Tariff like it's 1897


#421

Thats the thing, they are forgetting about an entire market segment with money, that of the elderly 70+ who still need vehicles that do not have a step up height to get into.


#422

Shit, try stepping into a Hemi Ram as a pregnant woman. Not that this specific example was inspired by watching my wife do so last week. Ok, yeah it is.


#423

Didn’t we already go through this around 2008 when gas prices went through the roof and they got murdered because they were mostly cranking out civilian tanks?


#424

Yes!!

Fucking idiots. Let them go out of business next time.


#425

Aren’t trucks Ford’s biggest seller, or at least it’s biggest money maker?


#426

Yes, but the Fusion in particular was a very strong seller. And it gives them a wider spread to cover changes in the market. If gas prices rocketed again, then what? By cutting out those lines it makes it far harder to respond.

It’s short term stupidity. While there is no doubt some percentage of buyers who will buy an F series instead of a Fusion, I have no doubt they lose far more in sales than they make up for in increased margins.

There is some sense in consolidating to strengths. But there is also sense in diversifying. Going all in on trucks is really far too much of the latter, and I sincerely hope it costs them.


#427

In my part of the world there are one hell of a lot of trucks on the road. Now I would expect the opposite in LA and probably people with no car in SF, but trucks as a whole are a pretty big market, selling new from $25k to $65K.


#428

Sure, but people who don’t buy trucks aren’t going to start buying trucks suddenly in most cases.

And when gas prices jump again, people tend to not buy trucks. I said back when they first announced it that it was a bad idea. We went through this exact same scenario about a decade ago and it didn’t go that great for them. I feel like this time they’re doing it and banking on the government to bail them out if it really goes south again, since that precedent has been set.


#429

Aren’t the lower/level gas prices of the last few years a sign that maybe the economy isn’t doing as well as some would have us believe?


#430

Probably. Then again I’ve never thought it was going all that well.


#431

I mean one could argue (and I do) that the main reason Ford didn’t need bailout money is because their car lines were better quality and sold better than GM and Dodge. The Focus and Fusion would be, to me, the primary reason why they were relatively better off during the crisis.

Dodge nearly did, and probably should have, gone out of business completely. So dependent on gas guzzlers and their sedans so craptastic at the time.


#432

I’d argue the same. Which is why seeing them do it makes me think they’re banking on Uncle Sam coming to the rescue again, this time they’re just gonna get in on it. Makes sense if you don’t give a shit about anything other than stock prices. Might as well let the government assume the risk and maximize your profits.


#433

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I couldn’t find a longer term sales chart, but there is a pretty clear trend away from sedans and too SUVs and trucks. There is a strong utility function for both vehicles, especially trucks in rural regions and SUVs for families.
I personally have never owned either one, but most of my friends swear by one or the other.

I understand that automakers in the US have capacity to produce 10 million units/year of sedans and yet Americans are only buying less than 6 million. It is kinda of strange there is such an emotional attachment to car makers getting rid of models. Plenty of computer companies got out of making desktops, in favor of tablets and laptops and there wasn’t a big deal.


#434

Car people can’t build their own cars from parts either.

If Alienware disappeared tomorrow, I wouldn’t even notice because I can make my own system with parts.
If Ford disappeared tomorrow, I can’t build a new/repair my car with parts from random vendors.


#435

This is a very strange analogy (that you didn’t come up with, granted) but you realize you’re an extreme outlier in terms of being able to build your own computer. If Lenovo stopped making desktop computers, most of their existing customers wouldn’t build their own, they’d buy a Dell. Someone’s always going to make a sedan; car companies make wagons and manuals even though those are becoming incredibly niche.

I also don’t see why we (as a whole) would specifically want GM to make sedans, if Honda or Kia is happy to pick up the slack.


#436

Kit cars are a thing, though they’re a lot harder to assemble than a computer.


#437

I’m on board with this, but only if we stop electing people who keep threatening tariffs on all kinds of foreign goods.


Even if, like many sedans, they’re actually made here.


#438

Eh, not really, at least as far as the US is concerned. It’s a function of weaker global demand and especially a combination of massively increased US production from fracking and OPEC trying to strangle said fracking


#439

Keep in mind it’s the crossover that is really drawing in sedan drivers. Old-school SUVs were built on truck platforms, which is why they got such shitty gas mileage. But crossovers are built on car platforms, so the mileage is comparable to a sedan. It’s crossover sales that have been exploding.

Also, American cars have had to overcome a terrible reputation. Sure, the later generations are a lot better, but they never really got the stigma they earned from decades of being cheap and shoddy.

When I lived in San Francisco, the parking lot was full of foreign sedans everywhere: BMW, Audi, Toyota, Honda, etc. American cars? Few and far between.


#440

I just don’t understand why they didn’t pull a Hyundai, and offer 5yrs/60k miles bumper to bumper and 100k on the power train. If they know the reliability is better why not stand behind it.

Hell even VW now offers a 6 year / 72k mile bumper to bumper warranty on all vehicles.