Nintendo finally reveals the Switch console

Games
1828

If its true that it requires a big patch to play then Nintendo owes it to their customers to curtail 3rd parties from doing this. When you ship a console with limited on board memory you need to put policy in place to protect little timmy or his parents from having to go into the settings and manage data. Especially if the reason is manufacturing costs. Nintendo should eat the cost delta between BD and switch cartridges if need be.

I say all this knowing that its Nintendo and they will not do a damned thing.

1829

Yeah it’s a tough spot for Nintendo. If they disallow this they’re looking out for their customers but if they don’t they may lose out on a third party game at a time when they really need to fill the gap between first party titles. They just don’t seem to be in a position to turn publishers away.

1830

I doubt it. All media in Switch is solid state (internal, cart, and sd card) so loading time improvements would be negligible.

Warner Brothers has said there is no download when you buy the physical version, so likely the box is in error. And they’ve done something to shave off 12GB of data for Switch… maybe re-encode the cutscenes?

1831

This is what WB told IGN:

[quote]
Players who purchase LEGO City: Undercover on Nintendo Switch at retail do not need to download the game to play. All players who purchase the game can download the small content update patch with an internet connection.[/quote]

Maybe they consider 13GB a “small” update? IGN asked for clarification which hasn’t come yet.

It’s really funny how WB can’t seem to be clear about this.

1832

A “content” update patch certainly sounds like a bunch of stuff isn’t on the cart, and needs to be downloaded. I doubt it’s new content they’ve added to the game since cartridge manufacture…

Yes, as much as I try to be charitable and not leap to conclusions it does have the whiff of spin/obfuscation.

1833

I think it was Digitalfoundry that did a comparison on load times for Zelda. Internal was the fastest. Two tested brands of SIM card were neck and neck just behind internal memory. Loading from the cart lagged behind by a noticeable 5 seconds. I’m not sure how this plays into mixed storage like Lego, but it was enough to get me to research Nintendo’s updated digital rights management policy. Load times, semi-friendly (or at least not evil) DRM updates, and the desire to not have to swap media from the couch or on trips all caused me to 180 on digital versus physical for the Switch. Hybrid multi-gig installs such as Lego further push me that direction.

1834

Yeah the internal is fastest for sure, but the DF tests showed 5 second lag in one instance, in one game. I think the average across the 6 tests was closer to a 3 second improvement on a 25 second load time.

Which to my mind is negligible, compared to the difference between a disc and hd/internal install on Wii-U, and not something that should drive the Lego game to decide to split its data.

1835

I wish every 3rd party title came out on the switch. Its such a game changer for me to not take over the tv with my video games or crawl into my safe space to play on my computer. I love being able to sit next to my wife and play something on the switch while passively watching whatever is on the tv with her. Its how I want to play any and all RPGs in the future.

1836

What’s stated on the box is incorrect:

The information is listed incorrectly on the packaging of Lego City Undercover for Nintendo Switch. Players who purchase a physical copy of LEGO City Undercover on Nintendo Switch at retail are getting the complete game, and do not need to download additional content to enjoy the full experience.

“An internet connection is not required to play the game. The only internet connection suggested is to download the typical content update patch.”

1837

Still doesn’t explain the mystery of the missing 12GB!

1838

Data stored more efficiently and with less repetition, better compression, other, … Who knows.

You’d hope they got their story straight by now and no 12GB download is required. We’ll soon know.

1839

Took them long enough!

1840

I would have to assume that they have that written on all of the retail boxes (xbone, ps4) and for some reason forgot to remove it from the switch.

1841

Down-sampled assets?

1842

Anyone looking for a second game for their dubiously labeled “Zelda machine”, might want to take a look at Has Been Heroes. It’s a meaty rogue like with a cell phone app facade, but has been (no pun intended) a lot of fun so far.

1843
1844

Re: Has-Been Heroes, I am the target market for such a game, and was super stoked to pick this up.

Problem is, it has… well… problems.

It’s hard. Punishingly hard. Like “make no discernible progress” hard. It has an ‘innovative’ control scheme, though in practice its originality also translates somewhat to frustration.

It’s a game where you have to fully wrap your head around its mechanics AND control scheme, both of which are unintuitive, in order to make progress.

I have yet to hear from anyone who’s beaten the first 2-map adventure, or to unlock a new character to rotate into the mix. The game teases you with 25-or-so characters, yet in 2-3 hours of play I have yet to figure out how to unlock a single new one.

It’s a shame, as I want to like it. And I’ve kept putting in ‘one more playthrough’, not because I’m having so much fun, but because I’m determined to figure out what I’m missing. But at a certain point, that becomes a fool’s errand. There’s only so many times I can lose an entire run from a single mispressed button or 1-second fumble of its unintuitive controls.

The game is averaging a 50 for Switch on Metacritic (I know, I know), with most reviews echoing my own experiences. I only cite that to invoke caveat emptor – this is not a safe purchase for just anyone.

I’m curious if your own fun holds up beyond a short period of time. I’ve made it to the second boss a couple of times, but didn’t feel anywhere near being able to beat it.

1845

Scott, I think they are a victim of expecting players to figure everything out on their own, to give them the discovery of that. It’s a puzzle game that isn’t really presented as such. I think most people playing it don’t understand that’s what they are doing, and are understandably frustrated.

I don’t have it yet, but I have watched a ton of video. I’ve seen 2 different streamers with 9 characters unlocked (and there aren’t that many streamers, really). Seriously, if you think what you’ve seen so far is punishingly hard, it gets positively insane later.

1846

Since I picked up Has Been Heroes, I haven’t been able to put it down. Just last night I beat the Ice Pirate (the boss, not the movie-- nobody can beat Ice Pirates) which means I have to make it through 5 or 6 maps and mini-bosses to get there. These are all seeded with much nastier critters than originally at this point, and I start from scratch each time. Currently, I feel almost no threat until map 4 or so. So yeah, I am still digging it, but you’re right, it is a game that requires learning.

I think a lot of folks are used to “hard” games like Souls-likes or rogue-lites. Sure, they are hard, but they also let the player trickle in power advancement so even if a player doesn’t adapt much, brute force combined with repetition will eventually win the day. In a true rogue-like, progression is the antithesis and advancement is tracked in learning the game and mitigating randomness in the unknown.

Even if they don’t know it, I believe this is the core of the issue many players have with HBH. There seems to be a really common curve of frustration, to initial understanding, back to frustration, to it “clicking”, and then finally to really digging the game. A lot of folks jump ship at the first level of frustration. I expect this is mostly because HBH is a rogue-like, not a rogue-lite (such as Rogue Legacy or other progression games).

And not to brag or anything (really), but HBH is not that bad. I cleared the first pirate on my very first play of the game. I play on a controller and find the top, middle, and bottom lane buttons with an attack and pause button pretty natural even from the start. The only hiccups I had was figuring out how to examine inventory items (push left stick in) and becoming fluid with manipulating position on all three lanes on every attack action.

Now when I play it is a rhythmic calm as I watch for backstabs (moving back through enemies at lane return), where to apply elemental damage, decide where and when to apply crit through stamina bars, plan over-strike to rotate lanes, and so forth.

I made a thread for the game. If you have questions, please ask. There is a really good YouTube video posted in it as well. It’s a very, very good game. But it helps if you know the genre and are up for that kind of game.

1847

I have 7 characters now, and yeah, it starts getting crazy. And they are not necessarily better as you go, they just combine differently into compliments or party builds. I like the first two unlocked characters the most I think.