That’s not entirely how it works. Some alien groups are set to patrol. Generally this is only on the ship maps, but they’re not just waiting for you to step on a particular square. They’re somewhat abstracted until they see your guys, though.
Even with the groups that are fixed in place, they’re sort-of there. It’s possible to spot them without activating them. In which case you’ll see, for example, a group of 3 Thin Men in a tight clump fiddling with something on the ground. You can kill them before they activate and run for cover if you use a rocket or a Sniper.
Yeah, I found the Schrödinger aliens to be one of the most infuriating design decisions in a game full of them. No way they’re changing that for the expansion, given it’s such a core part of the tactical combat. I would be extremely surprised (and pleased) if they did.
As for the teleporting bug, has it really been fixed? The wording on the Kotaku article ("…will be patched out") makes me wonder.
flyinj
4625
I often did wonder-
Why did they go with the area spawn mechanism? Was it easier to implement? It’s just so blatant when you’re playing the game.
It basically comes down to-
Walk one guy forward, wait until he triggers a spawn, then run back to cover and wait for the spawn to advance on you.
The (http://xcom.wikia.com/wiki/Patch_%26_Update_(XCOM:_Enemy_Unknown))MrCoffee posted above claims that the teleport bug was fixed in a January 2013 patch, but that’s definitely not correct since I’ve seen it a few times in my game this year.
I guess they’re admitting that by saying that this new DLC will, in fact, fix it.
The Kotaku article also says that they’re fixing an aiming/LOS bug with elevated positions shooting around cover by removing the cover. That’s a shame because one of my bigger frustrations with the tactical game is how 1) cover is critical and 2) some maps have only a handful of spots with good cover where you can advance, really limiting your ‘smart’ movement options. In particular, I think shooting from significantly elevated ground (not flying) should grant an automatic cover bonus (since they could go prone and have the roof/ridge/hill between them and their opponent). I really hate the fact that sneaking my squaddies up onto the roof often feels like a handicap since they’re so exposed (and it’s compounded by the wonky LOS that makes it strangely difficult to judge in advance whether they will have a clear shot).
jpinard
4627
I know. As a designer you should have to look at that and go… this sucks for the player and is a cheap design mechanic. As you said, you’re forced to move in tiny bits over many turns until someone hits that trigger. So it ruins continuity and the flow of the map as there’s a significant shift in how you play.
I think they went this route to control the gameflow and for the cinematic effect. But this simply means they didn’t trust our brains to fill in the narrative nor their own design. It’s too bad, as the game would be so much more fun without area triggers.
Quaro
4628
The way one of the unofficial XCOM mods handled it, was to randomly wake up minion groups after a random number of turns. So you’d be creeping along when BAM, they wake up and charge you wherever you happen to be. Downside was you could kinda play it like a defense mission for much of it, but it did remove the creeping.
Wolff
4629
I’m not quite sure what mechanic you folks are talking about. As I understand it the teleporting is the aliens patrolling but it cuts down computations by having them teleport as opposed to path finding. In my ridiculous number of hours this has screwed me once. I will gladly trade that for shorter turn times.
The area trigger I have never seen happen. Some alien packs are fixed some patrol and some teleport patrol. Outside the thin men dropping council missions and slingshot drop ins I have never seen this happen. This includes some rather robust testing on classic with 3 probe snipers.
Most likely I think you are confusing teleporting patrols with area triggers.
On another note as long as you aren’t in combat you don’t have to take tiny moves. Lead with a support or assault - as long as they don’t reveal you can safely move the rest of the squad up not in cover. Watch beaglerush II vids on youtube for some good quality of life tips.
I don’t know… Maybe I’m doing it wrong, but what your describing sounds too risky to me.
In my experience, it’s best to:
- Barely move a few middle squaddies first and put them in overwatch (so they can shoot aliens when they’re discovered, before they move into cover)
- Then advance the forward/recon elements
- Then move up the rear/reserve guard (since we never want to reveal new terrain on our last move, lest we trigger a big alien movement that can flank us or catch us in a weak position).
Maybe you move your squaddies up in a tight pack, but I’m always spread out along a front (since that makes it harder for them to flank me, and easier for me to flank them, plus grenades hurt a lot). That makes it rather difficult to know when your squaddies will spot an alien (especially since the LoS is wacky sometimes).
If I did what you’re describing, my 1-2 lead troopers would reveal the aliens, the aliens would move into good cover, and the rest of my squad would be standing around behind them, out of position and forced to move because they’re out of cover (and moving limits the options for snipers and heavies). On many maps, there are only a couple full cover positions available in a tactical area, so the 4 rear-guard members of my squad might not be able to advance to a position where they can both shoot and be safe. Moreover, since the rear-guard is now forced to advance just so they can engage, I risk that they trigger even more aliens, perhaps leaving me flanked and losing a squaddie or two.
I’ll have to look up the beaglerush videos to see if there’s some secret I’m missing…
jpinard
4631
Huh?! I never had a problem with turn times. They were super fast.
I think that’s his point… He’s saying that they needed the weird teleporting patrols (instead of making the aliens actually path/move across the terrain) to speed up the turn times.
I find this baffling though because most maps have only a a few squads of aliens so it’s hard to imagine that they’d require a lot of CPU cycles to move them around. The maps are small, the terrain isn’t that complex, and when they’re teleporting it’s not like they’re carefully moving from cover to cover anyway.
rezaf
4633
And why should they - they’re getting a free move as the first thing so they can do it…
Yeah, the “save CPU cycles” excusion sounds a bit lame in the day and age of multicore GHz CPUs. This entire mechanic is uber-lame and lazy, that cannot even be denied by the staunchest XCOM apologists.
However, MrPenguin totally nailed how I (and I think most people) played the game - even on non-ironman normal, and I think this is also a reason why free roaming aliens were decided against - a flanking attack with the limited squad sizes, cramped maps and oversteamlined mechanics could easily mean de-facto game-over.
rezaf
Quote from the Kotaku-article:
“Of course there is the community-requested local language feature, in which your Chinese heavy weapons soldier won’t sound like an Iowa farmboy anymore”
Yes, yes yes!!! That alone is enough to make me buy this expansion!
Wolff
4635
Back on squad movement that is pretty much what I do. Only reveal with the first move and snuggle everyone up behind them. If the first move reveals hostiles you can run and gun or hunker down. Snipers don’t need to be in cover with squad site. Basically that gives you 11 moves to wipe a pack - which is more than enough for most engagements. On ci and ii trading shots over turns is a losing proposition.
Finished my IronMan game yesterday (normal difficulty). Two deaths. Although in the final battle I had three guys down (bleeding out). Three for three mind-controls, including my “chosen one” with the Psi armor. Awesome.
In the end, I’m not sure it was worth it. It basically just meant a lot of slow progress with 4+ Overwatch on at all times.
Yeah, I’d rather play on whatever difficulty is above Normal (hard?) on non-Ironman to avoid the frustrations/bugs. In fact, that’s just what I did when I beat the game, and I had a blast doing so. I get the appeal of iron-man, but the game isn’t geared towards multiple plays (too many cut scenes, not enough random “board game” aspects) to warrant wanting to start from scratch over and over when you blow your squad and have no other choice.
Alan_Au
4638
I understand the rationale for giving the aliens a “free” defensive maneuver when first spotted, because otherwise you could encounter a group of new aliens in already-flanked positions. However, the reality is that in order to encounter a new group of aliens, you will already have expended (at least) one of your movement points. It’s doubly risky to dash into unrevealed territory, because as a player you might be dashing into an already-flanked position. This results in the move-overwatch thing, although really it’s a move-once and overwatch-because-why-not system.
meeper
4639
Those last few turns can be brutal.
On my classic-ironman play, I lost my sniper who had been with me since the first mission on the very last turn. However, due to the way ironman works on the last turn of the game, my guy is still sorta alive.
Grifman
4640
Greenman Gaming has the expansion at 10%, with another 20% discount code, if anyone is interested. Price came down to $21.60 from $29.99, not bad, not bad . . .
Still very questionable even at this supposed “sale” price for the stated content.
I think $20 is very reasonable if you’re into the base game. I really don’t like the strategic part, and it doesn’t totally change that, so I’ll probably wait for a deeper sale
