Hong Kong/Chinese/Kung Fu flicks

Movies
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Ok, so I did a forum search, and found two earlier topics on this, with a number of interesting suggestions, some of which are now on my to-buy list. However, the newest of those topics is from 2007, so I guess it wouldn’t hurt to make a new topic.

Basically, I’m a huge fan of (some of) these movies, but they’re so under-marketed around here, that I feel I hardly know anything about the genre (I’m using that term rather broadly). A friend of mine introduced me to a few Jackie Chan films in high school, and since then I’ve been picking up promising suggestions whenever they presented themselves. I find it very hard to get any kind of overview of what’s available. IMDB seems to treat the genre rather poorly, with many of the films I’ve looked up lacking any sort of images or plot description. Some of them are very hard to get on DVD, short of ordering them directly from Hong Kong or Taiwan. Still, I try to persevere. Since people around here were very knowleadgable and helpful, when I asked about samurai films last year, I thought maybe you could help me out. I have a feeling there’s a treasure trove of awesome movies, that I know nothing about.

Before I go any further, I should probably explain the topic title, and what exactly I’m looking for. Basically, I’m not sure if people still make a distinction between Hong Kong movies, and Chinese movies in general, but what I’m looking for is mainly Kung Fu films, with people hitting and kicking each other, and maybe the odd bit of swordplay. I like some of the old Chow Yun-Fat films, too, like a better tomorrow, so I wouldn’t mind that sort of suggestions either.

I’m not a huge fan of people flying around on wires, and tons of magic, although it really does depend on the film (I love A Chinese Ghost Story and Once Upon a Time in China, for instance).

I love costume “dramas” a la Project A and Once Upon a Time in China.

I’m not a big fan of some of the big mainstream (in the west, at least) films, like Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon and Hero. Basically, I find them kind of boring, and prefer my Kung Fu with a bit of humour. Humour is not a must, but boring is a showstopper (I realise that’s subjective, so go ahead and recommend anything that you don’t find boring yourself).

Here’s a list of some of the movies that I already own, although it’s probably not complete:

Pretty much everything with Jackie Chan
Once Upon a Time in China 1-3
A Chinese Ghost Story (both)
Ip Man
Iron Monkey
Shaolin Soccer
Kung Fu Hustle
Ong Bak and Warrior King (yeah, I know they’re not Chinese)
A Touch of Zen (I only just discovered this the other day, by luck, which prompted me to start this topic)
Vampire Hunters
14 Blades (haven’t seen that yet)
Detective Dee (haven’t seen that yet, either)

I’m sure there are more, but I can’t recall what they might be.

I’m hoping for some good suggestions, so don’t hold back. Remember, I just found out about A Touch of Zen, so it’s ok if the suggested movies are old, although I should probably mention that I’m not a big fan of Bruce Lee.

Thanks.

edit: I should probably mention that I just ordered Fist of Legend, Last Hero in China and Swordsman 2, based on advise in those two other threads. I was considering ordering Swordsman as well, but it seems to be OOP. :(

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Ip Man

This movie is awesome.
Assuming you liked it, I highly recommend Ip Man 2. It’s about Ip Man after he’s gone to Hong Kong.

Like the first, it’s loosely based upon the actual life of Ip Man. It’s got the same guy playing Ip Man too, and he’s really awesome in that role… Those two movies spawned off about a million Ip Man movies, but he decided that he’d never play that role again, out of fear of being type cast as him.

Now, I know you said you were mainly interested in chinese and hong kong movies, but I feel the need to mention the Ong Bak series. They’re actually Thai, I believe. Quite a bit different than chinese Kung Fu movies, but the martial arts are very well done. Also, the guy who plays the main character is crazy sick.

Rikki O (The story of Rikki) is totally over the top, and crazy. I don’t know if it counts as a Kung Fu movie, but it’s one of the funniest movies I’ve ever seen. Everyone I know who has seen the movie laughs their ass off. Like I said though, it’s value lies in the sheer insanity of the movie. (also contains crazy graphic “violence”… in quotes because it’s so ridiculous)

Given you’re a Jackie Chan fan, I assume you have Drunken Master, which I think is probably his best movie.

If you like Chow Yun Fat movies, I assume you’ve seen Hard Boiled… if not, it’s required viewing if you are into the Hong Kong gunfight genre.

If you like chinese dramas, I highly recommend Red Cliff… loosely based upon the battle of Red Cliffs at the end of the Han Dynasty… Very cool, epic style movie.

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Thanks for the recommendations, Timex, it’s much appreciated.

I don’t know why I haven’t already ordered Ip Man 2, given that I really liked the first one. It’s now on my list.

I already have Drunken Master, and I think it’s awesome, too. Are you talking about The Legend of the Drunken Master, though? Just curious, since most people seem to prefer that one (it’s awesome, too, of course).

I have Ong Bak, as well, although I don’t have the sequels. I’d gotten the impression that they aren’t very good, but maybe that’s mistaken?

Concerning Story of Rikki, it sounds like something I might enjoy, and I’d be interested in getting it, but it seems to be one of those hard-to-find movies. Actually, doing a search on amazon yields Debbie Does Dallas, at the top of the results list. :D

I have seen Hard Boiled, but it’s been a long time, back when my local Blockbuster mysteriously stocked a few Hong Kong movies. Maybe I should get that one, too, since I don’t remember anything about it (apart from Chow being hard-boiled, of course).

I’m not sure about Red Cliff. I’ve actually been looking at that one before, since I’m a fan of Romance of the Three Kingdoms, but I’m afraid it’s too much in the vein of Crouching Tiger and Hero. Maybe I should check it out, after all. (edit: wtf? It seems that the “international version” is only about half the length of the “original version”, which clocks in at 286:39.)

Thanks again, and keep’em coming, please. :)

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For old time goodness, try Five Deadly Venoms, though I don’t believe it’s available in Region 2. I only ever saw it on broadcast TV a long time ago.

Oh yeah, there was a sequel by someone else some years later that’s totally godawful, stay away.

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Another +1 for Hard Boiled. That thing he does with the mixer can in the opening credits is worth the price of admission.

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While is was probably in one of those other Kung fu threads, I really enjoyed The 36th chamber of shaolin. It is a classic shaw brothers kung fu movie of the late 78. Most people have probably seen it but if you haven’t, check it out!

Ipman is great, I don’t think Ip man 2 is as good but still worth it for that some pretty awesome fight scenes. What about other stuff with Donnie Yen, I picked up SPL (or Killzone) but despite a handful of neat and super fast fights, I found it mostly to be a boring blah melodrama. Although I’m interested in checking out Flash point.

Not a great one, more of a personal favourite is Fulltime Killer a silly assassin vs assassin movie by Johnnie To.

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If I recall, “Legend of the Drunken Master” is actually the sequel to Drunken Master. I prefer the original one. I found the kung fu better done, and certain aspects of it just cracked me up. The fact that the big fight ends, and all the guys are like, “Yeah!” and then it’s just like, “THE END” cracked me up for some reason too.

I have Ong Bak, as well, although I don’t have the sequels. I’d gotten the impression that they aren’t very good, but maybe that’s mistaken?

I’m actually in the opposite boat. I’ve ONLY seen the second and third ones, I think. I found them entertaining. The story line didn’t really make much sense, but the fighting was pretty bad ass.

Concerning Story of Rikki, it sounds like something I might enjoy, and I’d be interested in getting it, but it seems to be one of those hard-to-find movies. Actually, doing a search on amazon yields Debbie Does Dallas, at the top of the results list. :D

Ya, that about sums it up. It’s the most over the top movie I’ve ever seen. Since it’s impossible to spoil a movie like that, here’s my favorite part of the movie… The guy has all the tendons in his arm cut, so he then proceeds to tie them back together with his other hand and his teeth. Then goes on fighting like nothing happened.

Also, the main villain is an evil prison warden with a fake eye. Also, he keeps mints in his fake eye.

The entire movie is just filled with crazy ass stuff like that.

I believe that you can get the DVD from Netflix, although I don’t think they have it available for download. I often wonder why, since it seems like you could buy the rights to it for a song… given the production values are so incredibly low.

Be advised though, it definitely fits into the category of “cult classic”. It’s, by no stretch of the imagination, a good movie.

I’m not sure about Red Cliff. I’ve actually been looking at that one before, since I’m a fan of Romance of the Three Kingdoms, but I’m afraid it’s too much in the vein of Crouching Tiger and Hero. Maybe I should check it out, after all. (edit: wtf? It seems that the “international version” is only about half the length of the “original version”, which clocks in at 286:39.)

Ya, it was a pretty damn long movie.

It’s not at all like Crouching Tiger, Hidden dragon, at least in my opinion. Almost all the fighting is huge, ancient china style military campaigns.

I’m trying to think of a movie to compare it to, but I can’t really think of any. There’s definitely cool fighting, but it’s not your average kung fu movie. Like I said, it’s mainly about this one particular military campaign that actually happened around the end of the Han dynasty.

Also, I hadn’t thought to mention it since they’re Japanese, but a lot of Kurosawa’s stuff kind of is similar to this genre in that there are some cool fight scenes… although they’re fighting with swords that cut people in half, so there’s not the normal back and forth that you often see in many kung fu movies… it’s more like, “This one super bad ass guy kills a million other guys, but maybe they finally get him through sheer numbers.”

If you haven’t seen his movies, the ones I would recommend would be Yojimbo, and probably the Seven Samurai. The movies themselves are pure masterpieces just from a cinematographic point of view. If you liked a Fist Full of Dollars with Eastwood, it’s basically the plot from Yojimbo… Also, the main character in Yojimbo is this badass actor, who is effectively equally badass to Clint Eastwood, which is quite a feat.

Like I said, different from Kung Fu, but they popped into my head and are worth seeing if you haven’t.

One thing that I’ve found, is that obscure kung fu movies is one thing that Netflix is awesome for… pay 8 bucks a month, and get access to download a massive set of kung fu, including most of the movies mentioned here… Tons of old-school movies, like they used to show on TV on shows like “Kung Fu Theater”, which I loved as a kid.

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You’ll probably hate it since it’s kind of long and boring to most but I have to support Wong Kar-Wai. So I’ll recommend Ashes of Time.

As for Red Cliff. It’s probably worth checking out but I found that a tad boring. Maybe if I was Chinese or a Chinese History major I would’ve enjoyed it more. I knew a bit of the background but it a lot of it was lost on me.

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I’ll add Fearless and Legend of the Fist: The Return of Chen Zhen to the list. Both hard-hitting modern Kung Fu movies, with the usual touch of Chinese jingoism.

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There’s a lot of the best stuff in your original list, to be honest.

I’d mainly add Snake in the Eagle’s Shadow for classic Jackie Chan (I assume you have Police Story etc). Fist of Legend and The Legend (aka Fong Sai Yuk) for Jet Li. The former is a remake of Bruce Lee’s Fist of Fury and has an amazing final fight. Also Magnificent Butcher with Sammo Hung.

If you like A Better Tomorrow and Hard Boiled, I’d suggest looking over the sea to Japan and Takeshi Kitano’s back catalogue - Sonatine, Violent Cop, Boiling Point, Hana-bi. There’s a bit less emphasis on stylised gunplay than with John Woo, but otherwise somewhat similar themes and a very quirky sense of humour.

I have Ong Bak, as well, although I don’t have the sequels. I’d gotten the impression that they aren’t very good, but maybe that’s mistaken?

Can’t speak for the third one but I’ve seen the first two and it goes way downhill after the first.

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Have you seen the recent Kitano movie Outrage? Is it any good?

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Not yet, no.

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And, oops, obviously it should be Takeshi, not Kateshi.

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As luck would have it, there’s a region 1 version available for cheap on amazon.co.uk, so I think I’ll grab that. The sequel’s there, too, but I guess I’ll skip it, per your advice.

I actually already ordered 36th Chamber a few weeks ago, but they don’t have it in stock, so I haven’t gotten it yet. Hopefully, they’ll send it soon. I might check out some of the other Donnie Yen movies, since Ip Man was great. I’m not sure which ones to go for, though, but I guess I’ll sidestep SPL.

Thanks again for the recommendations. I actually already have most of Kurosawas stuff. And while I would love to check out some of the movies you’re talking about on netfllix, we don’t have that in Europe, I’m afraid, so I’m stuck with ordering the dvds. Not that I mind, really, as long as I order from somewhere within Europe, since customs can easily triple the price of a dvd ordered from outside of Europe.

I guess I’ll see if I can track down Red Cliff, then. As for Ashes of Time, I watched the trailer, and it really does look boring. :)

Man, this is one thing that annoys me greatly about Hong Kong movies: there are 4 versions of Fearless, and almost all of the ones released in the west are shorter (which, I always assume, means inferior). There’s a region 1 directors cut, though, so I’ll see if I can track that down.

For an example of how IMDB mistreats the genre, take a look at the connections page for Legend of the Fist: The Return of Chen Zhen. Apparantly, it’s a remake of Fearless, Fist of Fury (to which it’s also a sequel), Fist of Legend and The Chinese Connection. Can that really be right?

I’m sad to hear that most of the good stuff is already on the list. Surely, there must be more. :)

I already have Snake in the Eagle’s Shadow. It’s awesome, although somewhat similar to Drunken Master, storywise. I have the Police Story films, too.

Fist of Legend is in the mail. I’d love to check out Legend, but everything available in the west is the shorter international version. Only the Hong Kong and Japanese releases have the original. I guess I should just get it anyway, but I’m a bit anal about this stuff. :)

Regarding Magnificent Butcher, could you elaborate a bit? Is it really good? I’m asking because I always found Sammo Hung to be a bit out of place. He’s kind of Chubby, and I wasn’t particularly impressed by his Kung Fu, the few times I’ve seen it. Maybe I’m just being unfair, and should give him a proper chance?

Thanks again, everyone. I knew I could count on qt3 to give me some advice. If anyone has more suggestions, please bring them on. :)

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Fist of Legend is in the mail. I’d love to check out Legend, but everything available in the west is the shorter international version. Only the Hong Kong and Japanese releases have the original. I guess I should just get it anyway, but I’m a bit anal about this stuff. :)

Have you tried PlayAsia.com? I’ve bought DVDs and games from them (I’m UK based) and not had particularly bad customs problems.

I’m sad to hear that most of the good stuff is already on the list. Surely, there must be more. :)

There is plenty more, but at least for my tastes, the stuff on your list covers most of the very best. Apart from a conspicuous absence of Bruce Lee.

Regarding Magnificent Butcher, could you elaborate a bit? Is it really good? I’m asking because I always found Sammo Hung to be a bit out of place. He’s kind of Chubby, and I wasn’t particularly impressed by his Kung Fu, the few times I’ve seen it. Maybe I’m just being unfair, and should give him a proper chance?

Yes, it is really good, and the supporting cast is great, especially Yuen Biao, so it’s not just Sammo. The kung fu has a lot of the prop-based slapstick of a mid-period Jackie Chan film, but also old-school, amazingly choreographed grounded fighting.

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I just checked, and it seems that the HK version of The Legend is OOP, sadly. :(

Thanks for the tip on Magnificent Butcher, though. I’ll give it a shot.

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A number of Jet Li movies from the nineties, that in style and presentation are comparable to Iron Monkey.
Twin Warriors, two Shaolin monks get kicked out of shaolin, one turns bad. The movie that got me hooked on Kung Fu movies.
Fong Sai yuk I and II. Lighthearted, especially the second one. The first one is a little lower on the action.
The Evil Cult/Lords of Wutang. Breakneck paced adaptation of a Yin Jong novel. Terribly confusing if you don’t know the story.
Legend of the Red Dragon. Decent but with the added annoyance of a couple of plucky children.
Fist of Legend. Lacks some of the levity of the other Jet Li movies.
China Swordsman II Features Brigitte Lin as the worlds most powerfull transvestite, ninjas.

Stephen Chow who made Shaolin Soccer and Kung fu hustle have a number of movies under his belt, many of which are parodies of HONG Kong genre movies. Of the top of my head these two are enjoyable.
God of Cookery Very silly, not that much kung fu, but certainly entertaining.
Forbidden City Cop Is entertaining, as I recall. Has recieved a recent makeover.

Others
The Bride with White Hair Not exactly humorous, but certainly over the top. With Brigitte Lin.
The New Dragon Gate Inn. A remake of an older movie I havent seen. A kung fu ensemble cast including Tony Leung, Donnie Yen, Brigitte Lin and Magie Chung. In the same vein and from the same era as Iron Monkey and Twin Warriors.

Edit:
Butterfly Sword Butterfly sword is very entertaining as well, especially the end fight. The whole film is on youtube if you want to sample. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_z3qUXNtbJE&feature=player_detailpage#t=155s

Heroic Trio Is also a blast. Three kung fu superheroes battles an ancient evil, like many chinese ancient evils this ancient evil is an eunuch.

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Here to re-iterate Fong Sai Yuk 1 and 2. I think they definitely fit in what you are asking for.

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The New Dragon Gate Inn. A remake of an older movie I havent seen. A kung fu ensemble cast including Tony Leung, Donnie Yen, Brigitte Lin and Magie Chung. In the same vein and from the same era as Iron Monkey and Twin Warriors.

Kind of, but it is also properly mental.

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For something so over-the-top it’s funny, check out Lone Wolf and Cub. There’s a bunch of them, but I think Tarantino smashed a few together into a coherent 90 minute film. It’s Japanese ultra-violence by way of samurai.