Wouldn’t that be a chainsword?
I think it was more of a technical discussion (in the field of narrative and dramatics) that got messed up in the genre wars, with all the usual drama that involves.
First, the Heroof the story (in a hero’s journey sense) is Furiosa. If you don’t subscribe to the hero’s journey lens (I don’t) you can usually see who the hero of the story is by watching who the antagonist is opposing (if there’s an antagonist). In this story the antagonist is clear (it’s the clearer role) and his fight has nothing to do with Max escaping, but with thwarting Furiosa’s plan. The fact that is Furiosa who
end
kills the antagonist
also makes a strong case for her to be the Hero of the story.
The POVof the story is harder to grasp. For a lot of time, it’s Max, but for some very important events it’s not (Furiosa’s escape, the moment he goes to kill the guy Furiosa blinded -and we remain with the women). However, yes, like in other Mad Max movies, Max remains the main POV character/audience surrogate, regardless of his dramatic role on the story (POV is a narrative issue, while protagonism is a dramatic issue).
So now the question remains of who the story is about (which is the easiest way to describe a protagonist). I think it can be strongly argued that the story is about Furiosa’s struggle to find a place for these women in the wasteland first, and about Max’s journey of redemption second. In that case, Furiosa would be the Hero and protagonist, while Max would be a supporting POV and a deuteragonist. However, this part of this analysis is muddy (in part, I think, because of the expectations of contemporary moviegoers when they go to see an action film named after a character) and I can see other alternative analyses holding their ground.
The interesting thing (regardless of the genre of the characters) is that this is a very interesting dramatic structure, much more complex than traditional Hollywood fare and a big part of why I found the movie fascinating.
(sorry for all the TVtropes links, but I always found that site a great place to point to condensed, easy to understand, narrative and dramatic theory issues -some of the sources are pretty dense- :P )
I feel Road Warrior has similar dramatic structure. The story is that of the refinery community and gasoline and their attempt to escape the wasteland and Lord Humungus. Max is just a POV along for the ride and provides them with assistance (and grudgingly at that). The only thing Max added that they were not going to do themselves, was give them access to the rig.
Yeah, I think starting with Mad Max 2, the character became an excuse to explore other people in the same world while still maintaining a franchise (that certainly makes the movies easier to fund). It’s kind of clever, really, and unusual.
I think most of the negative reactions to the structure came from people who either didn’t remember the old movies or hadn’t watched them.
Also, I don’t remember the Road Warrior that well, but was there a Furiosa equivalent in that movie (that is, a character who clearly is the Hero of the story)? I remember some characters, but not such a central one (it’s been ages)…
I guess maybe you could make a case that the feral kid is the Furiosa analog in Road Warrior, since you find out at the end that he was the narrator of the movie. But it’s kind of a stretch.
I saw that, right now the site to get tickets is SO weird. For example, there’s one theater near me that has a Faux-Max (not real IMAX, but headed in that direction) showing on Friday night, and then that’s IT for the rest of the week.
I just watched this last night on Blu-ray and loved it. An amazing spectacle, and moving story.
I was going to buy the blu-ray, but then thisreview on Amazon points out that they left off two versions of what was mentioned by Miller - totally B&W and no-dialogue versions. So I’m opting to wait & buy those later. I’ll just netflix it while I wait.
Same, I saw they dropped the price and almost bit on it, but I don’t want a bare bones release of it.
This was an amazingly good movie for a “mindless” action flick that wasn’t really mindless at all, despite the trivial amount of dialogue. I actually watched it twice during my Amazon rental, which is a first for me.
I was going to take my sister to see the IMAX release—she had been looking forward to seeing it in theaters, but thanks to some weddings in the family, the timing didn’t work out—but the nearest theater to us (in Pittsburgh) was in Columbus (three hours away), and that’s sold out. Everything else is at least a 4-5 hour drive.
Ya, the main story framework of this movie was basically the same as the Roadwarrior… Max is a major character, but it’s not “all about Max”.
So the plot of this movie really didn’t strike me as “not Max centric enough”.
Max has a much bigger role in Road Warrior.
Personally, I wish this wasn’t a “Mad Max” movie at all - just a movie set in the same universe. There was essentially nothing gained by recasting Max as opposed to making Tom Hardy a different character, and clearly Miller wanted to tell Furiosa’s story as much as anything.
Max’s story was already done, really after Road Warrior. Let Gibson remain as Max and just feature new characters, and that way renders complaints about different characters having larger/smaller roles toothless, because Miller is free to just tell the story he wants to tell, without the distraction of dealing with the audience’s expectations or preconceptions for previously used characters.
I think Max is there (and will be in the sequel) due to marketing constraints. The first planned sequel was going to be called Furiosa, so this movie was apparently a protagonist switch. But that plan seems to be no more now that the movie was a success.
I’m not sure that Miller had the pull to get an “Imperator Furiosa” movie made with the budget and marketing that this movie got. As it was, this was a struggle.
Yeah, that makes sense.
That is a great point, even though Telefrog’s totally right about the the Max “branding” being a necessary component of getting this produced and getting audiences out to see it. But I honestly don’t mind if Miller never makes another movie in this universe. This was such an ingenious standalone story. It didn’t feel like one in a series and it sure didn’t feel like the usual origin story. That’s part of its brilliance. It didn’t need hooks in front and it didn’t leave threads dangling behind.
So as unlikely as it is, I’d love to see Miller veer off into whatever new direction he wants to go with his next movie. Remember, this is the guy who did three Mad Max movies and then made a sweet story about a loveable talking pig!
-Tom
I painfully and with a broken heart submit that Imperator Furiosa will be a bigger feminist icon than Wonder Woman in the next 3 years.
Yeah, I wish he had freedom to do whatever crazy stuff he wants to. It’s a pity he seems to have gone from needing a franchise to market the movie, to having revived the franchise so strongly he can’t really veer from the formula too much anymore (by judging at rumors about the development of the sequel).
But hey, apparently he’s good at taking a formula and doing whatever he wants with it anyways, so let’s see!