Victoria 3

The official forum for this game is even worse than average for a Paradox game, it’s kind of depressing. I’m so excited for everything I’ve seen of this game so far, and then the forums are just people who are furious it doesn’t work exactly how Vicky 2 did.

Without “mana” to rail about they’re probably thrashing around searching for their next crusade.

The top subject this week is the players being allowed to choose what to build instead of the capitalist AI choosing for them. Not that the various capacities and equivalence or not to mana don’t get some discussion.

There is definitely a contingent that sees any divergence from Vicky2 as heresy, but that is tiny. Honestly, even the people who want capitalists to build their own stuff are a minority I’d say. It’s just that at this stage, there’s not much to write about except long drawn-out arguments. If you make a post about a neat potential idea, it will get 25 likes and zero replies. Complain loudly about the design and you are guaranteed as many replies as you can stand.

Personally I am saving my ire for when the reveal that they aren’t modelling the exact path each resource takes from producer to consumer.

Edit: Though god help me the amount of digital ink spilled over maintaining roads using authority. How can people possibly maintain roads without being paid? It’s inconceivable!

I long defended the way the different economic systems worked in Vicky(with the expansion) and Vicky 2. But the capitalist AI was just so dumb it was hugely frustrating to actually play that way. And it’s not like the capitalists actually built factories in a way that would maximize their profits. They built stupid unprofitable factories that would go bankrupt right away.

I hope they do something with the investment pool that affects capitalist happiness based on your decisions, but I’m definitely glad at this point that they aren’t bringing the old system back.

Also, yeah, plenty of people still think capacities are mana because mana is whatever you want it to be.

If it’s anything like real life, they don’t, but they also don’t get maintained.
Anyway, yeah, it’s big enough community (for a while now) that most of what it produces is circular garbage arguing against itself. Even being somewhat beaten by marketing doesn’t justify it, because every design decision is a choice about game design and realism that don’t really have perfect answers, and need to mesh together. And be fun. And all that crap will be moddable, go ahead and make your unfinished and unfinishable MEIOU.

The responses on this thread made me feel a lot better about reasonable people actually existing in that community: Worries about too much player control | Paradox Interactive Forums

Really not sure why I’m bothering to read anything other than the dev diaries on those boards but at least this one made me feel better.

Yeah aside from the dev posts, everything is at best speculation. The remaining posts tend to be dominated by the histrionics.

Maybe best to ignore them until we get to the real histrionics on release!

Oh I know it is. As a grown adult I don’t get overly excited games these days, but a new Victoria is an exception to that. Imperialism and Victoria taught me how awesome the 19th century is as a strategy game setting and hold a special place in my heart.

Yeah, I am pretty excited, and it’s not like I follow my own advice to stay away from the forums. I want to grab the devs by the lapels and yell “give me all the information now, now, now!”.

One thing the devs have been super-quite about is the military aspect of the game, except to say that’s it’s not an intended focus of the player’s time. This contrasts with setting up the map to have as many provinces as HoI4. If they go with a combat model anything like Vic2, this will be supremely ungainly. Hopefully they have something fairly abstract and tidy in mind.

First discussion of Goods and how they’re categorized. Not a lot of details yet but more to come when they cover pop needs.

The important thing is that next week is Production Methods which is something they’ve shown in lots of screenshots but have yet to explain. Based on those screenshots I’m incredibly intrigued by this.

Yeah, I’m looking forward to that one!

The dev responses in the thread are a bit more illuminating that the main DD content. For instance, some nice details on how they model pops:

Are pops considered one unit? Or do individuals move and join different pops and/or create a new pop for their type?

Yes, individuals inside a Pop merge with suitable Pops in their destination, and bring their “share” of their properties along with them. So if a part of a poor but literate unemployed Laborer splits off to move to another state, and finds another Laborer Pop of their own culture and religion there that they can merge with (and there’s an open spot available for Laborers in the target Pop’s workplace) then they will merge with them. The Literacy and Wealth they bring with them (among other properties, like Radicals or Qualifications) will then modify the target Pop proportionally.

It’s all pretty technical and most of the time near-invisible on an individual Pop level, but by being judicious in simulating this stuff we get some very interesting emergent effects like brain drain, itinerant oppressed demographics, geographic wealth shifts, and so on.

This is a real meaty diary.

People often joke about Paradox games being like playing a spreadhseet.

They are taking it to heart. I love it.


My second job out of college was the junior software engineer developing a new spreadsheet, for Visicorp, the company that invented the first spreadsheet VisiCalc. It looks like my life has come full circle, I used to get paid to make spreadsheets for work, and now I’m going pay others to use a spreadsheet for fun.

I really love this and all of the potential consequences of pushing new technology to a society that isn’t ready to adopt it.

I really like the overall mod potential with this production method model.

I don’t know how you guys can read these developer diaries, the wait is too much. I will hold off at least until we get a release date and then binge these things over one glorious weekend.