No, they have a duty to provide healthcare money and workers to ease the situation. These are their citizens after all.
Which I’m not surprised they don’t do, since the Israeli government just don’t care about the plight of the Arab people.
| In 2003, the infant mortality rate among Arab citizens overall was 8.4 per thousand, more than twice as high as the rate 3.6 per thousand among the Jewish population.[282] In the 2002 budget, Israel’s health ministry allocated Arab communities less than 1% of its 277 m-shekel (£35m) budget (1.6 m shekels {£200,000}) to develop healthcare facilities.[238]In 2003, the infant mortality rate among Arab citizens overall was 8.4 per thousand, more than twice as high as the rate 3.6 per thousand among the Jewish population.[282] In the 2002 budget, Israel’s health ministry allocated Arab communities less than 1% of its 277 m-shekel (£35m) budget (1.6 m shekels {£200,000}) to develop healthcare facilities.[238]
Aceris
4442
“Allocated arab communities to develop healthcare facilities” is oddly specific, and Chris McGrael is hardly an unbiased observer.
Also, if there was really the vast difference in health investment you imply there would be evidence of it in outcomes more broadly, and the research I’ve seen doesn’t support that.
How would investment in healthcare facilities fix infant mortality caused by congenital defects?
Why wouldn’t it resolve the issue, or at least help mitigate it?
And who is saying that is the sole culprit of the issue? You are assuming it is because… they are Arabs?
Honestly, you fixation on congenital defects seems suspect.
Aceris
4444
Scientists.
I am assuming it because… there are studies showing it. (Although it may not be the sole culprit, but it;s certainly the most significant contribution)
Aceris
4446
Honestly, if you look at the Infant Mortality rates among African Americans in the US, you can draw a pretty strong parallel to that Arabs in Israel. And that is not a good parallel to draw because its pretty obvious that with African Americans, the cause stems from systemic racism.
… In southern Israel, the Bedouin-Arab population numbers around 200,000 inhabitants, most of who are of low socio-economic level owing to their high rate of unemployment and generally low education level (The Central Bureau of Statistics in Israel). Consanguineous marriages, i.e., marriages within a family between first, second or third cousins, are estimated at 45% (Jaber et al., 1994;Jaber and Halpern, 2006). Half of the Bedouin population resides in traditional tribal settlements, where they live in temporary shacks or tents that do not afford sufficient protection from ambient air pollution. …
I mean, maybe this is a contributing factor instead?
Aceris
4449
OR there is this:
It;s pretty fucking clear from your posts above that you have no itnerest in good faith discussion. That is all you get.
I would be, if there was a good faith argument to be had.
In this case, there is clearly no good argument why the Government does not provide extra resources when their is a genuine health crisis, except, that the crisis is to only impact the Arab Citizens of the country, and as I’ve stated, the Israeli Government doesn’t give a flying shit about its Arab Citizens.
Its a horrible situation.
magnet
4451
I don’t really care about the details of where the money goes, what’s important is who sees the biggest benefit.
And according to this article, infant mortality among Israeli Muslims has been reduced twice as much as infant mortality among Israeli Jews.
I don’t understand your point @magnet. Is it that, because infant mortality has fallen sharply for Israeli Muslims, that it’s okay that it’s still some of the highest in the world today?
According to the link, Israeli Muslims are still seeing nearly a 300% chance of Infant Mortality compared to Israeli Jews in 2000. Or am I reading that wrong?
This seemed like an interesting study, plus an interesting conclusion -
Conclusion: As in the Jewish population, the IMR in the Arab community has decreased over the years, although it is still much higher than that in the Jewish community. Much remains to be done to reduce the incidence of congenital malformations among Arabs, since this is the main cause of the high IMR in this population.
Which I think is in line with the complaint that the Israeli Government isn’t doing enough to help in this situation.
magnet
4453
My point is that if Israelis are currently directing their resources to the benefit of any group, then they are directing them at Muslims.
Also, pointing out that certain minorities are harder hit by a disease does not necessarily mean that the government is responsible. For example, blacks suffer most from sickle cell and Jews suffer most from Tay-Sachs. The reasons for this are outside government’s control, and this inequality is likely to persist no matter how much money is spent.
Finally, “much remains to be done” is the typical conclusion of most medical research papers. Much remains to be done about breast cancer, ALS, heart disease, headache, erectile dysfunction, male pattern baldness, etc. As long as the problem still exists, there is still work to do. But “much remains to be done” does not imply “we are not doing everything we can”. (It is actually meant to imply “you should continue funding our research!”)
I disagree. I can only go off of what smarter people than I have said, but if Wiki is to be believed, then the Israeli Government is barely doing anything to help. That that Arab Citizens are doing okay is probably a byproduct of general improvements.
Second, the US Government and other groups do extra research and work with Sickle Cell. It wasn’t the cause of it, but the argument that a Government should ignore something just because it isn’t the cause is a bit rich, don’t you think? The Inequality still existing doesn’t mean you throw up your hands and say “Yeah, sucks to be you”. We spend extra money on care for Black Lungs, which only impacts a small group of people as well. Or Kidney Failure. Or a whole host of things. We don’t just say “oh, them’s the breaks”.
And again, I think it’s important to point out the inequality that you think is not a big deal is the fact that Arabic Citizens are nearly 3 times as high of Infant Mortality Rate.
In the US, African American Women are 2.2 times more the Infant mortality rate of non-Hispanic White Americans, and I think that is a big deal, so nearly 3 times is also, in my mind, a big deal.
So, what should the country do about it? Well, the Wiki Suggests more facilities to help, which seems a perfectly reasonable response. More Genetic Counseling would probably help as well. I assume that might require spending more than 1% on Arab Communities in the Healthcare budget.
So, what should Israel have done instead? How about putting more funding in the hands of Arab Communities? Putting more resources for their education. How about making a test that isn’t cultural bias towards Israeli Jews. How about a more fair and equitable system.
And if that seems like too much, then we’ll have to agree to disagree and move on.
magnet
4455
Bear in mind that since infant mortality among Muslims was much higher than among Jews in 1950, it cannot be blamed on the state of Israel (which was founded in 1948). Israel inherited this problem, and since then infant mortality has improved twice as fast for Muslims as for Jews. In fact, Muslims in Israel have seen bigger improvements over that time frame than Blacks in the US.
My argument was not that government should “throw up their hands”. My argument was that even if everything possible is done to help a group, inequalities can persist. You pointed out that we spend extra money on care for Blacks, yet they still suffer more from sickle cell. For the same reason, pointing out that Muslims still have higher infant mortality does not mean that is “not a big deal” to the government.
I don’t think government should take advice from Wikipedia.
Given their success in improving infant mortality, any further suggestions for Israel should be based on evidence, not just something that you assume “would probably help.” For example, “more genetic counseling” was tried years ago, and it did not seem to help:
It’s nearly 3 times higher dude. That’s like saying internet is okay in rural areas because it was worse before.
It’s like saying that Covid-19 isn’t an issue anymore because more people where dying before. It’s like arguing that people that aren’t poor can’t be that bad off because these days, poor people have Refrigerators, and poor people in the 50s didn’t.
It has 0 impact on what is happening currently. It’s a red herring. A distraction.
magnet
4457
I’m not saying it’s ok.
But you’re saying that you could have done a better job in reducing infant mortality than Israel, and I don’t believe you.
They definitely won’t bother do better, so you will never be proven wrong. Congrats on probably being right because the Israeli government is terrible.
magnet
4459
They’ve improved infant mortality every decade until now.
If Muslim infant mortality ever starts going up, then I’ll be proven wrong.
Their politicians are indeed terrible, but their health care professionals are as good as any others.
Except when it comes to serving the Arab community. Or are you suggest that more then 1% of that budget is spent on Arab Community, which makes up 20% of the population?
As for improving… No one cares. That isn’t the benchmark. It never has been. It’s a tired argument made by Republicans like Tucker Carlson.
