UFC Gets Some Pride

Sorry, I still don’t like UFC but dug Pride whenever I could watch it. Now… crap who knows what’ll happen to Pride.

— Alan

So very cool.

Shit, Chuck is going to fight RAmpage? DAMN…that oughta be fun to watch.

Yeah. Here’s hoping I can talk my brother into purchasing it again. The last UFC was great.

Obviously my UFC hate doesn’t go very far :)

— Alan

Big news

I don’t really understand why people make the distinction. What’s the difference, kicking while they’re down? It isn’t exactly some dim mak technique that’s only available to the upper echelons. They’re games, they have rules, the rules are slightly different. The main thing is that you get to see somebody get knocked the fuck out without puffy gloves and super-restrictive rules.

H.

Also there’s the octagon.

My issues with the different organizations are partly the rules and partly the quality of fighters. The quality of UFC fighters, on the whole, is just average, whereas Pride has consistently had some of the most fearsome fighters in the world – CroCop, Wand, Fedor, Rua, the Nogs, Henderson, Randleman, etc. UFC has basically had like three or four top fighters, and almost never in the heavyweight division.

The rules are an issue, but I think that has more to do with the sanctioning bodies than anything else. Safety is a concern, obviously (cf. Renzo’s concussion from the illegal strikes by Frank Shamrock), but if the rules become too restrictive they get gamed. Side control would be a lot different technically if you could still do knees to the head.

IFL has pretty good fighters as well, it’s like a UFC minor league. My least favorite is BoDog, by far. The fighters all suck, the commentary is weak, the ref stands them up far too quickly, and it seems like every other fight has someone falling out of the ring.

The good thing is, with any luck, we’ll now see how dominating the Pride fighters are.

Yeah, the UFC didn’t introduce rules except where they were required to do so to obtain sanctioning. I actually think they should be more willing to stop fights for bleeding, even if it’s not affecting a fighter’s eyesight or performance - it just creates a ghoulish spectacle that’s a lightning rod for opponents of MMA. I do miss knees on the ground though.

But this is great news, in my opinion. Consolidating the best MMA fighters is fantastic, assuming they all tag along, which presumably they will (and be contractually obligated to do). So many great match ups to think about.

From what I understand, the Fertittas are keeping Pride as a separate organization, but they’ll have superfights on occasion. I hope they can lure some of the UFC’s best fighters into the Open Weight Grand Prix events… it’d be interesting to see how Chuck would stand up to Fedor :)

$65 Million Dollars. Wow.

It must be some subtlety I’m not trained to see, and I mean that seriously, not snarkily. If Liddell or Hughes get owned by Pride fighters left and right, I’ll easily concede the point.

I watched IFL for the first time last night, and it was pretty good. The refs are stopping fights WAY too early, IMHO, but they were still good fights.

H.

A couple rules changes were necessary for viewership and fighter viability. The two big ones are stand up rules (to keep the action going instead of letting a guy stall you out in his guard) and gloves. What a lot of people don’t realize is that gloves are there for the striker’s benefit – in bare knuckle brawls the vast majority of injuries from striking are to the striker’s hands. This is true of early UFC and it is also true of other bare knuckle competitions like the Sabaki Challenge or the Kyokushin All-Japan and All-World competitions.

The introduce of rounds and scoring was also a necessity for pay-per-view, although I personally prefer the Pride-style (on occasion) 10 minute round followed by a 5 minute round. I dislike multiple small rounds because it lets an opponent that’s being dominated get saved by the bell. I’ve seen quite a few fights where a guy gets in good position, starts beating the hell out of the other guy, bell ends the round, and in the next round the guy that was getting the shit kicked out of him manages a lucky punch to end it. Blah.

I actually think they should be more willing to stop fights for bleeding, even if it’s not affecting a fighter’s eyesight or performance - it just creates a ghoulish spectacle that’s a lightning rod for opponents of MMA.

While true, the big problem is that “bleeders” will tend to lose to TKO far too often. In particular, you’ll see fighters start training to cut opponents (this is done in boxing already) with elbows and twisting punches.

There are some pretty piss poor fighters in Pride, don’t get me wrong, but there is a general sloppiness on the part of UFC fighters (short of a few) that you don’t see in Pride. The top Pride fighters are masterful technicians, and you don’t see that in the UFC that much. UFC guys often rely on raw power too much, and the submission game isn’t as easy to get with the oppressive standup rules and relatively short rounds, so part of the problem is the rules format that favors stand up.

FWIW, I’m specifically talking about light-heavy and above. I think if Lidell competed in Pride he’d probably be the third or fourth ranked fighter at his weight class in that organization. I think if Sylvia competed in Pride he probably wouldn’t even crack the top 5.

In the welter/middleweight classes, it’s pretty close. Hughes, GSP, BJ Penn, etc. would all compete well in Pride and could likely win their divisions.

That makes more sense to me, as I can see the difference between the heavies in UFC and the middles, technique-wise. I can’t really think of a heavyweight that has impressive technique like Hughes, they’re just massive strikers/pounders.

H.

Yeah, the UFC is really weak in heavweights, which is why Couture was able to come back again and win. I used to be really impressed with Arlovski, but losing to Sylvie a couple of times really tainted that impression.

But in the middleweight/welterweight, I think the UFC has the best depth of talent, as well as the best overall fighters at those weights. Light Heavyweight the UFC at least has some competitive guys, but it’s unlikely Lidell would be on top - although that guy really has exceeded all my expectations in the past, so who knows. He’s certainly fought far better in the past couple of years than previously in his career.