4021

Am I misremembering something back from when Rick’s group was at the Atlanta CDC. Didn’t that guy tell them that everything was gone. That there was no one left, even in Washington to deal with the outbreak? I was pretty sure that guy said all contact was gone. Sure Mad Scientist Eugene might have another source, but it would be interesting to see him have to defend his position to someone that had first hand knowledge of the CDC. I hope this isn’t just lazy writing where they forgot about something that was already set up. Of course they forgot about the black helicopters over Atlanta in the first season so who knows. Maybe there is someone in Washington posing as a lab luring Eugene and company there.

If we could forget about a few things mentioned in earlier seasons, I think a great series ending would be Ricks group getting to a border say somewhere in kentucky or Tennesee and being confronted by a large military contingent. In the final moments they are told that the Zombie virus has a vaccine but that the East Coast remains under quarantene so “back you guys go, get away from the fence”.

4022

I think zombie fiction works best where there’s still the thinnest, slightest shred of hope. Something that has been missing from the show since the CDC episode essentially said “The world is over”.

Hepcat, he played Bull - and you only need to watch Community to see what a difference a change in writers/producers makes to an actor.

4023

Oh, I’m not disagreeing with you. As I said, I know that actor can do some fantastic work.

4024

I may or may not disagree with you here.

I think I’ve posted this before. I think the best (and most traditional) zombie fiction happens when the focus is on a non-exceptional group of survivors who really have no hope of figuring out what the “big picture” might be. Most of TWD is like this - they’re normal Joes/Janes who are desperately trying to get by and survive. They have no way of knowing what’s going on far outside of their little world – a world that probably extends not too much farther than their line-of-sight.

That was one of the beautiful and revolutionary things behind Romero’s original films (at least the first two): unlike the monster movies that had come before, the heroes (and thus the audience) were not provided any special information about the horror. They are not privy to scenes with the mad scientist creating the monster; there is no Van Helsing or Gandalf who shows up to explain the rules to them; there are no government scientists pushing buttons and providing “the answer” halfway through the second reel.

Instead your heroes are suburbanites who have no access to any of that stuff… and that’s fantastic! Are the zombies the result of genetic experiments? Is there no more room in Hell? Is it an alien virus from a comet? The best zombie stories will shrug and say “sure, could be” and then simply move on because the zombies are the setting, not the plot.*

That’s why the CDC episodes annoyed me so much: they tried to turn the zombies into the plot. Worse, they took the heroes and made them (however briefly) privy to exceptional information that a “traditional” zombie hero would not get. They do get some slack from me in that the information was almost completely useless. I will be mucho disappointed if Eugene actually does lead them to a cure.

Anyway, on the lack/presence of hope: the “ignorant hero” thing I describe above kind of allows for both. You’re just trying to survive day-to-day, and you can either cling to the idea that the cavalry will ride in at any time or dissolve into despair.

  • Note: I don’t have a LOT of trouble with zombie fiction that does give the audience the origin of zombie plague (“Our animal-testing went wrong!” “It’s from a returned space probe!”) as long as the protagonists can’t really do anything with the information. Brad Pitt running around the world looking for a “cure” and then finding it was not a zombie movie.
4025

Hope doesn’t have to be a cure Tin, or in depth knowledge of secret scientific research. Hope can be as much as the fabled military base that’s still repelling the hordes and providing a safe haven, or as little as a remote cabin deep in the mountains last known to have a cache of weapons and food.

4026

Part of the problem with the Walking Dead as a TV series is that there are only so many scenarios that can be played out. Man versus Zombie, Man versus Man and Man versus himself.

The series does have its share of bad writing, but the problem overall is the pacing. They are just dragging everything out. To date we have covered every pretty much every zombie apocalypse scenario and things are repeating themselves. We’ve already had to endure “The Governor” twice now.

I’ve collected the comic since issue one and I still buy it more out of habit than anything else. The same stuff just happens over and over with new villians replacing the old, new faces replacing those that have been devoured and minor variations of the same old themes.

Well done zombie movies are bleak, filled with gore, action, and despair and then they are over. I’ve always wondered if the Walking dead would have been better as a mini series which they could fill with the good stuff and not be tempted to drag everything out.

And wtf is up with Abraham’s red hair? Did he actually scavenge up some out of code date red hair dye and only had enough to dye his hair and not his 'stache?

4027

The same could be said of any series. It’s only limited if the writers aren’t terribly good.

4028

Well I can’t argue that, as I agree completely that Glenn has been given some of the worst writing on the show. For a couple of episodes in Season One he looked like he was going to be my favorite character, then the writers seemed to lose track of where they wanted to go with him and he ended up the second worst writing on the show second only to Lori (and taking over 1st place once she was gone).

I agree with this as well. Those three characters seem more like chariactures thus far. It’s still early though so hopefully the writers will flesh them out a bit more. I do think that for Glenn’s character to grow, new people had to be brought in. Characters who were already present in the story were not going to facilitate the sort of growth Glenn needs as a character. I’m not sure I would have picked this particular band of misfits for him to take over, but honestly at this point any growth is good growth for Glenn. I like the character, I like the actor, and I want to see more and better things done with both. Here’s hoping…

4029

Eugene’s character makes sense if you think of him as having Asbergers. Otherwise, I can’t see any excuse for someone in year 2 or 3 of the ZA not knowing how to use a gun. Unless they’re using the “oh, his archetype doesn’t have the necessary automatic weapons skill. He spent on his attribute points on intellect” method.

I found this episode a little less compelling that the first 2 episodes of the season. I’m sure the people in Rick’s house will come into play later (the leader of the group being a well-known character actor and all). But for this episode, they seemed rather pointless other than to get the dynamic trio moving again instead of playing house.

Having not read the comics, I have no notions on how character A,B,C should behave. For me, Abraham seems perfectly fine as a character. Maybe a little naive seeming, but otherwise just fine. The new woman though, I don’t understand her as a character and pretty well assume she is the way she is because that’s how the comics dictated. Short-shorts, crop top, dual pistols? Reads more like a latin Laura Croft than a Walking Dead ZA survivor.

4030

That was my first reaction too – unless he’s actually been in some underground government bunker for the last two years, spraying automatic weapons fire everywhere is something he would have learned NOT to do a long time ago.

His character seemed OK, but I think it was more the actor than the character as written. If you look at the written lines they’re pretty bad, and again it doesn’t seem like we’re listening to someone who has survived two years in a post-apocalyptic world.

Eh, there’s time for her. She didn’t hardly speak at all, so I will hold out hope. Her outfit WAS horrific though - tastefully layered crop-top and sleeveless vest; fingerless gloves; hot pants; crossed leather holsters and belts that you’d have to go to an old Western movie set to find… ugh, it was too slavishly true to the comic - a media where you need distinctive outfits or traits to tell the characters apart.

I have to say that the dialog in the “walking” scene was some of the worst they’ve had on the show in quite a while. All of Tara’s lines there were horrific, but especially the exchange with Abraham where she dictates the three new characters’ motivations to the camera (paraphrase): “So Eugene has to get to Washington to save the world; Rosita has to go because she is in love with Abraham; and Abraham says he’s going because of ‘duty’, but really there is some backstory-related reason what will be revealed in a future episode. Stay tuned.”

I did like the tension-filled scenes of Rick trying to avoid the bandits for the most part. The sequence where he’s under the bed mostly worked… though for being the only adult-sized bed in the house it was an awfully small bed for a mcmansion.

I was confused by the fight in the bedroom. These are guys that have been together fighting their way through the ZA, and they’re super-tough. I get that. I guess I can also accept that even though they have been scavenging for years (or maybe just weeks) together, there are alpha-dog issues that have to be worked out… though fighting over which of them gets to take a nap in prime scavenging hours seems odd.

What I don’t really get is what happened to the loser of the fight (the black guy). Did the Big Bad Bandit kill him by choking the life out of him? If so, leaving a fresh corpse at the foot of your bed just prior to taking a nap seems like the height of idiocy. But since he didn’t get up and start biting, I guess we’re supposed to assume that he was simply choked into unconsciousness? That doesn’t seem to be much better: you’re going to throttle a guy half to death and then take a nap on the assumption that he won’t wake before you do and kill you in your sleep?

I did like Rick’s strategic thinking with the bathroom door though.

The Carl and Michonne scenes were generally pretty good. I too liked the wrapped painting and surreal baby-room scene – the unexplained but compelling mini-stories represented by the corpses (dead and undead) are always cool.

4031

The Sargeant Slaughter scenes pushed Walking Dead right into Lost territory for me. Really, someone says this guy knows exactly why the ZA happened and you don’t bother to push a bit to find out what’s up? “Classified?” Really? There’s no such thing as classified in a post-ZA world. I just hate that they have to set up this big mystery that will probably end up being bullshit.

Best thing that they could do now is set an end date for the series. Make it three more seasons, fine, but give the writers something to work towards.

4032

In the scene, Rick had the same look in his eyes. “Oh crap, I hope he isn’t dead or I’m screwed when he turns”. But then the guy starts snoring. I guess the implication is that the guy who won the fight used a sleeper hold on the guy. Not sure how long the results of a sleeper hold last, but apparently long enough for Rick to kill a guy and escape from the house.

In general though, the scene of the guys fighting was too heavy handed to me. It screamed “look, these are the bad guys”! There are much better ways to show ruthless men that you don’t want to parlay with; if there is some infighting, that doesn’t necessarily mean you should kill the first guy on a toilet that sees you.

4033

Mad Maxine as seen through a nerdy comic book artist. Michonne of the comics is too much the Super-Hero - they toned her down enough in the TV series, I would have hoped that they wouldn’t have gone for the geek-boy outfit, but okay, eye-candy. Either that of Fu Manchu Guy just isn’t quite getting the message and she has to amp it up for him (Wait, make love and not war…hmmmm…no, Mullet Man was right, I ain’t too bright).

I have to say that the dialog in the “walking” scene was some of the worst they’ve had on the show in quite a while. All of Tara’s lines there were horrific, but especially the exchange with Abraham where she dictates the three new characters’ motivations to the camera (paraphrase): “So Eugene has to get to Washington to save the world; Rosita has to go because she is in love with Abraham; and Abraham says he’s going because of ‘duty’, but really there is some backstory-related reason what will be revealed in a future episode. Stay tuned.”

This the part that bugged me the most. This was a woman who couldn’t figure out that the Governor was at heart a ruthless bastard, and yet zings three people who haven’t given her much except a surface veneer (and no veneer at all for Geek-Chic Girl beyond the outfit). And even then, why she was telling Fu Manchu Guy not to lie to her instead of Mullet-Man means she missed the mark. Maybe that was the point, but if so, it was still badly done.

I did like the tension-filled scenes of Rick trying to avoid the bandits for the most part. The sequence where he’s under the bed mostly worked… though for being the only adult-sized bed in the house it was an awfully small bed for a mcmansion.

I was confused by the fight in the bedroom. These are guys that have been together fighting their way through the ZA, and they’re super-tough. I get that. I guess I can also accept that even though they have been scavenging for years (or maybe just weeks) together, there are alpha-dog issues that have to be worked out… though fighting over which of them gets to take a nap in prime scavenging hours seems odd.

What I don’t really get is what happened to the loser of the fight (the black guy). Did the Big Bad Bandit kill him by choking the life out of him? If so, leaving a fresh corpse at the foot of your bed just prior to taking a nap seems like the height of idiocy. But since he didn’t get up and start biting, I guess we’re supposed to assume that he was simply choked into unconsciousness? That doesn’t seem to be much better: you’re going to throttle a guy half to death and then take a nap on the assumption that he won’t wake before you do and kill you in your sleep?

The assumption on Talking Dead was a “sleeper hold” since they claimed he was still breathing (“Get out of my sleeper hold and you can have the bed…arharhar! thud Guess you be sleeping on the floor!” - sometimes expository devices are needed). They had a bad sense of when to and when not to add some explanation in this episode.

I did like Rick’s strategic thinking with the bathroom door though.

Though I was wondering if it was gilding the lily with the other guy dead/not dead already.

4034

This x10000000%. I also like the actor, and he might have been able to pull off the character back in his Band of Brothers days, but he is TERRIBLY miscast as Abraham. He looks like a fat schlub, instead of the badass Abraham should be. It’s really damaging the show for me – it’s as if they cast Seth Rogen. Just awful - he does not work.

4035

It’s because he’s a fatass schlub now who is nothing like the character in the book. I like the actor, but Seth Rogen cannot play Gerard Butler.

4036

And they mention that as long as the infected victim’s body is too badly damaged, then even the turned can be cured. ;)

4037

All in all, he’s a pretty good physical choice. Yeah, maybe they needed some time for him to bulk up some, but let’s face it, comic book physiques in this gritty show would be more prone to ruin things rather than enhance them. Better to get a veteran actor rather than some world-wrestlemania clown.

At the same time - nope, didn’t think all that much of him in Band of Brothers. The other actors around him seemed a lot better. But then, the writing for the character was pretty one-dimensional in this intro episode, so I’m not sure anyone could have made much of it.

4038

He’s whatever shape they wanted him to be, and whatever appearence they wanted him to be.

It’s not rocket science that the producers choose the look, yet here you are.

4039

Extremely unlikely. They probably remembered him from Band of Brothers and figured that he could definitely pull it off, and is a decent actor to boot. Unfortunately, 13 years haven’t been kind to him. He not only is too fat and out of shape for the role, he just looks incredibly soft and wimpy. A Seth Rogen-like schlub, instead of badass warrior - he looks utterly ridiculous, like a guy who works at a donut store.

It’s not a matter of casting some muscle head, as Corsair suggests (which is particularly ironic, since the actor does look like a Sgt. Slaughter-type wrestling clown caricature of a solidier, as someone else posted above), it’s a matter of not casting someone who is the exact opposite of the character. It’s like casting Jack Black as James Bond. There are dozens of actors on TV, usually relegated to roles as villains on Sons of Anarchy or Justified who would fit the part better.

I can understand why people who haven’t read and/or don’t care about the comic might be fine with an actor they recognize and appreciate from other roles, but it’s incredibly, laugh out loud, Affleck-as-Batman bad casting. Which is a shame since the show did such a good job casting Michonne and Tyreese, essentially choosing real-life doppelgangers for their characters. They screwed up Abraham so badly that it’s hard to understand why they bothered including the character.

4040

I have no idea who the character is supposed to be except for what I know from the dialogue/narration in the show, but I’m with Desslock on this. If he’s supposed to legitimately be a bad-ass military dude, it’s not reading. I actually thought that was the joke! That he’s not at all a badass military dude, but a schlub pretending to be a bad-ass military dude. Like a former National Guard weekender who’s been living on a diet of beer. Hence my comment about him being a Walter Sobchak cosplayer.

Anyway, we’ll see what sort of writing he’s subjected to. I hope there’s more zombie fighting and less talking.

-Tom