If they’re giving WiiU owners $195 in credit, that doesn’t bode well for the price of a used WiiU for me after the Switch comes out.
Yeah, I was thinking that Gamestop must think Switch wont be super popular and people will be looking for used WiiU’s.
But you could level the same criticism at practically any game for any system. “Why did Bethesda just keep making Elder Scrolls games? I played the first Elder Scrolls, and I don’t see the point of playing more of the same.”
Bethesda doesn’t have a console that just has their games on it. I would level the same criticism at bethesda though, mostly. The elder scrolls games do lack innovation and have grown lazy. The formula seems to work, but it is disappointing they don’t react faster to things, especially when fans have been fixing them with mods for many years.
If you aren’t a mega fan of the few mega nintendo IPs, you aren’t going to be happy that nintendo has kept pumping them out over the years. The reverse is obviously true as well.
And yes, i’ve felt Nintendo’s major IPs have mostly become very same’y over the years too personally.
This is not a compelling argument. You list several sequels here where they all stick very closely to formula.
Since the Mario Party series reached double digits in 2007*, you might have a point there.
*Yes, I know MP 10 came out in 2015, but I’m counting handheld stuff too.
Reggie is a native English speaker and according to him the app may be free, but the online voice chat and game organization features are part of the paid subscription service in addition to online play itself as of fall 2017.
You can have games that follow the same formula that are still fantastic games. Depending on how broadly you define it, there hasn’t been an original game formula since…what, Katamari Damacy? The fact that (for example) Super Mario Galaxy 1 and 2 both follow the same formula doesn’t mean they’re not both incredible games. They’re actually ranked #1 and #3 on GameRankings. And 4 and 5 are Grand Theft Auto IV and V.
I just disagree with the whole premise that titles with the same characters, or with the same basic formula (like “Mario runs around in a 3D platformer”), means they aren’t fantastic games. It’s an overly simplistic criticism that is not supported by the review scores.
Some people do not like the major Nintendo first party IPs. Maybe they played them long ago and are now tired of them, maybe they are Italians offended by Mario or maybe they were just under a foul omen,
It doesn’t matter what score Mario has on metacritic if you don’t like Mario.
I agree that lack of innovation does not mean a game is not an amazing game. If you love a game and think it is almost perfect, you will obviously be happy with more of the same (as a general thought). I don’t think anyone was saying this was not possible though (although i might have missed it), just that they were tired of the Nintendo IPs.
For me, honestly, this will come down to the Virtual Console stuff. If they make me rebuy games, I think I am done. That is a bullshit way to treat your customers. They have to make those purchases last, and the Wii to Wii U just wasn’t good enough.
I mean, just imagine everytime you built a new PC, Steam would be like… hey, you want to buy stuff again? I mean, we will give you a discount, how about a dollar per game, to download them to your new PC? Yeah… come on Nintendo, get your shit together.
[quote=“Murbella, post:991, topic:126573, full:true”]I agree that lack of innovation does not mean a game is not an amazing game. If you love a game and think it is almost perfect, you will obviously be happy with more of the same (as a general thought).
[/quote]
A game can use the same characters and the same broad game category while still being innovative. Just because a game has the same name or the same general themes, that doesn’t mean it’s the same game.
Dismissing Suoer Mario Galaxy as “more of the same” because you played Super Mario Bros. is ignoring all of the innovations in the game. Elder Scrolls: Skyrim is not the same game as Elder Scrolls: Skyrim. GTA V is not the same game as the original top-down 2D GTA. Now you may say, “I don’t like mobster games so I don’t like any of the GTA games.” But you can’t accurately say, “GTA V is just a retread of the original GTA.”
Can we at least admit that it is possible for people to dislike the Mario games due to the world and/or the gameplay (which at a high level is at least somewhat similar) not being their thing?
I LOVE Super Mario Galaxy. My only complaint with is the small amount of waggle controls they added. It was otherwise a brilliant game.
But I’m not sure I’d try to sell it as innovative. It took the ideas from Mario 64 and Ratchet & Clank games (the small circular worlds that you could walk around, etc) and other platformers and combined them in a brilliant way. I would put that more in the Blizzard mold. They didn’t innovate, but they refined, and they polished, and they used those elements from different games brilliantly. I’m not sure why you’re so focused on calling them innovative though.
You sure about that, chief?
Autocorrect! Of course I typed “Arena”!
I bought a Wii U and most of the first-party games last time. I got my money’s worth but it looks like I’m sitting out the Switch.
Hmmm, no bonus credit at Game for trading in the Wii-U, yet, but at £85 base credit I’m actually somewhat tempted, especially if I can get a decent amount for the games (unlikely). CeX is offering £105 credit, but no sign of the Switch.
I do, in fact, level the same criticism at Bethesda. I don’t bother playing their games anymore because they never really feel new, just kinda updating the same thing. I’m quite sure I have commented to that end in Bethesda related threads. And they are not the only ones. Assassins Creed was amazing…then endless. Same with CoD and many others.
Since Nintendo releases consoles they make a bigger splash and I think the criticism becomes mire visible as such. Plus since Nintendo requires an upfront cost of hardware the value proposition is a lot different. You can’t tinker with Nintendo, you are all in or out.
And if you read my posts I’m not saying Nintendo hasn’t come up with anything new in the last 15 years, they came up with waggle. No arguing that’s not innovative, I’m just completely uninterested. That leaves a lot of, what to me, is rehashed franchises.
Also, please stop oversimplifying. We are not talking about playing one Mario or Bethesda and saying meh, it’s repetitive to have a sequel. I’m not sure how many Mario games I’ve played over the years, but it’s probably around 6-7, maybe more. I’ve also played 3 of the Elder Scrolls games and one Fallout game, and yeah that formula is getting stale. Even Souls is starting to wear thin after 5 games now. I could go on, but we could be here forever listing game franchises that I think are beating a dead horse.
I hate when people argue this sort of overly reductive position. I find it a lot in political arguments as well and it is such a lame ass way to make a point. It’s like you can’t defend a real world position so you create this extreme fictitious all or nothing scenario.
All that being said, there are always new players and what is the same old rehash to a 40 year old guy who played SMB on NES could be super new and exciting to someone much younger or just new to Nintendo. That brings me back to the beginning, where from my perspective, Nintendo just feels like they are rehashing the same games. Obviously a different person, with different experiences, could easily not feel the same way.
To draw a parallel, I am getting into Street Fighter 5. Talk about a game that has been making basically the same thing for years. But since I never really played a SF title in earnest, to me, its new and exciting. For others it may be the same old hat. I don’t think Nintendo or Street Fighter should stop making games, but I do respect that for some people these games no longer seem fresh.
Andy, you tend to try to argue your positions like they are some sort of immutable truth, but like all such things they are subjective opinions. We can debate why we have these opinions, but in the end there is really no right or wrong opinion on this sort of thing.
Elder Scrolls has been the same game since Morrowind. Zelda has not changed since Zelda 64. Call of Duty has not changed, like ever. That’s ok, people still love them.
Metroid changed and came out with Prime. Good move! Then it changed again and we got Other M. Now the franchise is dead.
Change can be good but sometimes it’s bad. I’m not sure what my point is.
What makes you say it’s the same though? When you look at these games, there are clearly differences. What has to change to make you say it qualifies as a change?