US hires mercenaries in New Orleans

Politics and religion
21

OK Brian, now you’ve officially gone off the deep end.

Please decide what you’re bitching about. Is it the impending corporate take-over of the US government by military means, is it the number of mercenaries in Iraq, is it the hiring of mercenaries in Louisiana, is it the relationship between security firms and the Pentagon, or is it the behavior of the mercs in Iraq?

The outfits in Iraq are doing what they’re paid to do - protect their customers. This usually means killing people. They’re not there to stabilize Iraq, they’re not there to improve relations with Iraqis, they’re there to make sure that the structure or person they’re protecting survives. Those are their objectives and they have their own rules of engagement for it, and, considering the situation in Iraq (which is not very friendly to business at the moment), they’ve got very aggressive rules of engagement.

These rules are not set by and do not take into account the Pentagon. The Pentagon runs the US armed forces, it doesn’t have shit to say to the mercenaries. The Pentagon doesn’t give a fuck about what the mercenaries are doing, because the Pentagon is involved in a military pacification of Iraq, not the politics of the White House. The White House is concerned with the economic exploitation of Iraq to pay for this fucking war, secure an oil supply for the next 50 years, and spread democracy or some shit like that. The White House permits security firms to operate as they do for that reason - mercenaries permit private companies to do business in Iraq.

Now, just because Blackwater and the dozen other companies in Iraq have rather aggressive policies and blow the heads off anyone who looks likely to fuck with them or their customers, doesn’t mean that this is the policy they’ll pursue in New Orleans. Iraq is in the middle of a guerrilla war where various fanatics are trying to disrupt the US presence their for various reasons - to drive the US out of Arabian lands, to split Iraq up so that Iran can gobble the Shi’ite part up, or simply because the many poor, stupid, brainwashed young males in the world are easily paid off to do it. New Orleans has some looters, some gangs, with only an exhausted and undermanned police force to deal with them.

Clearly, common sense would dictate that the situation in New Orleans is not nearly as tense or dangerous as the one in Iraq. Now, in contrast to you I believe that security companies comprised of former Army commanders and soldiers can assess the threat level and requirements correctly, and implement the proper rules of engagement. These rules, presumably, would also be within the constraints of American law since we’re dealing with an American state, not a foreign country which had just had its 20-year dictator removed a mere two years ago.

But that’s just me.

22

I don’t think we know. In fact, we don’t even know how many were hired in the first place - it could be just a few dozen here and there if some companies are worried about sensitive data on computers or expensive equipment being looted - or it could be hundreds used by LA or NO to supplement local police forces. There’s talk that they’ve been deputized by the governor and that they’re working for Homeland Security, but I haven’t seen this anywhere but the usual liberal suspects.

23

Oh, I’ve got two seperate but equal problems.

NO - Why the are businesses hiring mercs rather than normal security guards? Just because it makes them feel tough? “Fuck Wells Fargo, I’ve got Blackwater.” You do admit there’s a distinction, right? Now while that one British outfit’s at least claiming these guys have special training to act in this capacity the alternet article, assuming it’s true, implies that it’s the fullon asskickers from Blackwater that are there.

I haven’t seen any credible reporting, yet anyway, that any government is hiring armed mercenaries to support their regular law enforcement personnel or deputizing them. That’d be an entirely different category of stupid.

Iraq - We shouldn’t, period, be relying on unaccountable folks who get their jollies offing people in a warzone where our only victory, such as is salvagable at this point, is entirely based on the goodwill of the populace. Whether that’s White House or Pentagon or Halliburton making the call, it’s beyond moronic. We should have enough military to get the job done period. If we don’t, we should be increasing (as we are) recruitment and retention bonuses rather than paying contractors millions more that they’re just funnelling back into merc outfits for private security. In fact, a buttload of the outsourced contracting, not just military contractors, should be reassumed by the Army. Those guys are all but unaccountable and they don’t answer to the military chain of command. You need bodies to dig latrines, better not ask the guys working the Pizza Hut bunker to help out.

I don’t see why you’re in such a rush to defend this practice. It seems counterproductive and wasteful.

24

Rucker- Hiring security guards should send up warning flags? Do you head for the fallout shelter when you see a Brinks truck?

Regular military officers seemed to be annoyed that the contractors weren’t as useful to them as having, say, regular soldiers running a regular mess rather than civilians on somebody else’s payroll with only a narrow perview.

They are probably also annoyed they didn’t have ponies. Of course a private citizen in the employ of a private company is going to do his or her job instead of whatever the military wants. If the military wants otherwise, have a draft.

Also, you are have antecedent issues. “This” situation is Blackwater in New Orleans, which is neither a good nor bad situation. It’s not even really a situation.

25

In the context of New Orleans, is there really a distinction between a mercenary and a security guard. The job seems to be security, not warfighting, so no matter how big the guns they carry they are all security guard and they are all bound by the laws of the U.S. and laws of Louisiana.

I don’t have a problem with private companies hiriing mercenaries as security guards in N.O. as long as they aren’t breaking any laws.

26

Then my question is why the people who pay their wages aren’t being arrested for hiring hitmen.

27

If these guys straight came from Iraq, have military (rather than law enforcement) training, and are openly toting around submachineguns they’re not what I’d think of as “security guards”. It remains to be conclusively seen if that’s the case, sure. But it sounds like that Blackwater guy in the alternet article was a real “Charley don’t surf!” gunslinger not some retired cop.

You want that kind of character running around and trying to maintain civil order? Sure, they may be working for private businesses but guess who they’ll be interacting with. The public. Maybe they won’t think they can blow people away and laugh it off like they do in Iraq but the whole precident is a pretty fucked up one.

28

The crazy left’s mythologizing of Blackwater as uberkillers of the highest degree has to be a great source of amusement at whereever the hell Blackwater’s HQ is.

29

I’m sure their incompetent boobs who kill people, not uberkillers.

30

The their/they’re typo in the above sentence, while common and understandable, does create a very bizarre mental image.

31

Blackwater uses fembots?

32

If I had to guess, I’d guess that it’s because they want to show as much force as possible for looters, snipers, and other real/imagined threats to stay out of their buildings. According to the Interdictor’s blog (linked previously in another thread), the private security was guarding while they were pumping basements of banks and shit, not so much when Bob’s Snack Shack was rescuing the leftover bagels. If I was a bank and had a huge disaster that I’d be writing as a receipt to the insurance company anyways, I’d damn sure spend a bit more and try to sleep easier.

The above post is complete guesswork with no backup whatsoever.

33

I’ll follow up the complete guesswork with more of my own: I don’t think Wells Fargo or Pinkertons would take the job. Consider that the job involves living away from family for a month in a lawless city where the gun stores have been looted by dangerous criminals and there’s no running water, electricity or sewage. That’s probably a nice vacation for guys used to Iraq, but it’s sort of a rough camping trip for guys used to going home at the end of the day.

34

I can’t believe some of you can’t see the distinction between a paid-to-kill-people mercenary and a rent-a-cop. We don’t generally allow regular military (or mercenaries) to perform the work of police or security guards – I wonder why that is? Maybe because it’s caused problems in the past?

The mere fact that the US needs to hire mercenaries to deal with it’s problem is IMHO a dire portent.

35

Whatever Ben.

Where’s the spin here? Either they’re lying about what they saw and heard, or this is what they saw and heard. I don’t find it credible that they’re fabricating this story, and their eyewitness testimony is certainly more convincing than your head in the sand suspicions.

Seriously, I suspect that the story is the private security has been hired by private companies but were deputized to get around the firearms confiscation.

You “suspect”? Based on what? What you would like to believe?

36

The part I’m talking about, Jasper, is whether “the US” has hired anyone at all in New Orleans. So far all I have heard is “merc businesses”, to use a completely made up but understandble term, are being hired by private firms to safeguard the rescue of their own assets.

If “the US” (meaning the government) hasn’t done so, then who bloody cares? Hell the small, one story simple remote branch of Bank of America near my house has an armored and armed guard who posts outside the front door in full view of the Walmart, Safeway, and street located there.

Furthermore, there’s no evidence that I’ve heard of that any of these guys in NO are “paid to kill”, but they damn sure are paid to look the part. And I damn sure wouldn’t want “Sam’s Security” guards and their Really Big Flashlights ™ my shit if I thought there was a chance of armed looters rolling up while my $20 million business was being secured; doubly so if the whole expense would be absorbed by someone else anyways (insurance, tax write off, clever accounting, etc).

[edit: I see your post from Alternet now. That’s interesting, and if true then obviously some of my conclusions are wrong. I’m working off of stories posted by The Interdictor, so I think we can at least agree that some of the private security isn’t hired by the government. :) ]

37

Where’s the spin here? Either they’re lying about what they saw and heard, or this is what they saw and heard. I don’t find it credible that they’re fabricating this story, and their eyewitness testimony is certainly more convincing than your head in the sand suspicions.

Well, judging from the rest of the article, the authors have a finely tuned “outraged idiot” act. So the guy says he used to work for the Department of Homeland Security, or that his firm is on retainer for the Department of Homeland Security, or that he likes going to HomeTown Buffet. That gets filtered through the bias and stupidity filter that is the author(who is giving his audience exactly what they want to hear), and ta-da! Mercenaries hired to kill!

You “suspect”? Based on what? What you would like to believe?

Uh, what makes the most sense.

I can’t believe some of you can’t see the distinction between a paid-to-kill-people mercenary and a rent-a-cop. We don’t generally allow regular military (or mercenaries) to perform the work of police or security guards – I wonder why that is? Maybe because it’s caused problems in the past?

The mere fact that the US needs to hire mercenaries to deal with it’s problem is IMHO a dire portent.

  1. This paid-to-kill mercenary garbage is hyperbole. These guys are bodyguards.

  2. Uh, we do have regular military in New Orleans right now. And it isn’t because it’s “caused problems in the past” any more than any other situation where people try to do jobs they are unqualified for. Blackwater and other private security companies are most qualified to do exactly this sort of work. They aren’t robot assassins who are only programmed to kill.

  3. That’s not a fact, it’s supposition from an unsourced quote.

38

God dammit, Ben, did you even play Mercenaries?

39

I think the distinction is relevant only in your head. Yes mercs have different training and background than regular security guards, but so what? As long as they have the rules of guard duty explained to them and are following them I fail to see the problem.

It is a bit worrisome if the govt is hiring mercs because adequate regular troops are unavailable but we don’t have a good sense for whether or not that is true at this point.

40

Lets see, on the one hand you have policemen trained in due process, handling disputes, helping people, etc. On the other hand you have mercenaries without such training, and instead a focus on tactics, shooting, explosives, and probably a bit of jumpy paranoia for good measure.

Gee, who would you rather have as a policeman? Oh yah, right. No relavent distinction at all. I wonder which party is more likely to shoot a civilian with no good reason?