6439

Can you blame environmentalists (who have never enjoyed much political power in the states affected by the fires) for environmental catastrophe in another thread please? You are adding to the distress and sadness of at least one Australian who frequents this thread, thank you.

6440

I am not throwing all the blame on environmentalists nor am I only blaming the 24 arsonists or the drier vegetation. What I should have said is that environmentalists who pushed to “increase the national extent and connectivity of native vegetation,” as Australia’s Native Vegetation Framework did in 2015 in opposition to deforestation, should rethink their position. And so should the Australian Greens, who made it their platform to end deforestation in the country. Proper forest management and stopping arsonists would go a long way.

6441

Oh so you’re of the “can’t have fires if there ain’t no forest” type of human.

6442

“Where I explain that I explain that everyone/thing is to blame while making certain only to mention the things I want to blame and not the thing that is ultimately responsible. Also, barren wastelands can’t burn! Why didn’t those dumb lefties think of that!”

You should ask for a salary from Rupert Murdoch.

6443

You can attack me all you want. There is no doubt among serious people that forest management plays a role in preventing wildfires.

Other things that could help prevent fires include stopping arson, which is an epidemic in Australia. Additionally, and by far the most logistically difficult approach, you could find a way to reduce global carbon emissions, remove existing carbon, etc. There is no reason not to consider all of these approaches and more.

6444

You’re confused. Attempts to conserve habitat and threatened species are neither the cause nor the enemy. Record-breaking dry and hot conditions are why these fires are so bad, the cause of ignition is almost beside the point (and no, they are not all caused by arsonists). Arsonists are always going to exploit such conditions, because they’re murderous fucking cowards.

I particularly like the “there’s no doubt among serious people” bit. Except there is. Forest management does not prevent wildfires. Good management will mitigate the impact of fires, but it’s hard to see how it can stop something on this scale. These are fires that are going back through areas that were burned two weeks prior and re-igniting them.

6445

Surprise! /s

“I do get a strong sense, based on the evidence so far and based on the analysis I’ve done, is that it does have all the hallmarks of broader conspiratorial-style thinking [and] far-right populist, extremist discussions online.”

6446

Wait. Something environmentalists did in 2015 — just four years ago — is the reason for these fires? I can’t wait to hear what they did, and how it resulted in this catastrophe.

6447

Oh I’m sorry. Did you feel attacked for someone noticing you regurgitating standard tribal right-wing talking points? I’d call you a snowflake, but they no longer exist because the heat melted them all.

Bullshit arguments, concern trolling, blaming others, and carefully avoiding to mention the real issues. It’s always the same.

6448

Has anyone tried thoughts and prayers? I’m sure they’ll be as effective as in other situations.

6449

As someone who lives in another country ravaged by fires every year, that’s every country, mate, but they manage to burn more and more land each year. I wonder why?

Oddly enough, yes.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-australia-bushfires-queen-idUSKBN1Z30LP

“Prince Philip and I send our thoughts and prayers to all Australians at this difficult time.” - Elizabeth II

6450

Those crazy scientists with their crazy predictions. Who can tell who is right, really? Best to err on the safe side and do nothing at all. /s

6451

The idea that “this is really an arson problem” is silly, because guess what? There have always been arsonists. They didn’t burn up a whole continent.

Australia is having major fire problems because it’s super hot, and super dry. It’s not rocket science. It’s stupid to ignore the biggest component of the problem.

6452

I think another factor is that when conditions are so bad, and any fire is likely to be highly damaging, law enforcement will be more diligent and less forgiving. The same person who would have got off with a warning a decade ago might now have the book thrown at them.

6453

Someone should tell those Australians about the need to rake their forests.

6455

Pot, meet kettle. Kettle, pot.

6456

It’s actually not the same at all, as I’m speculating on a series of causes (“probably”), but I won’t deny that I am also subject to confirmation bias. Fortunately it does not make me personally attack people.

6457

I think that what we are really learning from this incident is that unprecedented continent-wide heat waves cause arson. Top climate psychologists are doubtless investigating the true nature of this causal link right now. If the same psycho-social factors can be shown to be working in the U.S.A., PG & E might be off the hook!

6458

The bushfires started in September, and by early November some 300 homes had been damaged or destroyed, the area burnt in New South Wales alone reaching 1 million hectares. Shane Fitzsimmons, the commissioner of the NSW Rural Fire Service, was warning it could be months before eastern Australia had the bushfires under control. Firefighters were already under stress. “There is no doubt they have flogged themselves silly,” Fitzsimmons said. “They are extremely drained but they are passionate and steadfast in their resolve to do the very best they can for their community.”

NSW was in a state of emergency and the fires in Queensland were also unprecedented. Australian Defence Force liaison officers were working with Emergency Management Australia, as Australia’s largest-ever peacetime deployment of the military was expected. A group of 22 former emergency services leaders led by former commissioner of NSW Fire and Rescue Greg Mullins, the Emergency Leaders for Climate Change, tried to meet with the prime minister (for the second time) to express their alarm at the scale of the threat, but were rebuffed. There was no movement at all from the Morrison government.

6459

What is it with English speaking countries and electing less than ideal leaders lately?