Confrontation, the one that looks like stratego. It’s been out of print forever.
I stopped by y FLGS today to browse, and they have all the Sherlock Holmes: Consulting Detective games back in stock- they’ve been out since the start of the pandemic, near as I could tell. The Baker Street Irregulars set came out last month, and I picked it up, but the other sets still weren’t out then (or at least my shop didn’t have them). I picked up the first set “The Thames Murders” today, but they also had “Jack the Ripper”, and “Queen’s Park”. So if you’ve been looking, you should take a look around your preferred outlet- they might have them again.
Very curious how Knizia’s Lord of the Rings game is received these days. I loved it back in the day and still think it’s a brilliant design. Plus, it’s the true godfather of modern co-op games.
UPDATE: GASP!! The new editions, including this one, don’t have the absolutely iconic, downright intimidating Sauron figure of the original Hasbro version. Aw, what a shame.
I’d like to put some kind of flat surface, about 2.5 by 5 feet, on a bureau, to make a place to put a board game (fairly permanently, so we can play the game via Discord over a period of weeks).
Anyone have any good ideas of what I could buy?
I don’t want to buy a full table, because I have nowhere else to put the bureau.
Ha, how about this GIGA SIZE mouse pad that is literally 30” by 60”, just like I want, placed on a piece of plywood!
If you go into an IKEA to their clearance furniture section they usually have tabletops and desktops really cheap. You may be able to do sightly better than a sheet of plywood. :)
In the absence of furniture, yeah I’d consider something like a masonite board* that you should be able to get from any hardware store. They can come in fairly large sheets that is easy to cut to size, and have the benefit of a smooth surface and is fairly cheap to buy. Biggest issue is that ones I see come in a butt ugly brown…
As for your giant mousemat, I’ve got something similar for my gaming surface which is a 90cm x 90cm gaming mat manufactured by Ultimate Guard. The surface makes handling cards (especially sleeved cards) easier, adds a little bit of friction and handily rolls up when I don’t want to use it. It is this mat - https://ultimateguard.com/en/space-edition/play-mat-90-artwork-mystic-space-edition and it does a decent enough job. It doesn’t have the nice stiched edging that quality mousemats have though, definite downside. But I’ve owned it for years now and it hasn’t shown any signs of stitching tearing away.
*I don’t live in the US, but I think it goes by that name over there too if Amazon were anything to go by.
I discovered the genre of dungeon crawlers. Are there any must haves? What are the opinions on:
Machina Arcana (Lovecraft)
Sword & Sorcery
Secrets of The Lost Tomb
Galaxy Defenders
Shadows of Brimstone
Tainted Grail
Imperial Assault
Tainted Grail a storytelling resource management game which is not much about dungeon crawling, as far as I know. It has its proponents, but others find it frustrating too. Considering the price, I’m wary of that one.
Machina Arcana seems like a dungeon crawler type thing with all the usual KS bling. I haven’t played it. But I’m also wary of bling as a selling point these days. I prefer to bling out games I already really like.
Imperial Assault seems to reimplement Descent 2nd edition, one of the dungeon crawler I enjoyed 10 years back but haven’t really gone back to. I don’t know how well it does and what it brings to the table, but it might be a fun intro to the genre. Descent was focused on tactical combat. I liked it, but want s bit more in the experience these days.
If you asked me for a list of games that match that type of cross section of genres none of those would come first to mind. But I haven’t played the majority of those. So might just be lack of familiarity. And the kind of combat or exploration they offer might be right up your alley.
My list would include:
Jaws of the lion
Gloomhaven (only if you enjoyed Jaws of the Lion)
Mansions of Madness 2nd Edition (dungeon crawling in a mansion with puzzle solving)
Journeys in Middle Earth (not in Dungeons as much, but it has tactical battles)
I like the setting and the story those games tell a lot. Unfortunately, I can’t help you as much with those other titles.
I use a cut up yoga mat. It’s cheaper than any bespoke playmat and serves the same purpose.
I’d add Mice & Mystics to that list
The seams are no big deal?
The one I have is a roll up mat. No seams. Like this one:
https://www.amazon.com/BalanceFrom-Purpose-Non-Slip-Exercise-Carrying/dp/B01IZDFWRE/
It takes a little bit of getting used to. It’s got a non slip surface, so cards won’t slide on it. Keeps them in place really well, but you have to pick them up to move them.
I’ve never heard of Secrets of the Lost Tomb, which is not a great sign, IMO. Galaxy Defenders is a boardgame more in the vein of XCOM style tactical combat, and I wouldn’t call it a dungeon crawler (though I like it). Machina Arcana looked incredibly generic from what I’ve seen of it so I didn’t back their recent KS - there’s an official Tabletop Simulator demo module if you have that, though. Everything I’ve ever played by Flying Frog has been an unholy mess full of designers getting photographed in cosplay instead of game art so I’m still very skeptical of Shadows of Brimstone. It’s also very expensive, has no sane storage solution, requires you to assemble all the minis, and is full of random dice rolls. I think Tom kinda likes it, though? And finally in the list-crossing segment of my opinions, Tainted Grail is not a dungeon crawler. It’s about exploration, narrative, and some light resource management. It’s one of my favorite games in years, probably top three easy. But if you’re looking for a dungeon crawler? Nah, it’s not that.
As for games that are and I can speak authoritatively about (to at least some degree):
Imperial Assault is pretty good with the coop app, if a bit prone to spawning weird shit due to random spawns. (We had a surprising number of encounters with Emperor Palpatine out in backwater planets.) It’s distinctly less fun in its original one-vs-many mode but still probably the best implementation of that FFG’s done. It’s a big old pile of stuff at this point but if you’re playing in app mode only the base game, Return to Hoth and…one other whose name I forget…actually add campaigns. Everything else is just more enemies and gear and so on. It is also the only vaguely sci-fi dungeon crawler I can currently recommend.
Descent 2.0 I haven’t tried with the coop app and I did not like it much as a one-vs-many. I also think the Star Wars setting and certain elements of IA’s design are more compelling than Descent’s highly generic fantasy setting. If this one looks tempting, you might consider waiting for the third edition that’s been teased a couple of times now.
Sword & Sorcery ports a lot of the ideas of Galaxy Defenders into a fantasy dungeon crawl. It’s more narrative than either Descent or IA and is fully coop without needing an app. I think the various character classes and abilities are pretty fun to build and work with, and it’s currently probably my favorite old school, dicey dungeon crawl. Not as excited about their business model. Splitting the campaign up into 3-4 (Arcane Portal is optional I think) boxes is fair enough - there’s a decent amount of stuff in them, it’d be a monster to try and fit into a single release, but selling the majority of the playable characters individually as $15 boxes feels pretty hard to justify. (That said, my understanding is that people pledging to the original KS paid like $120-150 and got all boxes of the campaign and most of the addon characters for that money. It’s much more now.) There’s a second campaign in production after a second KS that I did manage to get in on, also. All characters will be cross-compatible and they’re introducing some interesting new mechanics in it (look up S&S Ancient Chronicles if you want to check them out).
Gloomhaven - for my tastes, the single best dungeon crawler ever made. Smart, tactical combat. Crazy character variety. Scenarios for months or years. But Jaws of the Lion is probably the way to see if you like it at this point, I think - not everyone does.
Mansions of Madness - to me this doesn’t really feel like a dungeon crawler but it is closely related to IA and Descent, just in a Lovecraftian horror mode, and it’s my favorite of the three, FWIW.
Some other games that aren’t technically dungeon crawlers probably but might scratch similar itches:
Champions of Hara - Tom’s written all you need to know about why this is so cool.
Hexplore It - overland exploration more than tactical level dungeon crawling but I really enjoy the sensibility of these games.
Darkest Night - more fantasy guerilla warfare than anything, but the way characters power up and the artifacts they can obtain is similarly satisfying to looting and levelling in a dungeon crawler. (You ideally want the 2nd edition, and it’s loong.)
Eldritch Horror - monster bashing, encounter having, loot acquiring, character special powers. No dungeons, no tactical combat, but all the best bits in a dumb, dumb game I still love.
Here’s how I rank the dungeon crawlers I’ve played 5+ sessions of:
1. Gloomhaven - So many interesting decisions - not just doing the same actions every turn like in most dungeon crawlers. The characters play very differently and unlocking new ones is like getting a new expansion again and again. Best tactical combat I’ve played.
2. Imperial Assault - The Star Wars theme adds a lot for me. Very nice production and I’ve painted the miniatures which really makes the game look awesome on the table. Throwing dice can be a welcome alternative to Gloomhaven’s crunchiness sometimes. Haven’t tested the app, only played with me controlling the Imperial forces.
3. Claustrophobia - Enjoyable exploration element. The dice mechanic for action selection is interesting. I like that the theme is different from generic fantasy.
4. Descent 2.0 - Very generic fantasy theme with forgettable story. Otherwise similar to Imperial Assault. App works pretty well.
5. Zombicide / Massive Darkness - Similar games. Fun to ride the insane power curve from weak player characters in the beginning to insane powerful characters towards the end of every game. Has balance issues and each game is not too different from the next, so I grew tired of them after a while.
6. Galaxy Defenders - I enjoyed the scifi theme. Otherwise forgettable. Only played this solo.
7. Sword and Sorcery - Was fun in the beginning, but grew really tired of it during the campaign I played. The rules are confusing and hard to learn. The story is too cheesy. Slow character progression and dying sets you back a lot.
thanks for the suggestions. I watched a video, and dungeon crawlers were defined a game that has 1) exploration, 2) leveling/looting and 3) combat. Not necessarily happening in dungeons. These are the basic ingredients (based on that youtuber). I think there needs to be something that is a “dungeon” where exploration is happening. Some claustrophbic feeling.
I love Claustrophobia, but unfortunately, not a solo-game.
If Mice and Mystics, then maybe Aftermath could be considered a dungeon crawler?
Sword&Sorcery was recommended, but only with arcane portals (for whatever reasons). I think I need to do much more research. Some of the games are really expensive.
Jaws of the Lion is one of the more affordables.
I own Dark Souls - The Boardgame. But for a dungeon crawler, exploration is really lacking. All tiles are basically an arrangement of nodes.
Regarding exploration, I would think there needs to be branching points where you want to go and explore. And it should be an interessting decission where you want to go.
Maybe Arkham Horror 2nd edition could fit the description. (I own it, need to get it to the table)
I don’t care for most dungeon crawlers, because they’re so formulaic: move little dudes around and punch away monster hit points. Snooze. Yeah, sure, they might add some deck-building or character development on the side, but it’s just so repetitive and drawn-out.
But there are two that I really like: Deep Madness for how its distinct monsters AIs make every game feel different, and Space Cadets: Away Missions for a combat system that builds in a lot of unique behaviors for the characters and monsters. They’re both fantastically themed, too. Deep Madness as claustrophobic sanity-blasting horror and Space Cadets: Away Missions as 50s B-movie sci-fi.
However, both games are entirely scenario based. There’s no long-term progression, and I think a lot of people want a D&D type experience in their dungeon crawlers, with characters that level up over the long term.
-Tom
I love Gloomhaven, especially in digital form …but. It’s clunky when it comes to rules and tracking all the stuff, to put it nicely, and its’ not something you just bring out once awhile. you need a steady group making relatively good decisions together, or at the very least, ones that can laugh off the stupidity with food and drinks.
I love dungeon crawlers. Zombicide has the exploration and finding stuff link at least, can scale to almost any group zize if you have a few expansions (I have them all!) and it’s a play all night and feel rewarded sort of spiel.
I would be interested in the other ones but almost all of them cap at 4 players when my typical group is 5, at least.