Valve expects some modder will fix Half-Life: Alyx

Dude, that’s like saying Skyrim is within the same genre of classic or old-school RPGs – obviously with some additions, changes, or evolutions if you want to call it that.

There’s a point where you’re using a term so broadly as to make it meaningless. By your rationale, Rage, Deus Ex: Humankind Whatever, Mirror’s Edge, and Overwatch are all classic or old-school FPS games.

Heh, here we are, arguing shooter semantics in an Alyx VR thread. Hopefully folks that want to talk about Alyx don’t mind because they’re in the other thread.


I think the disconnect here is that the DOOMs went in an utterly different direction from other modern FPS games like Halo, CoD, Metro, Far Cry, etc. Their moment to moment gameplay feels completely different from those games as you’re forced to be aggressive at all times to succeed, rather than focusing on survival through careful avoidance and tactics. That doesn’t make DOOM gameplay retro so much as different.

It’s true that Wolf3D and the original DOOM games forced you to be aggressive, but that was because they were extremely simplistic games and there wasn’t anything else you could possibly do. You can’t duck behind cover in Wolf3d, there is no cover, you aren’t sneaking up on an enemy outpost and shooting the alarms before clearing it out, all you can do is move and shoot. Similarly very limited resource management, no character progression, etc.

Why you had to be aggressive in the original games is irrelevant. The fact is, you had to be.
Just as you have to be in Doom 2016/Eternal. And that is the core difference between those games and cover shooters.

Rage, possibly (I barely remember the game, tbh, it was so forgettable). The new Deus Ex games are prime examples of cover-based shooters (oh and they are also way more RPG hybrids).
Mirror’s Edge? lol…
Overwatch? That’s a multiplayer shooter with an extreme focus on working together as a team. And playing there like you would in Doom just gets everyone killed (on your team).
So, no, they are not all classic or old-school FPS games.
And Doom 2016/Eternal still are.

Also, “so broadly as to make it meaningless”?
That would be FPS. Or RPG. But even those still carry quite enough meaning to differentiate them from say, “puzzle games”.

Maybe you are irked by the name “classic” FPS? As Doom Eternal is indeed somewhat different from, say, Ion Fury. But how these FPS focus on constant movement, being aggressive and in the middle of the action at all times over hiding away and sneaking around is the same.
And it sure doesn’t look classic.

Doom Eternal is ‘old school’ in the sense that it focuses on fast, complex, brutal action over the plot, or having scripted set pieces.
But like Telefrog says, mechanically is very different from 90s FPS and it has tons of RPG progression.

I wouldn’t say I’m irked. I think my problem is that I’m attempting a conversation with someone too insistent on proving some point. :)

But you’re more than welcome to call Doom Eternal whatever you like. You can even call it a dessert topping if you like!


Insistent on proving a point? In a discussion?! With arguments, even?!
Well, you really got me there. I don’t see the purpose of a discussion without trying to get results out of it.

But hey, it’s okay. I’m used to people bowing out of discussions once they run out of arguments or just tire of it (both of which is fine, btw.).

I just might! Might even leave out an s to confuse people.

“DOOM: Eternal is the balsamic & strawberries of ice cream toppings. Unexpectedly tart and delicious!”
- Tom Chick

You’re going to send me into a grocery store with that kind of talk.

So… has anyone here tried out Alyx? Is it any good?

I don’t have a VR headset so it’s not for me and, to be honest, I never really did get the whole “Half Life is amazing” thing. Was just another shooter for me with annoying cutscenes you couldn’t skip because they took place during the actual game. Blasphemy, I know. ;-)

I’m also pretty sure that everyone who loved the first Half Life never finished it. :-P

Still curious to know if this new Valve release is any good.

This is every single shooter released since Half-life. You could often “skip” the cutscenes just by walking by and continuing on your way. I don’t recall one ever that interrupted the game flow, except the initial tram ride, which was a gimmick that totally worked at the time.

The other thread has more actual impressions of the game.

Doom Eternal’s movement is not that far removed from Unreal Tournament 2003/2004 which included a similar mechanic for double shifting in various directions. The only thing that was missing was a ledge grab.

I’m really kind of mindblown that @tomchick and @Telefrog think these things are so far apart as to not be comparable. You must not be playing the same games I am. The way a “level” unfolds in Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal matches up quite nicely with the original games. The only true difference is the one @TheSHEEEP points out… you gain your ammo and health in a new way that augments standard pickups left on the ground. Even the exploration is very similar for finding secrets once encounters have been successfully completed with the enemies.

I’ll also say that Skyrim is indeed an evolution of the Elder Scrolls Arena, Daggerfall and Morrowind… all classic RPGs.

There are tons of them in HL2 anyway where you are trapped in a room while Alyx or her dad talk to you.

Of course they’re comparable. You can compare anything you like. Apples to oranges, for instance, or apples to airships, or apples to aliens. Doom to dessert toppings. Have at it. What we’re saying is that calling Doom Eternal an “old-school classic FPS” is missing the point of both Doom Eternal and old-school classic FPSs.

Well, sure. But why wouldn’t you say Doom is an evolution of “old-school classic FPSs”? Because calling something an evolution of X isn’t the same as equating it with X.


There is a Doom thread.

kerzain expects some mod will fix the Half-Life: Alyx thread.

I thought this was a dessert thread now.

I want a maple bar.

I’m not sure this discussion is worthy of an actual Doom thread.


Well that does it. The Doom remake has been on my backlog for too long and there is a sale going on. I’m going to have to determine for myself just what kind of dessert we are all discussing here.

Also great on ice cream? Brandied cherries. Fuhhhhhmazing.

Easy to make, too. You just submerge pitted cherries in 1:2 simple syrup:brandy mixture with a bit of vanilla and a squeeze of lemon.