Dark and Light

I agreed to try the CSOG Dark and Light, which supposedly begins this month and is free until April. The game is played on one server. I’m going to be starting a character shortly after it begins… I’ll post my character name here if anyone wants to look me up.

Is there a way to sign up for the beta or free trial?

I signed up for the beta a couple weeks ago but haven’t received a response. There’s a link on the homepage to it.

Its not a “free trial”, the game is simply free until April. The plan is for the players to make cities, make buildings, etc. which will then continue after the pay-period starts. Basically the reason its free is because players will be helping with the development of the game.

Some of the features will only be implemented in April (or later), but the game looks fairly normal in terms of features scheduled for the November release.

It looks like more of the same for the most part… other than the BigWorld technology allowing for tens of thousands of players in the same gameworld (the free period should give a good idea as to lag issues) there are only a few interesting things that the website talks about.

Its something new to examine while I wait for games with more potential to come along. Its also implementing some features (such as a worldwide war/political system somewhat similar to Avalon’s) that I’m very interested in.

The game’s November release is occuring through direct download from the website. I’m not sure if they have a plan for the April release.

So they want you to pay for the beta, work for them, but not get what you’ve paid for until april?


Thier terrain looks awful, and the models for the players are fairly ‘meh’. So, from what I gather, they want players to help build thier world?

Yea, that will be a quality game. Quality with a K.

You have got to hand it to the developers.

After many many years of development and not much to show for it, they will release an extremely “dumbed down” version of what was supposed to be the full version of the game later this month, keeping the “real version” under wraps until April .

Except the only problem is that what you will see in November is most likely pretty much the sum total of their development efforts.

By doing this they generate some interest and do an end run around criticism that the game is “vapourware” by implying that what you will see in Nov. is but a small taste of the entire package.

I believe this “test” or “trial” called the “Settlers of Gwen<somethingorother>” will be free for all, and will only require that you have signed up for beta on the website.

At that time you will also be able to preorder the “full version” <supposedly there will only be a limited number> and obtain some kind of perk or advantage in the “Settlers thingy”

I am just hypothesizing here, after reading various comments around the net about the games history and development so I may be completely wrong. It just seems odd that a game plagued by delays, that has been underwhelming at 2 E3’s and rumoured be be vapourware all of a sudden will be ready in April.

Dev’s get an A+ for creative Spin though:

Okay, I give up. Please tell me:

What is a VSOG?
What is a CSOG?
Does anyone but you use these terms?

Chris Woods

In a related note… Does Brian Kootnz have his own Wikipedia page?

Wiki search

Village-Sized Online Game

City-Sized Online Game


The idea of a 1000-3000 player world being “Massive” is ludicrous. If that’s massive what’s a 100,000 player world? Ultra-Deluxe Super Big? Fabulously Large Human Monstrosity?

What’s a 1,000,000 player world? Does the English language even have words to describe that? Ginormous only goes so far. GOG FTW?

I’m not going to use someone else’s mistaken terminology for my own, regardless of how many other people are willing to.

I don’t walk into a village of 2000 people and call it Massive. I call it a village.

Is VSOG the best term for that kind of game? Probably not… but its the best I have at my disposal.

In an industry with insane optimism, where consumers buy games based on potential instead of reality, where everyone’s looking ahead, its important to stay grounded… staying grounded is NOT calling a 1000 player game Massive.

Considering anything from 2-64 player games are called “Multiplayer”, then YES, having several thousands of players can be comparatively called “Massively Multiplayer”. Get it?

Fabulously Large Human Monstrosities are some of the players, not the games themselves. BAM! OH YEAH!

This is why you are Koontz of Borg and we are People of Humanity.

Fine, but the future is not about 2-64 player games (and yes, I know what I said in my last post). The first time I played a MUD I knew this was the type of game to allow societal improvement… this was the future.

These games should be defined in terms of real human populations, because THAT is what they are referring to… its what convergence is about and its what these games will ultimately be all about.

These games have more to do with convergence and social progress than they have to do with 2-64 player games.

Besides, I don’t want to be responsible for people laughing at me 5 years from now for me calling a game Massive that they now call “Small”.

“Haha… you called World of Warcraft Massive… you fucking idiot”

“No I didn’t! I called it a Village-Sized Online Game!”

“Oh… that’s cool then”.

And sure, I understand… some no-vision developer makes games for a few people and then makes a game for 100 people, gets excited and a crazy-big ego or whatever, and deems his game “Massive”. That’s cool… he can call it what he likes. We don’t have to agree. We don’t have to imitate him.

My terminology has room for expansion. Room for growth. Room for the future.

His terminology? Well, it leaves room for Ultra Super Deluxe Mammoth Big and other abominations of English. Gratz. The future will be doing jumping jacks of joy.

Don’t rape the future. Set it up to win.

Instead of using your silly relative terms like Village and City, why don’t you build the number in?

For instance, I live in a city. It’s got 300k people. I used to live in a city that had 25k. My sister lives in a city that has 10million. Really useful designation you have there, Brian.

And, I’m sure you’ve heard this before, but worrying about what people in the future will think about you using common nomenclature that they’ve moved beyond is, well, insane, for lack of a better word.

Not that I don’t think you’re anything but a board character. But I’d love to be proven wrong.

But why must the terminology change now, when such ultra-massively-populated games aren’t even close to existing yet? I’m sure, down the line, there will be games with populations in the hundreds-of-thousands, or even millions of players simultaneously, and when they do hit the scene, then they can co-opt the term “Massively Multiplayer”, because then it will fit the comparative context with prior multiplayer games. Then a new term can be used for the older generation MMOGs, perhaps “Large Multiplayer Online Games”.

My point is that you’re making up terms for something that isn’t close to occurring for some time yet, namely a game or multiple games with simultaneous online populations greatly outpacing the largest of the current crop of MMOGs. I say, wait until it happens, and then shift the terminology to the newer generation of MMOGs, and create new ones for the smaller, likely obsolete, past MMOGs.