He got better about selling it after a while. I think I was on the front end of a string of people wanting to buy the game which lead to him making an effort to fill orders. When I emailed him to buy a copy, it took about two weeks to get a response, which was “We don’t have any copies left”. I eventually convinced him to burn a copy and sell me that for $20.
It was a riff what Sebmojo said upthread.
Bummed I missed the beta. I haven’t ever played this one and Kalle’s AAR was indeed epic. I spent too much of my workday reading that thread today. I don’t usually pay for many apps on the ipod but I’ll keep my eye out for this.
thanks for starting this tread, and thanks Jarmo for linking the AAR.
We also did a co-op forum game which unfortunately died out.
As I recall the explanation, the original KODP was built using some old, archaic development tools that are no longer functional. In other words, making a version for Steam or other DD services would require significant re-implementation the game from scratch, and the likely reward has plainly not been considered worth the effort involved (particularly considering that the original was not exactly a runaway success).
Clearly, the iPhone market was tempting enough for them to throw themselves at the reimplementation effort, though. I’m not really convinced that they’ll do better this time around (cue discussion about the viability of a <$5 market), but the argument by Dunham is that the graphics were the main cost of the original development. It’s still such a very hardcore, niche game though…
I really loved the tribe council roleplaying and the storytelling aspects of the game but the resource management making up the core of the gameplay wasn’t as appealing to me. It’s an eclectic combination, to be sure.
It’s a very different game and that’s part of it’s appeal.
One of the acknowledged problems with the game was that it was too hard. To my knowledge nobody has ever won the game on the hard level without doing the save-reload shuffle.
Take the difficulty down a notch and market it to folks used to playing games on the i-pad and it has potential.
What it doesn’t have is any real use of the motion sensors. It will look like a geeky version of Oregon trail with background art. That’s going to kill it for a large portion of the icrowd.
If that’s true it would have been a perfect candidate for GoG. Let their engineers take care of the technical problems. Or sell a DRM-free ISO version directly. As was already pointed out, it’s not like the game wasn’t pirated extensively anyway, so they’re really just walking away from money that legit customers could have given them for zero extra effort. It’s nonsense. They just don’t give a crap, which is fine (it’s theirs to do what they want with it), but there’s no legitimate explanation the “it’s too hard” argument.
I am guessing the amount of orders just wasn’t worth their time. As a programmer interested in their craft the last thing you want to do is stop and take time to fill orders in meat space; especially if you don’t have any more printed discs. You also don’t want to hand it off to somebody else for a cut because then you get less money, and it was so little to begin with. So you unprofessionally put it off because doing something else is so much more interesting.
With the app stores the cut isn’t that bad, the potential numbers are huge, and it’s ideal to take advantage of the long tail phenomenon with little effort on the developers part.
Zero extra effort? Signing deals, negotiating contracts, lawyer interactions with GoG, all for $100* a month? F’ that. I am not saying any of that is hard, but it’s boring and easily put off.
- Obviously i pulled that number completely out of my arse.
How is “less money” worth less than zero money? It’s still money.
If the IP is really that worthless just sell ISO downloads. Setting up an online store for something like that is trivial.
Zero extra effort? Signing deals, negotiating contracts, lawyer interactions with GoG, all for $100* a month? F’ that. I am not saying any of that is hard, but it’s boring and easily put off.
I suppose, but again I can’t understand why they’re so protective of IP that apparently has no value to them. One of the main reasons the game withered on the vine was lack of exposure, and putting it up on places like GoG that have built-in audiences willing to pay cash for archaic games at least gets it out there and talked about by more people.
By that logic, have at: Amazon Mechanical Turk
Hopefully you now understand how small amounts of money can be worse than no money due to time having a non-zero monetary value.
This all assumes they would make small amounts of money from it. The way they have it set up now guarantees that, but none of us could say what would happen if they made it easier to get the game and gave it more exposure.
And once again, if making small amounts of money is so terribly awful why not just release it as freeware with no support? If selling it is such a burden, why sell it at all?
@tntjarks Thinking more about getting it done, but I know it will be less than the original… Thoughts?
What would you guys say to this? I can’t believe it will be a 0.99 cent game, but the frugal gamer in me doesn’t want to suggest more than 4.99 USD.
(this is quoted from the @kingdragonpass twitter.)
I’d happily pay $20 for KoDP on my iPad. I doubt that’s the best price point for them, though.
I guess the combined answer would be that it would take effort and they didn’t think the money justified the effort. Which is plausible. Especially if they are lazy about it and it was supposed to be a one off project that just kinda got forgotten.
I can tell you for certain we have dozens of those at our office; I finished a couple of scripts that cut my workload and those of some other folks enormously that had been laying around untouched for years. No idea why, but it happens.
Somehow I’ve ended up in the beta. Despite being rejected the first time. I’ll let you lot know how it goes.
edit: OH HOLY SHIT, it has the most rock opera intro screen I have ever seen. Instant Heavy Metal flashbacks.
editx2: The art is all Heavy Metal style, I’ve got a femboner for this one despite being a man. I haven’t even gotten to the game yet.
editx3: The beginning is all questions, there’s no indication that it’s choices and I’m at a bar so I’m a little drunk and confused. I clicked some random text and it moved me on, which was the indication that perhaps I should pay more attention to what I’m clicking.
editx4: Picking all options that include Pella the Pottery Goddess, because the name and occupation reminds me of Ptah, God of Workers, my favorite Egyptian deity.
editx5: My ancient enemy is the God of the Elves, because I HATE ELVES WITH THE BURNY BURNING PASSION OF A THOUSAND BURNY SUNS.
editx6: There’s this armageddon scenario, and then a line that says: “the world stagnated and died”. All I can think is “yeah, because you guys refused to sell disks you turds!”
editx7: Pella the Pottery Goddess is not a long term option =(
I picked Urlada the Cow Goddess, because <3 Cow.
editx8: Apparently Dragons ate everyone in Dragon Pass. Including Kalle. Good thing I chose F U DRAGONZ.
I’m done listing edits. This is edit alot, as are all subsequent edits. If you don’t know what the alot is, you’re missing out on the best blog on the intarwebs. Anyway we’re apparently reconsidering Dragon Pass because some Pharaoh is like I RULEZ YOU. Screw dat. Oh shit we have decided to move to Dragon Pass.
Dear Tribe, Everyone who went there got et. This plan is fucking stupid. Love, Aeon.
Apparently you can click on pictures to view them, which makes the text disappear. Click the pic again and it comes back. That right there? That’s what we call craft. Loving the attention to detail little stuff like that shows.
I’ve been offered a choice about how much land my clan claimed. We claimed huge tracts. Why? Because we did. Neener neener. If we lose it, who cares, at least we had huge tracts. Suck it other tribes.
After a seemingly endless number of text based choices, I’m offered the chance to name my clan. Obviously I write Quarterlings Reborn.
The game has mentioned my huge tracts of land multiple times now. I am beginning to think it may have been a mistake. On the other hand, you can’t very well shove a Python reference in my face and not expect me to choose it.
Apparently I am halfway between a “Stickpicker” (does that sound gay? I don’t mind sounding gay, but I’m mildly concerned that the other tribes are homophobic) and a King. I am unsure of the importance of this.
One of my advisors tells me we haven’t done a heroquest for blahblah mcblah. Duh. Moron. I haven’t even done anything other than name the clan, who do you think I am? I mean, I am good but I can’t have done something like that yet without breaking the damn game. And, as it happens, we’re picking magic allocation at the moment, so your non sequitur is utterly useless. I bid you good day, ass!
Kulbrast offers more relevant advice about diplomacy magic, and then some other words. These words seem wise, as we own the aforementioned huge tracts of land, and are not currently the owners of huge numbers of soldiers as far as I know.
Well, a girl texted me so that’s probably it for now.
I APPROVE
Take stick-picker in the literal sense, and you’ll see it isn’t gay, just rather base menial work; anyone can pick up sticks, not everyone can be a king etc.
This game is based on the roleplaying game ‘HeroQuest’, so that’s why your people have a bonner for heroquesting, and as you will no doubt find out if you never played the PC/Mac game before, you success in the game will hinge on your ability to complete hero quests. Your chances of doing that are about 5%, if you are only going to play this while out drinking!
Even with maximum concentration, getting a hero-quest correct is pretty hard(if they haven’t changed much from the PC/Mac game), my non-spoiler tip is you have to ‘think’ like someone from pre-history. Good luck!
I think they made a good choice bringing you in, Aeon221 :) That post alone might have convinced me to purchase the game.
Was the girl text ingame, btw?
> the game will hinge on your ability to fast-app switch between the game and the GameFAQs spoilers for the hero quests.
Fixed that for you.
Oh I know stickpickers isn’t gay, I’m making fun of an odd choice of words.
So all my advisors are telling me different things. The bastards. Actually the way they’re displayed is pretty slick. There’s a little head at the bottom, and when you tap it up pops a bunch more. They rotate through when you click em, so each one tells you advice before the loop repeats. Then you click a down arrow and they all disappear, giving you back the space. You can also click on whichever one you like, and it’ll fast transition without bubbles to them and then show their bubble. Tapping and holding on the advisor pops up a ton of information about who the heck they are.
Picking quests is similarly smooth. There are little check boxes, you tap em and they grow an X. Even though they’re close together my largish fingers are clicking them with no difficulty. So that’s pretty nifty.
Magic is allocated basically randomly, and I save a point because people mention we might need a reserve. I expect to die. Tutorial stuff is handled through a green box that shows up on a different side every screen. Clicking it makes it turn into a tiny question mark, which comes back when you click it.
Now I’m at some kind of population screen. I have a little under 800 peons, with well over half of them farmers, and a good chunk of the rest children. All told, we have maybe 60 non-farmer non-children people. Some of them are nobles, some wpnthanes (I’m assuming that means weaponthanes), some craftsmen and some hunters.
Some of the job types can be clicked on, so I click on farmers. Whoops. Apparently the advisors are freaking the hell out that I might let some new people join our clan, as there happens to be a few buttons about letting people join. Most of them give me useless or insular advice, but Minara tells me we need 262 carls to tend all our cropland, and 62 herders, and that we have enough farmers as a result. Touche, Minara, but I can’t tell if you’re a dude or a chick so haHA.
edit: Then I click some E that apparently fell onto it’s back, and I’m presented with a screen. Holy crap it has a lot of what I am assuming are menus. This game is very menu driven, but I can’t get over the obvious professionalism of the design, and how much information they cram into a screen without driving me nuts. I have no idea what the hell I am doing, but the game is guiding me along fabulously. At no point am I entirely lost.
Now we’re calling in a favor. I click a word that doesn’t look like a button and am taken to a new window that shows a map. I can scroll around the map apparently, but other than seeing Quarterlings Reborn in big words I have no use for it.
But I’m here for a reason. The green box god has told me to go cowbegging from the folks who owe us one. This requires scrolling on a slightly sticky feeling thing, which I’m noting down to report as it’s the first awkward thing I’ve seen and I’ve clicked on every damn button I can find. Advisor time! I’m told by Leikan (who I’m fast learning to trust as the most reliable source of dull information) that my best amigos are the Greydogs, but the Blue Jays are twats. Varsens once again demonstrates his insular idiocy by saying that “We can survive on our own if need be”. Great answer for me on the diplo page, jerk. Androgynous Minara tells me something cryptic about men and gifts. Are you a she? I’m so lost with you.
Apparently Kulbrast is my best diplomat, which seems fine. It autopicked the best guy for the job, I approve mightily. On the emissary screen my advisors take the time to mention that WE NEED FOOD REAL BAD. Even Leikan seems more interested in food than the mission, which seems unusual but ok. In a second rare mistake, the tutorial button obscures the advisor popdown button; I was able to click it, but irritating. Considering it’s a beta and those are my biggest concerns, I’m very impressed.
After I send Kulbrast with a good chunk of the manpower and ten cows worth of goods, some chick shows up to whine about wanting a white horse. Ok. Well, no white horse here. Bastakos suggests painting one white, and tells me he’s done it before. I approve! Tapping an advisor during a quest makes the options they approve of turn blue; very helpful! I offer to save one for her next year rather than to throw her a feast, but I regret it immediately as she thanks me halfheartedly and moves on.
I get told to build a temple to Humakt, who seems something of a douchey war god. I’d rather not, because it sounds like the decorations will be atrocious. Advisors have nothing useful or humorous to say, so I go with the box.
The last thing I’ll write about is the quest that popped up after I made a decision. Apparently some unmarried chick was screwing with some “notorious poet” out in the woods, got caught and now we have to decide what to do about her betrothal. The image is a naked man running with two chicks chasing him down with pitchforks. And then there’s the chick hiding in the background under a blanket. Great picture, really well done and utterly hilarious. Also how do you become a notorious poet? I think this sounds like a great line of work!
That’s it for now.