The giant cat thread went so well, I thought I’d try another one.
A friend and I are considering taking up a martial art together, mainly because it’s something we’re both interested in, but signing up to get your ass kicked by strangers is a scary thought. So, which should it be?
My parameters:
It should be something primarily or entirely unarmed.
It should be something that will help me get into shape (he’s in better shape than I am), but it should still be possible for me to enjoy in my current lumpy state.
It should be fun to do and fun to learn.
It would probably be best if it wasn’t competition-oriented, though it might be nice if there is competition at higher levels without that being the drive of the thing, you know?
I’d rather it not be something absolutely savage, because I’m not getting into this with the goal of just ripping new assholes for people.
And that’s about it. I’m currently looking at a northern style kung fu slash tai chi school, and he initially suggested aikido. Any thoughts/suggestions?
I recommend Aikido. It meets all of your requirements and has the added benefit of being an art that focuses on not injuring your opponent. This can be VERY useful in keeping you out of a courtroom if you ever need to use it in an actual fight.
It is not the easiest martial art to master, and since you don’t really use the flamboyany kicks seen in arts like Tae Kwon Do it isn’t the “coolest” looking martial art to an observer. It is a very potent art, however.
<edit> In case you are unfamiliar with Aikido, it basically uses circular movements, and revolves around using the opponents energy and movement against them to assist in disabling them. In essence it attempts to end an encounter with the smallest expenditure of your own energy, coupled with the least amount of damage to your adversary.
This is my recommendation as well. It is what most police forces use for training since it’s relatively easy to pick up.
It meets all of your requirements
Well, to be fair, it doesn’t emphasize athleticism that much, which is part of its appeal to me =) You don’t have to be stupid flexible, strong, fast, etc. to be proficient.
It is not the easiest martial art to master
But it’s VERY easy to learn.
It is a very potent art, however.
It is what Stephen Seagal practices, although he makes some, um, modifications that aren’t quite in the spirit.
Let me clarify about athleticism: I’m overweight and flabby. I’m not trying to become a musclebound jock or anything, but the nature of my available time and money is such that, if I do make both available for a martial art, it has to be sufficient exercise to shape my body into a more attractive state. You know, a healthy weight, some muscle tone, but not stacked or anything. One site I found said that aikido would basically give me the exercise results I want… would you say that’s accurate? Also, I do like, conceptually, the idea of exerting less force, etc.
Also, I’m having some difficulty finding information about aikido competition. It seems as though, despite what I said earlier, it’s almost not competition-oriented enough. Can anyone elaborate on this? Not that that’s necessarily a negative anyway, as I doubt I would compete until I was high, high level, if ever, but it’s a point of interest that I’d like a cogent explanation of, if any of you have one.
It’s more exercise than, say, playing WoW and eating Pringles. It’s not as much exercise as wu-shu, but it also doesn’t require near the amount of dedication.
Here’s the trick about martial arts – the constraint is your time. If you want to be the baddest motherfucker on earth, then you’re going to have set some time apart…like ten years…and train real hard. If you want to get by on 2 hours a week, well, your options are more limited, and you will no longer be the baddest motherfucker on earth, and you probably won’t be able to do Van Damme splits.
There’s definitely activity, but most martial arts classes are not calisthenics classes, if you want that, join a gym.
You will definitely be throwing people and being thrown, so it’s not exactly sitting-and-meditating passivity. But you will not be reguarly sparring (which, I might add, is horribly overrated).
Also, I’m having some difficulty finding information about aikido competition.
There is none. Aikido is about non-violence, non-aggression, and thus competition is anathema to that. You will rarely (if ever) find sanctioned “aikido tournaments”. In aikido you practice as defender (nage) or attacker (uke), and at higher levels you practice randori, which is sort of like sparring but you’re basically defending yourself.
There’s an old joke that if there competitive aikido all contests would end in a draw as both combatants just looked at each other.
Aikidio, IIRC, does not have a single move where you initiate an attack. Everything is reactionary.
One important note about aikido and self-defense – until you’re REALLY well trained, you will be at a disadvantage against a competent fighter. Aikido’s entire underlying philosophy is about using an opponent’s overextension against himself. Well trained fighters do not overcommit to the degree that aikido requires
However, 99%* of all fights are initiated by drunken rednecks, and this is exactly what aikido is designed to defend against. Seriously, like pretty much all the moves are against the equivalent of “clumsy overhand swing with a baseball bat”, “clumsy overhand swing with a beer bottle”, or “some asshole grabbing your arm/hand/shirt”.
Probably the most immediately useful martial art on the planet, IMO.
I looked it up on the Internet, it must be a true stat!
You’ll find Aikido will give you more than enough workout – like Bacon said, you don’t need to be ninja flexible to start learning, but it’ll definitely help your flexibility and stamina as you practice. And it’s a lot of fun :) I practiced Aikido for a couple years a while back – while I was a chair-bound flabby, it was doable, and I definitely lost weight. (haven’t done it for ages, though, so I’m back to my previous chairflab state, but hey)
Aikido isn’t generally competitive per se – however, any time you’re practicing, you practice on a partner, and switch off being attacker (uke) and defender (nage), so it’s not like you’re just doing forms or whatever. Once you have some idea what you’re doing, you’ll start doing “Randori” practice, in which you learn to defend against multiple attackers. You’ll also get to do some sword and staff work.
If you really thirst for competition, Aikido training translates very well to Judo, as they’re both (more or less) descended from Jujitsu.
Best advice: don’t decide what martial art to practice purely based on internet research – use the 'net to help decide which ones sound interesting, then call your local dojo(s), tell 'em you’re a newbie, and ask if you can sit in on a session or two. (they’ll say “yes”, and they’ll let you sit in if you just show up without calling, but it’s polite to make contact first, etc).
More importantly, there aren’t really forms/kata, which I’ve always found as somewhat lame unless they’re practicing the actual techniques. Chinese arts tend to incorporate actual technique into their forums, but Japanese and Korean striking oriented arts (shotokan,tkd, et. al.) have these goofy hip punches that no one EVER uses.
If you really thirst for competition, Aikido training translates very well to Judo, as they’re both (more or less) descended from Jujitsu.
Yeah, judo works well too, although it tends to require a bit more exertion and has evolved into more of a sport than a martial art.
Best advice: don’t decide what martial art to practice purely based on internet research – use the 'net to help decide which ones sound interesting, then call your local dojo(s), tell 'em you’re a newbie, and ask if you can sit in on a session or two. (they’ll say “yes”, and they’ll let you sit in if you just show up without calling, but it’s polite to make contact first, etc).
The one thing to be VERY careful of here is that many, MANY private schools are profit oriented. It seems that today there are new belt colors showing up constantly in certain cough styles so that the school can charge another belt test fee. And many schools simply won’t fail you for a belt test because they know those that fail become discouraged and quit…no more money for them.
This is why I recommend that people use college/university student organizations to learn. The University of Florida had a very active aikido student organization when I was there that was really inexpensive and very high quality.
Ok, another question: how lame/not lame is it for two (totally not gay!) dudes to join up together and always spar/practice against each other? Is it lame? Will the instructor tell us to get a room or change partners? Or does it not matter for aikido, because one of us is just doing dummy attacks anyway?
Also, BTG: my school doesn’t have any martial arts clubs other than Shotokan, and my friend doesn’t go to that school. That in mind, what are some things to look for to make sure the dojo is a good one?
You won’t always partner up with the same person – one of the ways you learn is by trying the techniques on people of different size/shape/strength/etc. So, even if you and your ahem male companion always go to practice together, you’ll get thrown around the room by all kinds of people (well, and you’ll throw all kinds of people as well :))
As for what makes for a good dojo, go check out a session or two, talk to the instructor, ask about their afilliations. There aren’t any “right” answers, but you’ll know if you’re given a wrong one (c.f. Rex-Kwon-Do)
Yes, it’s lame.
[ul]
[li]There may be an odd number of participants and someone will need to sit out…if you’re like birds mated for life, then you’ll never have to sit out
[/li][li]They don’t want you to become accustomed to the mannerisms of one specific other individual
[/li][li]It’s pretty antisocial
[/li][/ul]
my school doesn’t have any martial arts clubs other than Shotokan, and my friend doesn’t go to that school. That in mind, what are some things to look for to make sure the dojo is a good one?
It’s real tough to say. First off, look at the fee schedule. If it feels like they’re nickel and diming you to death, then that’s a warning sign. For example, none of the following is bad by itself, but together they can be warning signs:
[ul]
[li]must have a uniform
[/li][li]must purchase uniform from them
[/li][li]frequent belt tests
[/li][li]limited classes unless you pay for more
[/li][li]limited availability of classes
[/li][/ul]
I’ve always wanted to open a tae-bo/aikido gym where you can go like 24/7 and work out and what not, but that would never survive. =/
Well this is one near me, though I don’t think it’s the one my friend said he found, but just for comparison’s sake. It’s $80/month, which is more than I had hoped, but you can attend as many classes as you want, in both aikido and iado.
Interestingly, the guy who runs that dojo is also an excellent swordsmith. His site appears to be down now, and he only really makes commissioned pieces, but a while ago he did have a few things up for public sale, including a really nice tanto, the asking price for which was $10,000.
Personally I’d do Boxing, Muay Thai or Brazilian Jujitsu, if none available then Judo. As said above avoid anything asking big money for exams, belts, grades etc. Watch out for master/guru’s running it like a cult instead of a business too.
However, 99%* of all fights are initiated by drunken rednecks, and this is exactly what aikido is designed to defend against. Seriously, like pretty much all the moves are against the equivalent of “clumsy overhand swing with a baseball bat”, “clumsy overhand swing with a beer bottle”, or “some asshole grabbing your arm/hand/shirt”.
I don’t agree with this, unless you are referring to the first year or so of training. Aikido becomes increasingly complex as various moves are layered together- something you really won’t see in early training. Some of the grappling and locking moves are very effective against even experienced fighters.
A couple other points:
-As already stated, NEVER join a dojo that has Aikido competitions. It goes against everything that Aikido represents, and will be a definite black mark against you should you join other serious schools at a later date. Many schools do not even use belts.
-Morihei Ueshiba, the founder of Aikido, was considered one of Japan’s finest martial artists, despite the fact that he abhorred fighting. In fact, he was reluctant to even call an attacker an enemy or adversary. Instead he tended to use the word “partner”, as he believed these people were put before you to help temper your spirit.
First of all I’d suggest you not pick Taekwondo. I practiced TKD for three years and while it was fun, and always gave me a good workout, the amount of stretching needed to do those high kicks is excruciating. I quit after injuring myself during stretching and I couldn’t go back since the injury never seemed to go away. This is not meant to drive people away from TKD, but if you can’t touch your toes without bending your knees already then you are in for an uphill struggle and you will likely never be as good as the people who started training as kids.
After leaving TKD behind me I started doing Judo, which I enjoy very much, and which I think is a lot easier on the beginner.
Also, it’s been my experience that you get a much better workout if you are training with people who are above you in skill level and leave the beginner group behind you as soon as possible.
Looking at the site it seems very reputable. Fixed fee per month with unlimited classes and the option of purchasing equipment elsewhere all set off the feel-good vibe.
I wish SO bad I had an aikido dojo near me, but the nearest is probably 30 or so miles. sigh
I’d definitely go by and check it out. The thing about aikido is that practitioners that stick with it are inevitably VERY mellow. There is very little bullshit testoterone, since there’s no competitive atmosphere.
Aikido becomes increasingly complex as various moves are layered together- something you really won’t see in early training. Some of the grappling and locking moves are very effective against even experienced fighters.
At very high skill levels I’ve seen some practitioners defend “okay” against a boxer, but boxers are taught not to overcommit. Against someone who is very well disciplined it just isn’t that effective, at least in the demonstrations I’ve seen (when I used to attend other student groups would come in and ‘demonstrate’ against us – it wasn’t sparring, but more of a way to see how various styles compared and contrasted).
What we saw was that a disciplined fighter using hand techniques (kicks pretty much resulted in getting dropped to the ground VERY quickly for the attacker) could land pretty stinging blows with ease, but this had to be a VERY disciplined fighter who:
[ul]
[li]did not extend and hold
[/li][li]managed to stay away from the nage’s center
[/li][/ul]
Those were good classes, because it did force the aikido students to remember that not everyone attacks with a lurching overhand strike.
Don’t get me wrong, I still wouldn’t fuck with a nidan aikido practitioner…well, actually, now that I think about it, why not, it’s not like they’re going to hurt you. ;)
