[WoW] PvE guild progression

Me, along with a group of friends from WoW, formed a raiding guild recently. We managed to recruit a total of about 50-55 folks. We pretty much stopped recruiting because we didn’t want a sprawling unfriendly guild. I’m the guild’s main offtank, occasionally maintank, and my only piece of gear from MC is the Medallion of Steadfast Might.

Anyway, I’m really surprised at our progression rate in Molten Core. Most of the guild hadn’t been to Molten Core before. Those who had were naturally the raid leaders. Anyway the first day we went in ever, we had no problems at all with the trash mobs, very easily took down Molten giant pairs, Core hounds (packs and individuals), lava surgers, firelords, etc.

We got to Lucifron. And we killed him on the first try.

Next day we had Magmadar. He was a bitch to kill because the first two times CTRaid Assist completely messed up the AoE fear warnings and we didn’t have a dwarf priest, and despite the MT getting feared a few times, and possessing only 1 tranquilizing shot, we got him down to 25%. We got him on the 4th try without the benefit of CTRaid, and with 2 tranquilizing shots.

Going on to Gehennas, we took him down on the first try. Garr was down on the first try (we made sure not to go for him until we had enough warlocks to banish half the adds). Baron Geddon was downed on the 3rd try after people learned to run away and not go Al Qaeda on the raid :p . Shazzrah was downed on the same day, on the first try. All of these kills took place over 1.5 weeks.

I was just really curious if things went as smoothly for you guys, whether this kind of progression in Molten Core is common for newly formed raid guilds. Having only Sulfuron, Golemagg, Majordomo and Ragnaros left after a week and a half of raiding (and we take weekends off) is probably a job well done, but I wanted to know if it was really an accomplishment. Consult your experience BEFORE you mastered the instance :D .

Yeah, but you didn’t have fun doing it, did you? You may have thought you did - but only because you’re stupid!

Okay, that’s the last Graeme Dice reference I will ever make.

It’s a good sign, that’s for sure. Our progress was similar (possibly even quicker, but we had more experienced players), and a couple of months later we’re smacking Nefarion on the nose. Soon we’ll even hurt him! :)

MC is an easy raid dungeon, strats are readily available, and you are playing the less challenging faction. Not surprising that you are progressing quickly, IMO.

Our first time in MC, we didn’t get past the two Molten Giants at the entrance.
The gear and enchants available are way better now then when we started (May/June of last year). Even still, we noticed a huge different in clearing speed when Blizzard added the 8 extra debuff slots

Head over to Zul’Gurub. You’ll either get a nice challenge, or you can laugh at me and my small raid guild’s attempts to progress through the place.

Before we had enough people for MC we were doing Zul’Gurub. In a week’s time we did Venoxis (the snake boss), the bat boss, Mandokir, and Mar’li.

We just shifted focus when we got more people. Our priority is clearing MC, so the only time we ever go to ZG anymore is if we can piece a large enough group to go there on a weekend. So we haven’t progressed beyond Mar’li. None of the members usually want to spend dkp in ZG if they can wait a day and get the next piece of their class set in MC.

Bah. :>

The group I raid with has taken down Venoxis and batgirl, but we can’t get either consistently. I’m not certain if the problem is group composition, gearing, or skill. Probably the latter.

To be fair we found the bat boss and Mandokir more difficult to pin down than Lucifron, Gehennas or Garr. The Mandokir fight is a bitch to main tank or to offtank, and a tough job on the healers. Apparently they changed the fight so that Mandokir hits a lot harder when the raptor dies (not sure if this was the case before the patch, had never fought him back then). The raptor hits very hard and proper healer rotation is needed for both the MT and the OT. Without going into details, I just found the Mandokir fight quite hard. Mar’li took a a few tries to pin down the tactics. The bat boss fight becomes a lot easier with fire protection potions btw.

Oh and mana drain through the hunters REALLY helps with Venoxis to avoid him casting his AoE attack. Naturally getting out of the poison globs and some nature protection potions goes a long way. Melee need to be really careful with him.

My guild started raiding MC about 3 months ago. Our agenda is basically Ony/MC Wed, the rest of MC on Thursday, ZG on Saturday. We have every single MC boss on farm status except for Ragnaros due to a shortfall of FR gear. This was addressed as of this week so we are looking at taking down Ragnaros next week.

As for ZG we have taken down all bosses including Hakkar. We have not been able to take down Jin’do the Hexxer after numerous attempts and many different strats tried. (A very annoying boss fight). One thing we have learnt is that the raid makeup for ZG is crucial for success. There is not much room to change types of classes within a ZG raid.

If you have good raid leaders and everyone knows their job then MC is an easy instance. IMO it has the best ROI of any instance in WoW. We will probably start on BWL within the next 1-2 months.

Also have your casters in the raptor pen - that way they won’t get charged by Mandokir.

He’s a tough fight, but a lot of fun. And drops some nice loot to boot.

To give some reference we have zg down to farm status now, but it can still take 4-5 hours for a complete clear. We started in November, had it to farm status till they changed the instance, and is back now.

The mc raids I can’t comment on, when I’ve been it’s with an established group and we clear it it and onyxia in 4 hours.

You don’t really need fire protection for the bat boss, just have the mt move her when the flame hits.

The suggestion to have the casters sit in the raptor area, to the left as you face the where he comes from, is a good one. If you do you have to have your mt stand at the steps when he comes down or he tends to run into the casters instead of the dps. It doesn’t hurt to have a third tank stand up there with the casters just in case.

Tiger boss was the one we had problems with, till the change.

Hakkar is a bit more difficult now. Have to have three tanks, and a mage purely on sheeping duty for them when the get mc. Third tank is for the sons.

We have not been able to take down Jin’do the Hexxer after numerous attempts and many different strats tried. (A very annoying boss fight).

Jin’do is, IMO, a harder fight than anything in MC including Ragnaros and even harder than a few bosses in BWL.

As mentioned, class balance is very important. You’ll want at least two warriors (preferably three) all fighting for aggro constantly and three rogues. You’ll also want one mage who has Improved Arcane Explosion. Everyone needs to realize that Jin’do himself is the last priority when dealing damage in this fight. Top priority is his totems (healing first, mind control second) with second priority being the shades (when you’re cursed). Only attack Jin’do when there’s nothing else left.

A few other things that help is to have at least one warrior with Mortal Strike and all the rogues should use wound poison. There’s nothing more demoralizing than having him below 10% health only to not deal with a healing totem fast enough and have him go up above 20%.

Another option would be to have a druid keep the son sleeped until you need to kill it for the poison. Just another option depending on group makeup, but we tend to have 2-3 druids and 3-4 priests in all our ZG runs, so keeping a druid pre-occupied with sleeping the son and sole healing the hunter gathering the sons, works well for us.

As for raid progress, that seems to be a bit ahead of typical guilds, but it doesn’t surprise me. Someone mentioned the increase in debuff slots, and I think he’s dead on. That makes a huge difference. Also, people seem to be running the 5 man stuff earlier and earlier, and thus getting MC ready more quickly. “Back in my day”, you couldn’t get into a strat 10 man if you were under 60, dwarf priest or not.

the funny thing about MC is it only takes one person who knows the strats, can explain them well, and a raid who listens. it’s kinda of hard to compare starting MC from scratch today as opposed to April 2005 when my guild started dabbling in there, usually tag-teaming with another guild to get enough players.

once we had a good regular crew, it took about 4 weeks to get to Domo, another 2 weeks or so to kill Ragnaros.

Yeah, I’d say being able to sucessfully clear MC amounts to maybe 15% player skill, 35% knowing the strats, and 50% organization and leadership. If you’ve got one competent raid leader who can adeptly herd 39 loot-hungry cats, MC isn’t particularly challenging anymore.