gendal

What tech stack are you trying to work with Tman? That can majorly cloud which direction to point you in.

Well, we’re likely to be doing QT (C++/C) - although it’s not firm yet. It’s largely going to be an embedded application with a companion phone / tablet app.

[Gendal]

@stusser

The windows firewall blocks ubuntu on windows, and there is no way to fix it other than setting the firewall to permissive. It’s not fully baked yet.

Not sure how you would expect it to behave otherwise? I don’t even remember dealing with any sort of similar issue.

My use case for this is as a dev box, certainly not any type of long term server.

@Tman

Well, we’re likely to be doing QT

Ah, C++, that will probably work great on the Windows Subsystem, unless you are using some type of X11 app. Which does work, but would increase the chance of running into issues.

[stusser]

@Gendal

Not sure how you would expect it to behave otherwise? I don’t even remember dealing with any sort of similar issue.

I would expect to be allowed to pass pico connections through the firewall without turning the whole thing off.

QT is a UI framework, all of KDE is built on it. Very likely they’re doing a graphical UI.

[Gendal]

@stusser

QT is a UI framework, all of KDE is built on it. Very likely they’re doing a graphical UI.

Right, worked with it briefly before, but are they testing on X11? I haven’t looked at it’s mobile components at all, don’t know if they have a whole simulator thing or not.

@stusser

I would expect to be allowed to pass pico connections through the firewall without turning the whole thing off.

I didn’t realize this was ever a thing? 99% of the time I just test locally on the machine and that works without issue. I was curious though and started up a simple web server. In order for it to work I had to set a custom windows firewall rule to allow that port and then I was able to see it on my phone without issue. My windows firewall is certainly on and working, as this test showed.

Microsoft has been making updates fast and furious with WSL, though it’s all gated behind the fast ring. Right now I am just running the creator’s update though.

[stusser]

Unless they fixed it in the insider releases, your firewall is set to permissive, allowing outgoing connections.

[Gendal]

I just set an outgoing Windows FW rule and it worked for both WSL and Windows. Again, this is on the creators update, no idea when/if they fixed it with the insiders program.

[rei]

As a former techie generalist who devoured everything and tried to learn everything, Linux for the desktop is tolerable if you absolutely have no money or your time is worthless.